Thoughts?
- Thread starter rico
- Start date
Here ya' go Daniel.. A skinned up top taking a tip dive because of the lack of brush negating the typical sail effect, which makes the top act more like a log than a top...I got my "physics" PHD the hard way buddy... By actually doing....
And yea the impact of Billy hitting the spar with his top did in fact stop the downward movement of the tip of the top, thus the butt did in fact make contact with the ground first (7:32 - 7:36). This is unusual when taken a large skinned up top... Again, if you had any actual experience with taking big conifer tops you would already know all this. Sadly you dont...
Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
once again more BS
you post up a video that DOESN'T show the landing
you post up a video that DOESN'T show the landing
That is video evidence that you can skin up a big top and cause it to nose dive. That top was in a serious nose dive that it was never going to overcome and recover from..To say otherwise just shows how truly ignorant you are concerning the topic at hand, and just how irrational your over inflated yet unfounded ego has made you...
Meanwhile those of us who have actually spent our lives blowin big tops out of conifers know that we can shorten the lay out front by stripping the top out because it causes your top to nose dive, instead of laying flat during flight... Anyone trying this needs to be aware that the butt of your top will often end up behind the stump so you must plan for that..
Here's a Fir top with all the brush left on it.....Notice the flat flight path....Really simple subtle things that you can use to manipulate the flight path of your top...The nerve of you running around here proclaiming yourself an expert when it is crystal clear that you have no idea what you are talking about on the matter of taking big tops out of conifers......
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SomethingWitty
Arkansawyer
- Location
- LR
I think I'll just stop here. Not because I don't have responses, but because I don't need to argue with some asshole about nothing over the internet.
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
Any jackass can make a felling cut on a 90’ top. Let’s see pictures of your Bush or super tight hedge. How about a little thinning and skirt raising on a fine specimens like these
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
Or if you have the balls, tickle these roots
flushcut
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Delavan, WI
Did you prune out or untangle that mess?
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
Just FYI , the idea that your vulnerable flaccid or periodically erect inside out vagina with its ultra sensitive tadpole sacks gives you an advantage to not smash a house when playing chainsaw monkey is always good for a hardy laugh. Keep flinging your shit monkey. I’ll get the popcorn as your man parts sway in the wind.
(A message to y’all from Sumer while she is working on the grocery list)
(A message to y’all from Sumer while she is working on the grocery list)
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
I actually only made two pruning cuts and was able to detangle the rest fairly well.
Reach
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Atglen, PA
I actually enjoy the rare occasion when I get to work on something like that. Unfortunately, we don’t get many of those calls. They usually go to the lawn guy, “because he has some pruners and it’s just a little tree, so anyone can trim it.”
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
It’s all about niche, this is my bread and butter. I dislike the hedges though, and only rarely take that one on, hence why there aren’t any total after pictures (I just wanted to get the hell out of there).
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Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
Here's a little sail for you:
Jerry B mentions sail in FGTW, saying something to the effect that any limb will eventually get straight if it has enough time to free fall. There are a number of factors that will influence how exactly the sail on a large top (or any pieces) will effect it's rotation during the fall. Height is towards the top of the list. Length, momentum of rotation at separation, mass and balance of the piece are all factors that play.
The amount of sail, as determined by the branches left/removed is only one factor. Your statement that " stripping the top out because it causes your top to nose dive " is simplistic and does not account for the many other factors mentioned above.
Newton's Third Law of Motion states that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. That is the simplest way to determine the amount of force that the contact with the standing stem had on Billy's top. Any significant force , except a direct downward hit on top of the spar (which clearly didn't happen) would cause a horizontal push on the spar. That horizontal push would create a bending moment that would shake the shit out of the spar. Given the height of that spar, it wouldn't take much to get the it waving around.
The amount of force shaking that spar is equal to the amount of force that changed the direction, momentum and rotation of the spar during the fall. Did we see any big pieces of bark get ripped off the top or the spar? Did we see any movement in the spar after contact?
I had to look at the video in slow motion several times to verify that there was any contact at all. The movement of the spar after impact is almost imperceptible. That is the greatest evidence that the impact had no appreciable effect on the top. Your claim that the impact "stopped the top dead in its tracks" is absolutely ridiculous. You otherwise seem to have a good head on your shoulders but then you make these completely false claims that show that you are either a pathological liar, or have lost touch with reality.
That said: BILLY DID MISS HIS LAY.. the argument for that is simple and unarguable as well. HE HIT THE SHED and hit it pretty hard. So his " BULLSEYE" was bullshit.
Jerry B mentions sail in FGTW, saying something to the effect that any limb will eventually get straight if it has enough time to free fall. There are a number of factors that will influence how exactly the sail on a large top (or any pieces) will effect it's rotation during the fall. Height is towards the top of the list. Length, momentum of rotation at separation, mass and balance of the piece are all factors that play.
The amount of sail, as determined by the branches left/removed is only one factor. Your statement that " stripping the top out because it causes your top to nose dive " is simplistic and does not account for the many other factors mentioned above.
Newton's Third Law of Motion states that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. That is the simplest way to determine the amount of force that the contact with the standing stem had on Billy's top. Any significant force , except a direct downward hit on top of the spar (which clearly didn't happen) would cause a horizontal push on the spar. That horizontal push would create a bending moment that would shake the shit out of the spar. Given the height of that spar, it wouldn't take much to get the it waving around.
The amount of force shaking that spar is equal to the amount of force that changed the direction, momentum and rotation of the spar during the fall. Did we see any big pieces of bark get ripped off the top or the spar? Did we see any movement in the spar after contact?
I had to look at the video in slow motion several times to verify that there was any contact at all. The movement of the spar after impact is almost imperceptible. That is the greatest evidence that the impact had no appreciable effect on the top. Your claim that the impact "stopped the top dead in its tracks" is absolutely ridiculous. You otherwise seem to have a good head on your shoulders but then you make these completely false claims that show that you are either a pathological liar, or have lost touch with reality.
That said: BILLY DID MISS HIS LAY.. the argument for that is simple and unarguable as well. HE HIT THE SHED and hit it pretty hard. So his " BULLSEYE" was bullshit.
flushcut
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Delavan, WI
No it's not, he bullseyed the shed just fine.
southsoundtree
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Olympia, WA
The entire top is shaken by the impact.
Get on video and act confident. People who know no better will not see a huge no-no.
Basic, should be boring tree-work made to be more.
Videoing and Wanna-be TV star takes safe, boring work, and adds danger.
Get on video and act confident. People who know no better will not see a huge no-no.
Basic, should be boring tree-work made to be more.
Videoing and Wanna-be TV star takes safe, boring work, and adds danger.
Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
Sean,
Try looking closely in slow motion on a large screen. Look at the but only.. ignore the top.. just look at the but and you'll see that the shake in the top comes from the but sliding off the snipe, not from the impact with the other spar.
There was no pivot in the top after impact, meaning that the top landed in line with its trajectory at the beginning of the fall. And the top landed no more than 12-18" from the base of the spar it hit, so it couldn't have gotten thrown far to the side. That 12-18" looks like it was more due to a lean in the spar, rather than a deflection from the contact, but lean is always hard to tell from video.
That said, ya he made it a lot more dangerous than needed. Going back and watching the notch cutting, you can see he was off with the angled cut of the Humboldt. While I wouldn't call blowing big tops "boring", its clear he had better options and was likely influenced by trying to put on a good show. IMO that's his prerogative. Looks good for the average viewer, but doesn't pass the smell test for those that know better.
But rather than just bust on the guy, perhaps the "experts" could offer some suggestions as to how the cutting could have been improved.
IMO. he should have checked his final gun and corrected a poorly aimed undercut rather than trying to turn the top with a snipe. He had a lot more room in the yard, so he could have been aiming further right from the start, which would have taken all the drama out of it.
Busting on Billy for taking risks to put on show, is kind of like busting on Rush Limbaugh or Bill O'Rielly for exaggerating or sensationalizing a story, or criticizing Jon Stewart or Colbert for mocking the president, or busting on Axmen for all the unrealistic dramatic moments of clearly staged mishaps. These guys are in the entertainment business and so is Billy!
Billy is a tree guy first. If Rush Limbaugh goes overboard, someone doesn't need a new roof. If Jon Stewart's joke falls flat someone doesn't get hurt or killed. Billy is walking the fine line between entertainment and unnecessary risk. So far he's kept his balance, but this video shows a slight wobble to the dangerous side. And do the homeowners know he's jeopardizing their property in the name of views?
