Yaw, Pitch & Roll

Ive been following this thread and trying to form an opinion on the terms. What ever terms we use need to be simple for operator and climber.Keeping in mind if it were to be published or become part of a standard everyone would need to be familiar.

I have used things like "this piece will rotate under the hook or swing to the left . A crane op would most likely understand this wether or not experienced with trees.
 
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...I have used things like "this piece will rotate under the hook or swing to the left . A crane op would most likely understand this wether or not experienced with trees.

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While I totally understand what you said, and I understand the crane operator may understand. But, what if he didn't fully understand, though he gave you "the nod" to proceed?

It still begs the question;

What does "rotate under the hook mean"? Will it yaw, will it pitch, or will it roll? My educated guess is you meant it would yaw, but I'm just guessing.

If a load swings left; Did you mean "sway"? I'm guessing that's what you meant.

If it were said, "this piece will yaw under the hook or sway to the left." We'd all know exactly what was being said the first time.

Again, I understand what you're saying totally. I'm just putting into perspective.
 
Jamin and others,

here's a big helping of imo...

I think that there's a big difference between crane jobs where the crane is rented and crane jobs where the tree company owns the crane and employs the operator. In the second case they'll probably have radio headsets, which in themselves make communication like a million times better and make everything go smooth and nice in the crane business. Plus, there's nothing like working with the same guy eveyrday to really understand each other. I think the guys who work in companies where the cranes are owned will nod their heads to this...and those kinds of situations, where the crane operator and the climber are already super-tight and can communicate by radio are situations where even more precision in language could be useful.

I mean, what's the point of y, p, and r if you're trying to signal to each other about which branch to get next, or shouting, or if you're having trouble understanding each other about something simple?

Ideally most crane work will be done by operators and climbers who work every single day together, and really understand each other, and talk like 10 hours a day to each other. That's the safest way, and in that situation the more precision the better. Bring on the y, p, r.
 
from what i heard the new anzi rules are going to it make mandatory so if you are doing work with a crane in the tree world you must have head sets. Head set are the best and safest way to do tree work hands down they are worth every penny. have been on both ends of a crane for a long time and headsets are key.
 
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from what i heard the new anzi rules are going to it make mandatory so if you are doing work with a crane in the tree world you must have head sets. Head set are the best and safest way to do tree work hands down they are worth every penny. have been on both ends of a crane for a long time and headsets are key.

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What he said!
 
Headsets mandatory? I hope not. We use them everyday but making them mandatory is totally unnecessary. I have worked efficiently and safe with and without them. That's a bad road to go down, the same argument u make for why they should be mandatory for crane work you can make for.most other tasks in tree work. Why stop at the opp climber, it would be safer if every crew member was miked up, if a climber and a ground man where miked then there would be less chance of a rigging error, and if the driver and spotter were miked up while backing a truck up that would be safer then hand signals.
recommendations are good mandatory statements go to far IMO.
 
I agree. What happens if you make headsets mandatory and you get on a job and they break in the middle of climbing?

Better hope the tree rigger knows the proper hand signals. Which brings up the point that hand signals would still have to be part of the job briefing in the event that the radios stopped working.
 
Keep in mind how different crane removals can be from company to company, job to job. Making blind picks 200' away with a 400 ton crane without radios might be a hazard , but what about all the guys with small cranes who rarely make blind picks, forcing the guy with the 12 ton boom truck who makes most of his' picks within 40' to buy headsets is unreasonable
 
I reluctantly agree with the need for mandatory use of head sets only on blind picks. That had a huge part in the turn over of that large crane last year in California. This might extend to giant trees where vocal com is impossible and even visual is greatly impared.

Recent death with the individual having his saddle pulled apart was a blind pick I think.

I have only had issues on blind picks myself and the last over the roof pick I did my op boomed out all the way with 180 foot of stick on a barkless dead elm in the back yard, was on the cell phone or something when he started torquing on a choke I had on a limb I was bucked in to after I was request just a little pre tension.

If he could have seen me he would have seen me giving the 1 finger salute....if headsets he would have heard some choice expletives that would have corrected his error.

I yelled at my gm/spotter midway to get him off the winch and he did but probably barely before it snapped off the stone dead limb I was double tied in to. Ugly noises were going on.

Whatever they decide, ANSI standards and resulting credentials are the answer IMO. Recent death in TMI mag of climber on a short climb line that ran out of line and plunged to his death last month will attest to that. Mandatory knowledge of load charts and green log charts and going beyone multiple guess tests with some field testing and logged in hours etc etc. will civilize things a bit I think.
 
I haven't heard about the climber's saddle being torn apart. Where did it happen? Another buckstrap/crane injury?

Doesn't the current standard require effective communication between the opp and climber already?
 
I think he's talking about the one you originally posted about, Marquis, in Chelmsford. Did you ever find out more about that incident?
 
Its just what i heared. im not saying i agree.do i think every guy should have head set on the job site yes. i use them all the time for landclearing jobs,log truck work whatever .
 
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You know what would be the hot set up.... a helcam with a feed into the op's cab.

Way more comfortable than the headsets to I bet.

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The technology is there. It would be a sweet idea.
 
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Its just what i heared. im not saying i agree.do i think every guy should have head set on the job site yes. i use them all the time for landclearing jobs,log truck work whatever .

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I hear u rob, we use them for everything, u and I used to use the to discuss crucial information at the bar in worcester. I just don't like the idea of making it mandatory, just seems like another fine to me written that may or may not be an actual safety issue
 
When you roll into someones yard with 500,000-1,000,000 worth of equipment, is $1500 really going to break the bank on a pair of headsets?

Im with ya Dave on us not needing any new big brother watching out for us type rules, but crane mistakes generally arent pretty, most result in major damage, and/or loss of life.

It will be interesting to see where the committees end up taking the headset issue!

production goes up with them as well, IMO.
 
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When you roll into someones yard with 500,000-1,000,000 worth of equipment, is $1500 really going to break the bank on a pair of headsets?


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Bull, you posted here about being concerned about spending too much on burned up hitch cords on your crane jobs....now you're a big spender??
grin.gif
 
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