Thoughts?

Looks like quality hedge work.






If you ask me, I‘ll get my tree advice from the king of the suburban open lawn, drive your bucket truck up with dull saws and chew out beaver cuts, medium sized-trees guy.
 
OK,
I took another look at the video on a bigger screen and re-read the thread more thoroughly. I honestly didn't see the tips hit the shed until this morning. That changes things significantly IMO, though we can't see for sure if any damage was done, there were a couple of limbs that did more than just brush the shed. Fir is very pliable and giving but there was a lot of force behind that top and it looks like it did some damage.

Looks like he gunned the top cut of the face correctly, then mis-cut the angled cut of the Humboldt, overcutting to the left. The video was edited and it doesn't show a final check of the gun, once the face is completed. That definitely should have been done. So I'm guessing he realized that the face was gunned improperly and tried to correct that with the snipe, which didn't work. There was not enough angle on the snipe and it wasn't deep enough to effect such a big top. If you watch closely, the snipe just bumped the but to the right momentarily, after the hinge broke completely (and the top was free-falling), and the but slid over the snipe. The snipe had no effect on the direction of the top. That is an interesting observation and begs a deeper conversation about the variables that affect the effects of a snipe.

My take on it is, the wider the face before the snipe, the more momentum the piece will have whent he but contacts the snipe. The more momentum of the top, the less that little bit of force you can get from a snipe will change the direction of the top. So a narrower face with a snipe will have a much greater chance of affecting the direction of fall. He may have been using the snipe as a little added insurance that the but didn't come back at him, but I think he was trying to effect the direction of fall.

I'm sure if that was the house and not the shed he would have taken the time to recut the notch to correct the gun. You can see the earlier top was taken within inches of the shed. He also clearly misjudged the height of this top by a lot. Earlier in the video he called it 60-70' but when he asked, the groundman said it was 90'. So maybe he was trying to come within inched of the shed for the camera ( like the earlier cut seen on the ground did), but misjudged the height and therefore the DZ.

Another factor that may have come to play was the interruption of losing the small saw in the middle of making the notch. I think he needed the lanyard freed up. So he did not plan that out perfectly. He should have lost the small saw and positioned his lanyard properly before starting the cut.

And the size of that tag line was crazy IMO. Does he not own a 1/2" line? The weight of that thing at those heights has to suck! All these things in and of themselves are minor little imperfections that are commonplace in the course of climbing big trees, but they do add up and can make a difference in your outcomes.

These are the kind of comments that have the potential to help people and maybe even save a life. To just bust on the guy with ugliness and no constructive or corrective criticism serves no purpose other than feeding your need to make someone else wrong!

I personally would have made the cut from the right side, using an open face notch. 45-55 degrees on the top cut and 15+ degrees on the bottom. Easier to gun and easier to correct the gun if needed.

And for sure on that backleaner more force on the pull line would have helped. It would have been pretty simple to set up a ground anchor for 3:1 MA, or maybe even pull the truck into the backyard. You could have used a lawn tractor for a ground anchor or hammered a couple of sakes in the ground or used that tree behind the shed, with an offset pull on the other side to correct the direction of the vector.

Number one technical criticism as already mentioned earlier in this thread is not climbing line and method of decent. Billy is old school like that and somehow gets a pass because he has such a great personality backed up with great skills and decades of experience. That' a very bad example to set. Do you climb like that Rico? Did you ever? Tough to bust on someone for something that you do yourself. Does Billy let his son climb like that? That's no Beuno, especially for a rookie or journeyman.

Billy may end up becoming a victim of his own success. I don't watch much of his stuff anymore, but I have enjoyed a lot of his productivity and admire his personality and attitude. He's a YouTube phenom with 184K subs right now and that has to affect his actions. There is pressure to perform and entertain and come up with something new. Thus the behind the back, over the head ax throwing and the "what do you want from me people?" etc. And his down to earth friendly conversational style with the viewer has become almost sickly sweet and contrived.

But still, I give the guy credit. Spending that much time to make videos that are so popular is HUGE. Take his actions in context and show a little respect when you criticize his work. And he needs to respect the fact that so many people are watching and be careful what kind of example he is setting..

@Bixler has been in touch with Billy from early on. What do you think Brian?
 
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Daniel said:
OK,
I took another look at the video on a bigger screen and re-read the thread more thoroughly. I honestly didn't see the tips hit the shed until this morning. That changes things significantly IMO, though we can't see for sure if any damage was done, there were a couple of limbs that did more than just brush the shed. Fir is very pliable and giving but there was a lot of force behind that top and it looks like it did some damage.

Looks like he gunned the top cut of the face correctly, then mis-cut the angled cut of the Humboldt, overcutting to the left. The video was edited and it doesn't show a final check of the gun, once the face is completed. That definitely should have been done. So I'm guessing he realized that the face was gunned improperly and tried to correct that with the snipe, which didn't work. There was not enough angle on the snipe and it wasn't deep enough to effect such a big top. If you watch closely, the snipe just bumped the but to the right momentarily, after the hinge broke completely (and the top was free-falling), and the but slid over the snipe. The snipe had no effect on the direction of the top. That is an interesting observation and begs a deeper conversation about the variables that affect the effects of a snipe.

My take on it is, the wider the face before the snipe, the more momentum the piece will have whent he but contacts the snipe. The more momentum of the top, the less that little bit of force you can get from a snipe will change the direction of the top. So a narrower face with a snipe will have a much greater chance of affecting the direction of fall. He may have been using the snipe as a little added insurance that the but didn't come back at him, but I think he was trying to effect the direction of fall.

I'm sure if that was the house and not the shed he would have taken the time to recut the notch to correct the gun. You can see the earlier top was taken within inches of the shed. He also clearly misjudged the height of this top by a lot. Earlier in the video he called it 60-70' but when he asked, the groundman said it was 90'. So maybe he was trying to come within inched of the shed for the camera ( like the earlier cut seen on the ground did), but misjudged the height and therefore the DZ.

Another factor that may have come to play was the interruption of losing the small saw in the middle of making the notch. I think he needed the lanyard freed up. So he did not plan that out perfectly. He should have lost the small saw and positioned his lanyard properly before starting the cut.

And the size of that tag line was crazy IMO. Does he not own a 1/2" line? The weight of that thing at those heights has to suck! All these things in and of themselves are minor little imperfections that are commonplace in the course of climbing big trees, but they do add up and can make a difference in your outcomes.

These are the kind of comments that have the potential to help people and maybe even save a life. To just bust on the guy with ugliness and no constructive or corrective criticism serves no purpose other than feeding your need to make someone else wrong!

I personally would have made the cut from the right side, using an open face notch. 45-55 degrees on the top cut and 15+ degrees on the bottom. Easier to gun and easier to correct the gun if needed.

And for sure on that backleaner more force on the pull line would have helped. It would have been pretty simple to set up a ground anchor for 3:1 MA, or maybe even pull the truck into the backyard. You could have used a lawn tractor for a ground anchor or hammered a couple of sakes in the ground or used that tree behind the shed, with an offset pull on the other side to correct the direction of the vector.

Number one technical criticism as already mentioned earlier in this thread is not climbing line and method of decent. Billy is old school like that and somehow gets a pass because he has such a great personality backed up with great skills and decades of experience. That' a very bad example to set. Do you climb like that Rico? Did you ever? Tough to bust on someone for something that you do yourself. Does Billy let his son climb like that? That's no Beuno, especially for a rookie or journeyman.

Billy may end up becoming a victim of his own success. I don't watch much of his stuff anymore, but I have enjoyed a lot of his productivity and admire his personality and attitude. He's a YouTube phenom with 184K subs right now and that has to affect his actions. There is pressure to perform and entertain and come up with something new. Thus the behind the back, over the head ax throwing and the "what do you want from me people?" etc. And his down to earth friendly conversational style with the viewer has become almost sickly sweet and contrived.

But still, I give the guy credit. Spending that much time to make videos that are so popular is HUGE. Take his actions in context and show a little respect when you criticize his work. And he needs to respect the fact that so many people are watching and be careful what kind of example he is setting..

@Bixler has been in touch with Billy from early on. What do you think Brian?
Click to expand...
You'd have to buy a taller truck to reach where he made that cut.
 
Jehinten said:
I think it's no coincidence that it broke within feet, if not the exact spot, that it hit the spar.
Click to expand...

That statement shows just how clueless you are.

He barely brushed that other stem and had very little influence on the movement of the falling top.

If there was any significant impact you would have seen it jar the top and the stem a lot more than it did

the break of the bottom had absolutely 0 to do with the impact on the stem.

So please check your ridiculous fantasies.
 
Daniel said:
OK,
I took another look at the video on a bigger screen and re-read the thread more thoroughly. I honestly didn't see the tips hit the shed until this morning. That changes things significantly IMO, though we can't see for sure if any damage was done, there were a couple of limbs that did more than just brush the shed. Fir is very pliable and giving but there was a lot of force behind that top and it looks like it did some damage.

Looks like he gunned the top cut of the face correctly, then mis-cut the angled cut of the Humboldt, overcutting to the left. The video was edited and it doesn't show a final check of the gun, once the face is completed. That definitely should have been done. So I'm guessing he realized that the face was gunned improperly and tried to correct that with the snipe, which didn't work. There was not enough angle on the snipe and it wasn't deep enough to effect such a big top. If you watch closely, the snipe just bumped the but to the right momentarily, after the hinge broke completely (and the top was free-falling), and the but slid over the snipe. The snipe had no effect on the direction of the top. That is an interesting observation and begs a deeper conversation about the variables that affect the effects of a snipe.

My take on it is, the wider the face before the snipe, the more momentum the piece will have whent he but contacts the snipe. The more momentum of the top, the less that little bit of force you can get from a snipe will change the direction of the top. So a narrower face with a snipe will have a much greater chance of affecting the direction of fall. He may have been using the snipe as a little added insurance that the but didn't come back at him, but I think he was trying to effect the direction of fall.

I'm sure if that was the house and not the shed he would have taken the time to recut the notch to correct the gun. You can see the earlier top was taken within inches of the shed. He also clearly misjudged the height of this top by a lot. Earlier in the video he called it 60-70' but when he asked, the groundman said it was 90'. So maybe he was trying to come within inched of the shed for the camera ( like the earlier cut seen on the ground did), but misjudged the height and therefore the DZ.

Another factor that may have come to play was the interruption of losing the small saw in the middle of making the notch. I think he needed the lanyard freed up. So he did not plan that out perfectly. He should have lost the small saw and positioned his lanyard properly before starting the cut.

And the size of that tag line was crazy IMO. Does he not own a 1/2" line? The weight of that thing at those heights has to suck! All these things in and of themselves are minor little imperfections that are commonplace in the course of climbing big trees, but they do add up and can make a difference in your outcomes.

These are the kind of comments that have the potential to help people and maybe even save a life. To just bust on the guy with ugliness and no constructive or corrective criticism serves no purpose other than feeding your need to make someone else wrong!

I personally would have made the cut from the right side, using an open face notch. 45-55 degrees on the top cut and 15+ degrees on the bottom. Easier to gun and easier to correct the gun if needed.

And for sure on that backleaner more force on the pull line would have helped. It would have been pretty simple to set up a ground anchor for 3:1 MA, or maybe even pull the truck into the backyard. You could have used a lawn tractor for a ground anchor or hammered a couple of sakes in the ground or used that tree behind the shed, with an offset pull on the other side to correct the direction of the vector.

Number one technical criticism as already mentioned earlier in this thread is not climbing line and method of decent. Billy is old school like that and somehow gets a pass because he has such a great personality backed up with great skills and decades of experience. That' a very bad example to set. Do you climb like that Rico? Did you ever? Tough to bust on someone for something that you do yourself. Does Billy let his son climb like that? That's no Beuno, especially for a rookie or journeyman.

Billy may end up becoming a victim of his own success. I don't watch much of his stuff anymore, but I have enjoyed a lot of his productivity and admire his personality and attitude. He's a YouTube phenom with 184K subs right now and that has to affect his actions. There is pressure to perform and entertain and come up with something new. Thus the behind the back, over the head ax throwing and the "what do you want from me people?" etc. And his down to earth friendly conversational style with the viewer has become almost sickly sweet and contrived.

But still, I give the guy credit. Spending that much time to make videos that are so popular is HUGE. Take his actions in context and show a little respect when you criticize his work. And he needs to respect the fact that so many people are watching and be careful what kind of example he is setting..

@Bixler has been in touch with Billy from early on. What do you think Brian?
Click to expand...
So we are back to square one Daniel... He did in fact miss his lay to the left and unintentionally hit the spar. It is also plain from the vid that the impact pushed his entire top a few feet to the right. If we need more evidence that this impact did influence the path of this top we dont need to look any further than where the top came to rest...Multiple feet to the right from where it would have landed if the spar were not in its flight path...

I'm curious just how many 75ft-125ft tops you have taken from 100ft or more Daniel...if your answer is less the 1 you might want to leave a discussion about taken big conifers tops to those who actually know WTF they are talking about.....Just a thought buddy.....
 
I've worked with a lot of contract climbers over the years. The best could do 9 one-handed pull-ups and climb circles around 99 out of 100 other contract climbers. And I've worked with climbers I had to pull out of the tree and finish myself because they didn't have a clue how to use a chainsaw. SO what kind of contract climber are you?

If you have to brag about having a hard dick, we can take a guess it's the latter.
 
rico said:
So we are back to square one Daniel... He did in fact miss his lay to the left and unintentionally hit the spar. It is also plain from the vid that the impact pushed his entire top a few feet to the right. If we need more evidence that this impact did influence the path of this top we dont need to look any further than where the top came to rest...Multiple feet to the right from where it would have landed if the spar were not in its flight path...

I'm curious just how many 75ft-125ft tops you have taken from 100ft or more Daniel...if your answer is less the 1 you might want to leave a discussion about taken big conifers tops to those who actually know WTF they are talking about.....Just a thought buddy.....
Click to expand...

Ya.. square one .. you are just as nasty and ugly as ever!
 
If the grazing impact had influenced the path of the falling top ou would have seen that effect in some change in the movement of the falling but end of the top. You would have also seen a large movement and recoil in the standing stem that got hit. The standing stem was tall enough that any significant impact would have pushed it a good way. It BARELY moved all. The movement in the standing stem was almost imperceptible. The display of energy on that stem is equal to the energy put into the falling top.
The falling stem landed about a foot, or at most 2 feet, from the base of the standing stem. That seems to be due completely to the lean of the standing stem and not in any way due to the impact.
 
Daniel said:
I've worked with a lot of contract climbers over the years. The best could do 9 one-handed pull-ups and climb circles around 99 out of 100 other contract climbers. And I've worked with climbers I had to pull out of the tree and finish myself because they didn't have a clue how to use a chainsaw. SO what kind of contract climber are you?

If you have to brag about having a hard dick, we can take a guess it's the latter.
Click to expand...
I'm only bragging because you asked what I had and I wasn't gonna let you find out the old-fashioned way.
I have to work outside of my market to find anything resembling a peer. I have a list of guys who would give me great reviews who are themselves very good climbers.
I've worked with several guys who contract all over and I produce as well as any of them.
I know people without the desire to learn how to win the game scoff at competitions, but I do pretty well at those. I'm second in state right now and got into the top 10 at NAOM among other things.

I don't record my work when I'm busy working. I work harder than my local competition to get away with doing proper pruning where someone else would hack and slash and be done as quickly as possible.

You got so mad because I was poking fun at a fat man in a big truck. Now I feel much more comfortable saying that it's because that fat man is trying to discuss the finer points of a game that he can't play. Maybe he could have at one time, if he had decided to, but it's over. The time has passed. He is bitter and mean and rabble rousing like someone's father in law watching football and bitching over a cheap beer on a holiday that everyone would rather spend somewhere else.
 
Daniel said:
Ya.. square one .. you are just as nasty and ugly as ever!
Click to expand...
So I will take that as a resounding NO to you ever taken a 75ft-125ft top from a 100ft or more... As I said we would all be best served if you kept your comments to things you actually have experience with Daniel....

If you had any actual experience taken a skinned up 90 ft top from any kind of real height you would be aware of the fact that they tend to go tip first because the lack of brush negates the sail effect...This top however came down butt first because the impact of hitting the spar stopped the downward motion of the tip dead in its tracks..... You are clearly out of your element here Daniel, so maybe you should just leave this one to the experts.....
 
I published the first videos of falling large tree tops on YouTube in 2009.

Maybe Grahaem had something similar back then.

you're assessment of that physics is so far off any possible connection to reality. there was no stopping the tips dead in it's tracks. there was enough brush left on the tips to create a sail effect and having it at the tips, creates the most leverage to slow the tips down and thereby rotate the top.

your assessment of this video shows how out of touch you are. you sound reasonable most of the time. but you talk complete nonsense enough to call everything you say into question.

And the top hit nearly flat. your saying it came down but first is almost as delusional as saying the almost imperceptible grazing stopped the tips dead in it's tracks. you are completely out of your mind
 
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SomethingWitty said:
I'm only bragging because you asked what I had and I wasn't gonna let you find out the old-fashioned way.
I have to work outside of my market to find anything resembling a peer. I have a list of guys who would give me great reviews who are themselves very good climbers.
I've worked with several guys who contract all over and I produce as well as any of them.
I know people without the desire to learn how to win the game scoff at competitions, but I do pretty well at those. I'm second in state right now and got into the top 10 at NAOM among other things.

I don't record my work when I'm busy working. I work harder than my local competition to get away with doing proper pruning where someone else would hack and slash and be done as quickly as possible.

You got so mad because I was poking fun at a fat man in a big truck. Now I feel much more comfortable saying that it's because that fat man is trying to discuss the finer points of a game that he can't play. Maybe he could have at one time, if he had decided to, but it's over. The time has passed. He is bitter and mean and rabble rousing like someone's father in law watching football and bitching over a cheap beer on a holiday that everyone would rather spend somewhere else.
Click to expand...
being a better climber than the average toothless, shirtless backwoods redneck is nothing to brag about.

I've worked with some of the best climbers that have ever walked the planet. the fact that you had to bring your dick into the conversation shows your insecurities

Put me in the bucket and you on rope and saddle on a technical removal and I'd finish at least twice as fast.

put you in the bucket, I'd still smoke you
 
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