- Location
- tulsa oklahoma
Roger u r a wine bag and a huge baby!!!! wahwahwah!
D.W.H
D.W.H
nasty cottonwood
- Thread starter Norm_Hall
- Start date
Roger_Barnett
Participating member
- Location
- Seattle, in the PNWet
Sure, bub......
However, my record speaks for itself. You, well, you've been here for, what, a coupla months....? OK, maybe longer, as
I just saw that your alzheimer's made you forget your original moniker...orrrr something.
Me? well there are 82 members who have more tenure here..
and maybe a small handful of them and the entire group, that have 35 or more years in the industry.
But what do I know?
However, my record speaks for itself. You, well, you've been here for, what, a coupla months....? OK, maybe longer, as
I just saw that your alzheimer's made you forget your original moniker...orrrr something.
Me? well there are 82 members who have more tenure here..
and maybe a small handful of them and the entire group, that have 35 or more years in the industry.
But what do I know?
jim454
Participating member
- Location
- The land of Utopia
You seem to be taking that post a bit personal Roger.
- Location
- NJ
After this one you win ok old man, maybe you can continue your Holly and Buzz bashing at the local barber shop.
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That way, Holly could cun t it up too
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Why?, cuase I say most guys here biuld trees up to be this huge project. When in fact they are cut and dry daily routie work for others. Heck he even get to see the tree ahead of time, I only ever get to see a paper of what to do and figure set up and job when I get there. Pretty sure anyone can rig a tree out with a 125/175 ton crane. 35,000 wow, I'd only need to do 3 jobs in your town to make more than most do in a year.
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Technically, my bid was the lowest
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Shame you lost the job, guessing you wanted someones cheerios to piss in, and after all I'm the talk of the town???? Blast away, I can take as good as I give. Maybe next time you will win the job. Hell, take the city guy out and cry in his lap about how much better you are, it might work for ya. I keep saying them papers don't mean much in most states. Lobby for a lic test, NJ fianlly won.
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It's beyond me why Tom and Mark allow that fool to spew his nonsensical diatribes
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Me either, hurrrumf, ooo wait I know, cuase I really do know what I'm talking bout. I really, really, do have the skills to back it up with. I'm colorful??? this one might be pushing it. It's always nice to have one guy around that everyone hates it helps guys like you have common ground to bond on. OOO wait your already doing this at the TH.
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Nice, but unnecessary with these big, but healthy trees.
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Those limbs are rather large and brittle, with a less than adequately strong high tie point.
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I'm soooooo confused, is it strong and healthy or weak and brittle. Again my point of how others talk jobs up.
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That way, Holly could cun t it up too
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Why?, cuase I say most guys here biuld trees up to be this huge project. When in fact they are cut and dry daily routie work for others. Heck he even get to see the tree ahead of time, I only ever get to see a paper of what to do and figure set up and job when I get there. Pretty sure anyone can rig a tree out with a 125/175 ton crane. 35,000 wow, I'd only need to do 3 jobs in your town to make more than most do in a year.
[ QUOTE ]
Technically, my bid was the lowest
[/ QUOTE ]
Shame you lost the job, guessing you wanted someones cheerios to piss in, and after all I'm the talk of the town???? Blast away, I can take as good as I give. Maybe next time you will win the job. Hell, take the city guy out and cry in his lap about how much better you are, it might work for ya. I keep saying them papers don't mean much in most states. Lobby for a lic test, NJ fianlly won.
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It's beyond me why Tom and Mark allow that fool to spew his nonsensical diatribes
[/ QUOTE ]
Me either, hurrrumf, ooo wait I know, cuase I really do know what I'm talking bout. I really, really, do have the skills to back it up with. I'm colorful??? this one might be pushing it. It's always nice to have one guy around that everyone hates it helps guys like you have common ground to bond on. OOO wait your already doing this at the TH.
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Nice, but unnecessary with these big, but healthy trees.
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Those limbs are rather large and brittle, with a less than adequately strong high tie point.
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I'm soooooo confused, is it strong and healthy or weak and brittle. Again my point of how others talk jobs up.
- Location
- tulsa oklahoma
Come on Roger. How does a post about Norms job turn n2 your sob story about a large cottonwood you missed out on??? Gay.
Secondly I dont give a rats a$$ how long you have been doing this, there are people out there who have been doing it half as long who are better and faster than you and "cowboy" Dave.
Thirdly as Holly asked, why does natural crotch rigging along with an older saddle and using ur tail to tie a blakes or tautline in any way shape or form contribute to someones professionalism or not??? Gay.
D.W.H
Secondly I dont give a rats a$$ how long you have been doing this, there are people out there who have been doing it half as long who are better and faster than you and "cowboy" Dave.
Thirdly as Holly asked, why does natural crotch rigging along with an older saddle and using ur tail to tie a blakes or tautline in any way shape or form contribute to someones professionalism or not??? Gay.
D.W.H
- Location
- tulsa oklahoma
By the way Roger I have been here for around a year and a half (on this website) and somehow my old profile blocked me and I had to start a new. In case that even matters.
D.W.H
D.W.H
- Location
- Home of the New Jersey Devils
Roger,
I wouldn't mind doing a job like that with you. That would be a good reason to come out and work with you. I'm heading out your way in the Fall, maybe we could figure a job out for then?
I wouldn't mind doing a job like that with you. That would be a good reason to come out and work with you. I'm heading out your way in the Fall, maybe we could figure a job out for then?
Roger_Barnett
Participating member
- Location
- Seattle, in the PNWet
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By the way Roger I have been here for around a year and a half (on this website) and somehow my old profile blocked me and I had to start a new. In case that even matters.
D.W.H
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As I noticed, DW, see my above comment, "OK, maybe longer, but
I see your alzheimer's made you forget your original moniker...orrrr something."
You and Holly seem to love to bust chops....well, if ya think you're gonna succeed, you might go back and reread......I wrote:
"My bid was late, technically I never had a chance on the job. But the parameters were wrong (road closure now allowed)...the real flock up was by the city guy who thought the low bidder (not me) wasn't up to the job."
As far as the climber I showed, I mainly pointed out a couple of his improper techniques (ANSI violations--not to say we're totally by the book either....)....The old school gear and technique are fine, but can be clues as to his experience and skill level.
who's your money on tomorrow?
I'm hopin' N.O.
By the way Roger I have been here for around a year and a half (on this website) and somehow my old profile blocked me and I had to start a new. In case that even matters.
D.W.H
[/ QUOTE ]
As I noticed, DW, see my above comment, "OK, maybe longer, but
I see your alzheimer's made you forget your original moniker...orrrr something."
You and Holly seem to love to bust chops....well, if ya think you're gonna succeed, you might go back and reread......I wrote:
"My bid was late, technically I never had a chance on the job. But the parameters were wrong (road closure now allowed)...the real flock up was by the city guy who thought the low bidder (not me) wasn't up to the job."
As far as the climber I showed, I mainly pointed out a couple of his improper techniques (ANSI violations--not to say we're totally by the book either....)....The old school gear and technique are fine, but can be clues as to his experience and skill level.
who's your money on tomorrow?
I'm hopin' N.O.
Roger_Barnett
Participating member
- Location
- Seattle, in the PNWet
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Nice, but unnecessary with these big, but healthy trees.
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Those limbs are rather large and brittle, with a less than adequately strong high tie point.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm soooooo confused, is it strong and healthy or weak and brittle. Again my point of how others talk jobs up.
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A bit of a lesson for ya, bub.....
These are huge but relatively young and healthy black cottonwood. They grow much taller and faster than, say, a plains cottonwood. Their limbs are notorious for breaking off. Strength is very suspect, likely far less than with other cottonwood species. For instance, Norm's tree. If it were healthy, it looked like a walk in the park to rig out..the only thing that would make it challenging would have been the work zone being tight.
Now, both these cottonwood, especially the second tree in my photos, have a few very heavy upward trending limbs that would be very challenging to rig out whole. And, if one were to rig them in sections, using a high tie point, well, said high tie point would very likely not be strong enough to handle the load or swing. You'd have to do a secondary rig point right at the cut.....These techniques are VERY dicey with a huge brittle cottonwood. Health of the tree isn't the issue...of course, if it were dead or compromised, then, two cranes would be a given.
Further, in this state, many crane companies will not allow riding the ball, even if tied in above. So, because many of the limbs need to tied at or near the balance point (normal for craning anyhow) the company that's doing the work felt they would need a second crane just to rig the limbs. Well, as I said, they obviously didn't feel comfortable or didn't have climbers capable of rappeling out to rig the limbs. Which tells me a lot, as both myself and the other good rigger were confident we could rig the brush on the tree in question. Thus saving many many hours of road closure time... and $ to the city. (The other tree, though, has to be craned in total. No other option.)
So call me a whiner all you want....but that is how the job should have gone down...and, I'm thinking you would agree (and prolly would be up to the task!)...though I don't think You or DWH have experience with these trees.......and I pretty danged sure there are no tree species in this country that present this specific level of challenge---I'm not talking diseased, declining, or dead ones, now...but then, the risk level would also be off the charts as compared to most others.....naturally that's subjective, as there are many many different kinds of hazards that develop with declining trees.
Now, if ya wanna be civil, and polite, maybe we can continue....
if not....well I might exercise the IGGY button,,which would be a first on an arb board for me.....but, what fun would it be then
[ QUOTE ]
Nice, but unnecessary with these big, but healthy trees.
[/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ]
Those limbs are rather large and brittle, with a less than adequately strong high tie point.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm soooooo confused, is it strong and healthy or weak and brittle. Again my point of how others talk jobs up.
[/ QUOTE ]
A bit of a lesson for ya, bub.....
These are huge but relatively young and healthy black cottonwood. They grow much taller and faster than, say, a plains cottonwood. Their limbs are notorious for breaking off. Strength is very suspect, likely far less than with other cottonwood species. For instance, Norm's tree. If it were healthy, it looked like a walk in the park to rig out..the only thing that would make it challenging would have been the work zone being tight.
Now, both these cottonwood, especially the second tree in my photos, have a few very heavy upward trending limbs that would be very challenging to rig out whole. And, if one were to rig them in sections, using a high tie point, well, said high tie point would very likely not be strong enough to handle the load or swing. You'd have to do a secondary rig point right at the cut.....These techniques are VERY dicey with a huge brittle cottonwood. Health of the tree isn't the issue...of course, if it were dead or compromised, then, two cranes would be a given.
Further, in this state, many crane companies will not allow riding the ball, even if tied in above. So, because many of the limbs need to tied at or near the balance point (normal for craning anyhow) the company that's doing the work felt they would need a second crane just to rig the limbs. Well, as I said, they obviously didn't feel comfortable or didn't have climbers capable of rappeling out to rig the limbs. Which tells me a lot, as both myself and the other good rigger were confident we could rig the brush on the tree in question. Thus saving many many hours of road closure time... and $ to the city. (The other tree, though, has to be craned in total. No other option.)
So call me a whiner all you want....but that is how the job should have gone down...and, I'm thinking you would agree (and prolly would be up to the task!)...though I don't think You or DWH have experience with these trees.......and I pretty danged sure there are no tree species in this country that present this specific level of challenge---I'm not talking diseased, declining, or dead ones, now...but then, the risk level would also be off the charts as compared to most others.....naturally that's subjective, as there are many many different kinds of hazards that develop with declining trees.
Now, if ya wanna be civil, and polite, maybe we can continue....
if not....well I might exercise the IGGY button,,which would be a first on an arb board for me.....but, what fun would it be then
Roger_Barnett
Participating member
- Location
- Seattle, in the PNWet
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Roger,
I wouldn't mind doing a job like that with you. That would be a good reason to come out and work with you. I'm heading out your way in the Fall, maybe we could figure a job out for then?
[/ QUOTE ]
That would be awesome, Mark! Is it the PNW Tacoma conference?
My knee should be fixed by then (surgery sometime soon...MRI results appointment is Monday) I'll have a Wraptor by then, so maybe I might even get to the top before ya, ya young'un!!
The job would be mundane and a trifle boring, but you might like to help remove a 10 foot diameter giant sequoia....we could sneak around, once inside The Highlands gate, and peer at the mansions......People like Craig McCaw, and some Nordstroms, are among the residents. I dunno what the average property $ value is----$4 million?? Some are prolly wasy way higher....Scads of huge trees....but, I almost never am lucky enough to land clients in there. I'd have to put a bug in my client's ear.....they are thinking of removing the tree...it's lifted the garage corner by a good foot, and the massive root system is impacting the house a bit......Tree is 87 years old, I think...maybe 140-150 feet tall...and might be 80+ yards of chips if we processed all the limbs.
I reckon you might like to run my ported 13 hp 3120........ we could paint half of it white
.......you'd have your choice of 42, 43, 60, and 72 inch bars....but ya might want earplugs underneath your earmuffs.........
Roger,
I wouldn't mind doing a job like that with you. That would be a good reason to come out and work with you. I'm heading out your way in the Fall, maybe we could figure a job out for then?
[/ QUOTE ]
That would be awesome, Mark! Is it the PNW Tacoma conference?
My knee should be fixed by then (surgery sometime soon...MRI results appointment is Monday) I'll have a Wraptor by then, so maybe I might even get to the top before ya, ya young'un!!
The job would be mundane and a trifle boring, but you might like to help remove a 10 foot diameter giant sequoia....we could sneak around, once inside The Highlands gate, and peer at the mansions......People like Craig McCaw, and some Nordstroms, are among the residents. I dunno what the average property $ value is----$4 million?? Some are prolly wasy way higher....Scads of huge trees....but, I almost never am lucky enough to land clients in there. I'd have to put a bug in my client's ear.....they are thinking of removing the tree...it's lifted the garage corner by a good foot, and the massive root system is impacting the house a bit......Tree is 87 years old, I think...maybe 140-150 feet tall...and might be 80+ yards of chips if we processed all the limbs.
I reckon you might like to run my ported 13 hp 3120........ we could paint half of it white
Attachments
- Location
- NJ
[ QUOTE ]
though I don't think he or you have experience with these trees.......and I pretty danged sure there are no tree species in this country that present this specific level of challenge--
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Is your poplar trees that much different than other types of Poplar trees. I assume yours are Populus fremontii, and these anit no different than the cottonwoods we cut. I guess Europe based tree can just grow wild in cali. I'll have to say I've only see afew of these in my life none as big you say yours are. Though I plan a lenghty chat with some teachers about the differance of your trees wood compared to ours. I find it very hard to believe your wood is any less soft than the cottonwoods we cut. I'm egar to learn this info, and be lead to some books.
We do have the eastern and tulip poplar, and I'm very sure that these 2 types of trees are very simular. If I find this out, then I'll say bah, my experience is very lengthy.
though I don't think he or you have experience with these trees.......and I pretty danged sure there are no tree species in this country that present this specific level of challenge--
[/ QUOTE ]
Is your poplar trees that much different than other types of Poplar trees. I assume yours are Populus fremontii, and these anit no different than the cottonwoods we cut. I guess Europe based tree can just grow wild in cali. I'll have to say I've only see afew of these in my life none as big you say yours are. Though I plan a lenghty chat with some teachers about the differance of your trees wood compared to ours. I find it very hard to believe your wood is any less soft than the cottonwoods we cut. I'm egar to learn this info, and be lead to some books.
We do have the eastern and tulip poplar, and I'm very sure that these 2 types of trees are very simular. If I find this out, then I'll say bah, my experience is very lengthy.
Roger_Barnett
Participating member
- Location
- Seattle, in the PNWet
tulip is an entirely different species...tulipifera......soft wood, but far easier to work than our black cottonwood, which can get to well over 200 feet tall, and, while not the largest in girth (plains, fremonti, is) are the largest and fastest growing of all populus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Populus_trichocarpa
The largest I've cut was only 60" dbh, and 6 feet at ground level, but was only 50 years old. We got 5000 board feet out of it, back when cottonwood was used for the center of plywood, and was paying about $350 mbf....They brought two log trucks as they thought they might need the second one to help load the three logs (a full truck).....and a skidder....and they got the wood as payment. Typically a skidder guy would charge a $900 day rate or so.....
Because it so wet out here, black cottonwood grow faster than most other populus, I'm sure...and will usually be hazardous due to the long heavy weak limbs, by the time they're only about 30 years old.
The wood is prolly a tad stronger than lombardy poplar, but usually, lombardies are easier to work on as their growth pattern is vertical.
Here's the huge ones we did summer '08. Search function here doesn't go back that far.......
http://masterblasterhome.com/showthread.php?t=10705&highlight=goes,+big+lombardy+poplar+job
As you can see, we're kinda new at this.....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Populus_trichocarpa
The largest I've cut was only 60" dbh, and 6 feet at ground level, but was only 50 years old. We got 5000 board feet out of it, back when cottonwood was used for the center of plywood, and was paying about $350 mbf....They brought two log trucks as they thought they might need the second one to help load the three logs (a full truck).....and a skidder....and they got the wood as payment. Typically a skidder guy would charge a $900 day rate or so.....
Because it so wet out here, black cottonwood grow faster than most other populus, I'm sure...and will usually be hazardous due to the long heavy weak limbs, by the time they're only about 30 years old.
The wood is prolly a tad stronger than lombardy poplar, but usually, lombardies are easier to work on as their growth pattern is vertical.
Here's the huge ones we did summer '08. Search function here doesn't go back that far.......
http://masterblasterhome.com/showthread.php?t=10705&highlight=goes,+big+lombardy+poplar+job
As you can see, we're kinda new at this.....
- Location
- NJ
Gee I'm sorry like to look at your photos but alast Blaster has banned me from that site. Not that I even care, I never really went to it anyways. Sure do like the fact I'm the top talk on the forum over there though. Knid of a kick in his nutz huh???? I don't even go to his site, bann the guy who aint posted there since 08, and you still have to hear my name. LMAO I'm famous.
Go figure and I didn't even have to lift a finger.
- Location
- NJ
Is that picture of Mark supposed to mean something?????? You do know I was climbing trees for money while he was still fighting over hotwheels cars right?????
Seeing as you seem to want to play show'n tell heres a 1 hour pine attached, I'm leaning on the tree cuase I'm a tad winded, gaffed 80' up took the one top off while crane set up, and opened it for the swing.
Seeing as you seem to want to play show'n tell heres a 1 hour pine attached, I'm leaning on the tree cuase I'm a tad winded, gaffed 80' up took the one top off while crane set up, and opened it for the swing.
Attachments
Roger_Barnett
Participating member
- Location
- Seattle, in the PNWet
Sorry about dat....Twarn't my doin' Too bad the search function doesn't go back that far here.
I'm sure you have a lot to offer......and know your stuff....but, if you tone down your presentation, you'll not alienate those with thin skins....
You may note that I've never called you out before......
Edit.....I'm not as dumb as a rock...yet.... though I may be under one in the (hopefully very) distant future.....I knew Ox posted in the thread, and that he hadn't made 350 posts since then, so, voila, here ya geaux......
http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=136984&page=0&fpart=1&vc=1
I'm sure you have a lot to offer......and know your stuff....but, if you tone down your presentation, you'll not alienate those with thin skins....
You may note that I've never called you out before......
Edit.....I'm not as dumb as a rock...yet.... though I may be under one in the (hopefully very) distant future.....I knew Ox posted in the thread, and that he hadn't made 350 posts since then, so, voila, here ya geaux......
http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=136984&page=0&fpart=1&vc=1
- Location
- NJ
- Location
- NJ
- Location
- NJ
[ QUOTE ]
if you tone down your presentation
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm tring, I did do a really good job in the SRT back up thread
if you tone down your presentation
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm tring, I did do a really good job in the SRT back up thread
Roger_Barnett
Participating member
- Location
- Seattle, in the PNWet
Right arm!!
Farm out...
Interesting smilie.
I'm gonna try to edit more pics and videos from two recent jobs....more cottonwoods.
Including one huge limb that if we had decided to free drop it...as there was a chance, if we lowered it, of the top breaking out...which would mean Dave would be pushing up daisies right now....
and THAT would not have been a good thing.....
Farm out...
Interesting smilie.
I'm gonna try to edit more pics and videos from two recent jobs....more cottonwoods.
Including one huge limb that if we had decided to free drop it...as there was a chance, if we lowered it, of the top breaking out...which would mean Dave would be pushing up daisies right now....
and THAT would not have been a good thing.....
Roger_Barnett
Participating member
- Location
- Seattle, in the PNWet
[ QUOTE ]
Is that picture of Mark supposed to mean something?????? You do know I was climbing trees for money while he was still fighting over hotwheels cars right?????
Seeing as you seem to want to play show'n tell heres a 1 hour pine attached, I'm leaning on the tree cuase I'm a tad winded, gaffed 80' up took the one top off while crane set up, and opened it for the swing.
[/ QUOTE ]
Nah...I'm been feeling bad for never posting the killer shots I got at ITCC Hawaii... Work was so busy back then......
But if you wanna talk experience, I started climbing in 1951.......for money in 1972, and full time in '75.
And I still have plenty to learn....
Is that picture of Mark supposed to mean something?????? You do know I was climbing trees for money while he was still fighting over hotwheels cars right?????
Seeing as you seem to want to play show'n tell heres a 1 hour pine attached, I'm leaning on the tree cuase I'm a tad winded, gaffed 80' up took the one top off while crane set up, and opened it for the swing.
[/ QUOTE ]
Nah...I'm been feeling bad for never posting the killer shots I got at ITCC Hawaii... Work was so busy back then......
But if you wanna talk experience, I started climbing in 1951.......for money in 1972, and full time in '75.
And I still have plenty to learn....
