Tree Devotionals (Contain Bible Verses, so enter at your own risk)

Tom Dunlap said:
Back to the cat breeding program
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You bring a lot of questions, but not many answers. Maybe it is your turn to answer a few. What's your response to the soft tissue being found in dinosaur fossils that I mentioned earlier? What about things like fossilized dinosaur tracks and human footprints found nearby in the same rock layers? I believe some have been found where the human footprint is in the dinosaur footprint? How do you reconcile that with the evolutionary timeframe? How can you say dinosaurs evolved into birds when dinosaurs have been found with fully formed birds in their stomachs?
 
I'm not arguing my case. If I've found an answer that suits me I accept and go on. There are examples of some of the things that I've found while reading that I've shared. If you find some info that's doesn't fit your beliefs don't look to me to be your educator or explainer

YOu packed a slug of questions into #101. Since you seem to be more familiar with the answers please post the links to where I might read up.

I started learning about the fossil record in about 1959 on a Sunday hike with my family. If you come up for NATCC I'll take you to the rock face where we found fossils of extinct shellfish near Ft Snelling. Later, in 8th grade Earth science class I was taught more about the fossil record, continental drift, etc. All that was confirmed again in Geology 101 at U of Minnesota.

Again, I'm not looking to prove my position. It's been made well enough for me by people who are more educated.

So..back to cat breeding.
 
Something sounded familiar in your footprint query so I did a cut/paste and read the very first reply, a wiki page.


You can read up with an answer that has held up to scrutiny. Texas Monthly is a pretty credible source, especially in Texas. Read this article:

www.texasmonthly.com

The Dinosaur Darwin Missed

Side by side near a Texas river are dinosaur tracks and what appear to be the marks of a human foot—proof, in the creationist mind, that evolution is bunk.
www.texasmonthly.com www.texasmonthly.com

After reading the wiki I remembered seeing some of the footprint slabs at a museum in Austin. I also remembered seeing the CGI of the dino herd putting down the tracks.

Skim then read the very last sentence:

www.icr.org

Paluxy River: The Tale of the Trails | The Institute for Creation Research

www.icr.org www.icr.org


You're falling for disproven theories. If it was this easy to find the answer to your question I kinda think if I were inclined the rest would be just as easy. My usual mode is to do a Google search, read some articles, post a link to what I found as well as the original Google search for you so that you can get a more in depth answer to your questions.



Oh...what about cat breeding programs?
 
Tom Dunlap said:
Freewill and my concept of deity. Maybe s/he?
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It's not your concept of deity that matters. God has revealed Himself to us in His word, the Bible.

I'm disappointed in you, Tom. I spent time writing that (because you asked me to), and instead of giving a real response, you turned to mockery. For some reason, I have a feeling you wouldn't say such things about Allah or Buddha, why is it okay to mock the God of the Bible? I also have a feeling that you would defend calling someone by their preferred pronouns.

It seems to me that this is trolling and actions like these are what moderators are intended to prevent, not partake in.
 
Tom Dunlap said:
Oh...what about cat breeding programs?
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The process of breeding animals is like @CaPowell has already said, you’re actually thinning out DNA code. All of our cat breeds are from people breeding out characteristics that they don’t want in a cat. It’s easy to imagine a cat origins created by God with a large DNA base and through time as DNA code is breezed out we get all the different breeds that we have today.
 
Imagine

Through time

Words to ponder.

Is the 6-10k YE post Noah flood timeline long enough to go from one pair, one species to the feline variety on earth now? I don’t buy/believe that.

You’ve strayed off course. I’d like to find a part of YE that isn't anchored to faith. I’m going to have to accept that there won’t be explanations coming from you guys. I’m on my own to do more reading
 
Tom Dunlap said:
Imagine

Through time

Words to ponder.

Is the 6-10k YE post Noah flood timeline long enough to go from one pair, one species to the feline variety on earth now? I don’t buy/believe that.

You’ve strayed off course. I’d like to find a part of YE that isn't anchored to faith. I’m going to have to accept that there won’t be explanations coming from you guys. I’m on my own to do more reading
Click to expand...
We’ve strayed off course? Why don’t you reply to @CaPowell in post #104.

Just because you don’t believe we can have the species variety today after 6,000 years doesn’t mean it’s not possible.
 
CaPowell said:
It seems to me that this is trolling and actions like these are what moderators are intended to prevent, not partake in.
Click to expand...


Which hat do you expect me toi wear? Mod or arbo?

Not a troll..but I know you won't believe that.

Funny how cat breeding can be possible but there is such certainty about YE. I can't figure that out.
 
Tom Dunlap said:
Funny how cat breeding can be possible but there is such certainty about YE. I can't figure that out.
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I'm not quite sure why you are so hung up on the cat breeding thing.

I never said anything about breeding programs being the reason we have the cats we do now. Certain dominant traits rising to the surface through isolated populations is what I was referring to, not some program of people actively breeding cats. The latter is not the cause of all the species we have now, but people in recent years have certainly crossbred cats to see what is possible: enter ligers and tigons... Refer to the page I posted in #92. It seems that the limiting factor in cross-species cat reproduction is not genetics, but the size of the cats.
 
CaPowell said:
I'm not quite sure why you are so hung up on the cat breeding thing.

I never said anything about breeding programs being the reason we have the cats we do now. Certain dominant traits rising to the surface through isolated populations is what I was referring to, not some program of people actively breeding cats. The latter is not the cause of all the species we have now, but people in recent years have certainly crossbred cats to see what is possible: enter ligers and tigons... Refer to the page I posted in #92. It seems that the limiting factor in cross-species cat reproduction is not genetics, but the size of the cats.
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Interesting about ligers and tigons.

The fact that they can breed is evidence of a common ancestor. A common evolutionary ancestor that was neither tiger or lion that then differentiated into lions and tigers. All cats share a common ancestor.

Humans too share common ancestors with out cousins the Neanderthals, Denisovians and others.

Family tree.png
 
TreeCo said:
Interesting about ligers and tigons.

The fact that they can breed is evidence of a common ancestor. A common evolutionary ancestor that was neither tiger or lion that then differentiated into lions and tigers. All cats share a common ancestor.

Humans too share common ancestors with out cousins the Neanderthals, Denisovians and others.
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We're saying the same thing, but talking past each other. There is great variation between "kinds". But that is where it stops, lizards don't become birds.

I don't deny that neanderthals existed. They were fully human and very intelligent. All of our "ancestors" that are so often pointed to were either fully human or fully ape. I do not believe we came from apes.

I'll have to find something I read about neanderthal super glue. They used to glue their spearheads on their spears. The bond was virtually unbreakable and modern scientists have had a hard time replicating it. It had to be heated up to a very narrow temperature range (around 700⁰) and kept free from oxygen.

Also, please note that humans and apes can't interbreed.
 
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CaPowell said:
We're saying the same thing, but talking past each other. There is great variation between "kinds". But that is where it stops, lizards don't become birds.

I don't deny that neanderthals existed. They were fully human and very intelligent. All of our "ancestors" that are so often pointed to were either fully human or fully ape. I do not believe we came from apes.
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Evolutionist are not suggesting that humans came from apes. The suggestion is that ape predecessors had cousins much like homo sapiens, neanderthal and denisovians and others are our cousins. Homo came from one of these cousins and apes came from another, etc. Millions of years of such variations.
 
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Cat breeding clarified

Flood waters have receded
Land is dry
Arc is being emptied
One species of cat leaves

6-10k years later, present day

The world I’d filled with a wide variety of cat species

How can the diversity happen so quickly?

Maybe what the YE story Is different than what I’ve read? What am I missing?
 
Tom Dunlap said:
Cat breeding clarified

Flood waters have receded
Land is dry
Arc is being emptied
One species of cat leaves

6-10k years later, present day

The world I’d filled with a wide variety of cat species

How can the diversity happen so quickly?

Maybe what the YE story Is different than what I’ve read? What am I missing?
Click to expand...
We can see diversity emerging from all animals and humans over just the past couple hundreds of years. I don’t find it difficult at all to believe we could have such a wide diversity of cats within only a few thousand years.

answersingenesis.org

Feedback: Have Domestic Cats Remained Virtually Unchanged for 2,000 Years?

It can seem contradictory when we look at ancient Egyptian art that often shows remarkable stability in appearance to today’s cats.
answersingenesis.org answersingenesis.org
 
Tom Dunlap said:
Cat breeding clarified

Flood waters have receded
Land is dry
Arc is being emptied
One species of cat leaves

6-10k years later, present day

The world I’d filled with a wide variety of cat species

How can the diversity happen so quickly?

Maybe what the YE story Is different than what I’ve read? What am I missing?
Click to expand...
Without citing specific resources, just based on what I have seen in modern day dog breeding, I see no reason such diversity cannot occur in 6k years.

Look at how many new dog breeds have come out in just the past 20 years, if there can be so many in so few years, it seems quite sensible to me that 6k years could be plenty for all the current cats to have come about.

Edit:

This article notes 25 dog breeds that have been officially recognized in the last 20 years: https://www.google.com/m?q=number of new dog breeds registered last ten years
If you extrapolate those numbers over 5,000 years, back to about when the flood occurred, there would be about 6,250 dog breeds. Assuming cats breed somewhat similarly, that would be plenty of time for cats to diversify to what we have today.
 
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Hmmm...there's a good chance that house cats and house dogs can be bred into new configurations. That's not what I'm talking about.

There is such a wide range of cat/dog/etc. configurations. How do lions and leopards come along in the same timeline? I'd expect that it would be super easy to find examples of the breeding changes in a species that would be 6-10k years old. The historical record is much more robust and easier to confirm. Look at what is found in Egypt. Domestication of cats and dogs is pretty well researched.

If there is an acceptance of the possiblity of breeding/evolution of cats without any missing links then how come that same acceptance isn't there for the rest of the biological spectrum. If it works for cats why not humans?
 
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