Hitch hiker/2/x thread

JTree

Well-Known Member
Location
East Texas
I never knew our lines could be ruined by flattening, is that accurate..? I've always heard about "rope flattening devices", but always took it as more of a personal pet peeve than an actual abuse concern. Yeah technically speaking, pinching/crushing/smashing rope between two metal objects should always raise an eyebrow, but aren't our climbing lines as well as devices designed around this exact idea? The idea being that our much needed friction may be applied by pinching it between two smooth/contoured objects, hence they design the rope to be able to take that sort of abuse..?

To follow on others responses, i too see my NER 16 stand flatten like a pancake, but I like it for the same reasons you do J-tree.. I actually just bought a new hank of it VS going with a newer fancy line. Something i don't have to shame myself for NC'ing.

In follow up on the HHX, I've seen mine flatten every rope I've run through it, with 16 strand being flattened the most if memory serves correctly... But again, it's like that by design, if it wasn't ok or ruined rope super fast wouldn't it be shunned by the community just as fast?

I don't mind seeing a rope malshaped so long as the friction device I'm hanging on provides enough friction to continue hanging on the flattened section. Mine fluffed back up given time to relax and dry, tho, so it looks like I'm good. Arbormaster lives to fight another day.
 

JeffGu

Well-Known Member
16-strand ropes like to take on a sort of "rounded square" shape when they're loaded... especially when they're being squeezed or rolled over an edge. I've not seen one stay that way, though.

All mechanicals flatten or distort the rope shape when loaded, but it doesn't seem to do any short term damage to them. I wouldn't doubt that there is long term loss of strength from crushing the core fibers, on some ropes. I think it's just something we have to live with.
 

Joeybagodonuts

Well-Known Member
Location
Boondocks
A section of True Blue has permanently flatten even after numerous attempts to correct it, I imagine Arborplex would be worse with the memory it has.
I think i recall seeing a post from you about that.


Arbormaster lives to fight another day.
That it will.. It's tuff stuff!

I think it's just something we have to live with.
Right.. this is basically the conclusion I've always thought.. it just is what it is..
 

Joeybagodonuts

Well-Known Member
Location
Boondocks
An interesting concept that might improve the initial gripping of this hitch by wrapping the cord further around. If nothing else it gives two additional wear surfaces on the dogbone.
View attachment 62816
Oh.. look at you! That's an interesting trick right there.. i betchya it works pretty good for it's intended purpose!

Is that cordage on the small side of 8mils or is that just an optical illusion.. I picked up some 6mm Ocean Vectran to mess around with & I'm rather suprised ive got it working as a lanyard/climb system with 11m. Especially considering my weight. Obviously its super tiny to grab & manipulate but it's definitely working like any other cordage would.. Just suprised is all, I'm a 10mm guy usually.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
Location
Michigan
It Robline’s Pro Racer cord, it’s 7mm in the picture, but there’s also a 9mm. Polyester, dyneema, and Technora blended together. The stopper knots came about while doing other playing, haven’t had time to try it, hoping someone will give it a try.
 

JTree

Well-Known Member
Location
East Texas
Can anyone tell me why it is so highly recommended that the hhx be used with a swivel? I'm sure this is covered *somewhere*, but my search ninja skills are failing me.
 

rico

Well-Known Member
Location
redwoods
Quick update on the HHX. My HHX is now broken in and I can report that it is wonderful tool that is super smooth on ascent and descent, tends slack EXTREMELY well, is a fucking dream for spar work, and IMHO functions better in DdRT mode than the HH2. Well played Mr. Mumsford!
 
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Joeybagodonuts

Well-Known Member
Location
Boondocks
Can anyone tell me why it is so highly recommended that the hhx be used with a swivel? I'm sure this is covered *somewhere*, but my search ninja skills are failing me.
The swivel is recommended for a few reasons. One- you get the benefits of a swivel. Two- It's more so the captive eye of it that makes the HHX function the best..
It don't have to be a swivel per say, just anything captive that you can thread the long quikie through.. the swiva-eye from RE makes for very easy on & off your bridge.

The most compact way to go while keeping the spine aligned correctly, is a small smc ring, hence the reason it's an option. There's nothing saying you couldn't use a regular swivel there either, it's just a matter of how much you want to fiddle with when detatching.

Quick update on the HHX. My HHX is now broken in and I can report that it is wonderful tool that is super smooth on ascent and descent, tends slack EXTREMELY well, is a fucking dream for spar work, and IMHO functions better in DdRT mode than the HH2. Well played Mr. Mumsford!
Damn..i thought you said it was broken at first glance..
How are you running yours?
Still HRC? Backwards 4wrap?

Is it the captive ring/swivel on the quikie that makes the Ddrt better in your opinion, or something else?
 

rico

Well-Known Member
Location
redwoods
I have been using a standard Hitch Hiker hitch with 3 wraps and HRC. Its lightning quick, tends like a mofo, and I love it. I dont use the supplied swivel/biner and just attach the quickie directly to my bridge ring. The Quickie is kind of a pain in the ass compared to the biner on a HH2 but I like a very compact setup. The supplied swivel/biner just made things too long for me and I fucking hate swivels anywho.

The quickie on the HHX seems to function better than the carabiner on a stock HH2 when in DdRT mode, but if your a running a pulley under your HH2 all bets are off.
 
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JTree

Well-Known Member
Location
East Texas
The swivel is recommended for a few reasons. One- you get the benefits of a swivel. Two- It's more so the captive eye of it that makes the HHX function the best..
It don't have to be a swivel per say, just anything captive that you can thread the long quikie through.. the swiva-eye from RE makes for very easy on & off your bridge.

The most compact way to go while keeping the spine aligned correctly, is a small smc ring, hence the reason it's an option. There's nothing saying you couldn't use a regular swivel there either, it's just a matter of how much you want to fiddle with when detatching.



Damn..i thought you said it was broken at first glance..
How are you running yours?
Still HRC? Backwards 4wrap?

Is it the captive ring/swivel on the quikie that makes the Ddrt better in your opinion, or something else?
Thanks for that reply. What would be the argument against a captive eye biner or a corner trap? Just curious.

I was sort of envisioning a corner trap doodad on the shackle directly to the bridge ring. I just haven't gotten around to putting a California or hydra on my bridge.
 

Joeybagodonuts

Well-Known Member
Location
Boondocks
Thanks for that reply. What would be the argument against a captive eye biner or a corner trap? Just curious.

I was sort of envisioning a corner trap doodad on the shackle directly to the bridge ring. I just haven't gotten around to putting a California or hydra on my bridge.
"I think".. it's more a matter of connector shape argument. The swivel & ring connections may allow more clearance for the long shackle to rotate upwards.. vs a corner trapped biner... is that what your asking?

Also, bridge ring or swivel, the HHx is still using a little round donut trap to keep everything aligned & unbinding. It's sent out like this with extra little donuts. I think what your envisioning, is exactly how it's sent out with the smc ring.. I'm just losing you with the whole hydra/cali swivel part as you can't connect anything captive to them.
 

RBJtree

Well-Known Member
Location
Pittsburgh
If you want easy and quick on and off the harness with the hhx, you need a biner between the shackle and the bridge ring. If you just have a ring on the bridge and but a regular fixed biner between the shackle and the ring, the hhx will be sideways. It works fine like that, but not ideal positioning especially if you want to tend with either hand. With a swivel on the bridge or a swivel biner, it can orient correctly. Or with the shackle straight to the ring it is oriented correctly, but if you need to unclip from the harness for a redirect, ect, you have to remove the shackle and reinstall, which is a bit of a pita in a tree and unless you have everything tethered, there is a chance to drop something and be left with a non functioning device, and possibly no easy way out of the tree. Hence the strong recomendation of the swiveleye. Plus for self tending durring asscent, the ring on the swiveleye makes a good attachment point for the tending system. At least as I understand it.
 

RBJtree

Well-Known Member
Location
Pittsburgh
A swivel on the bridge allows you to connect the hhx with just a biner between swivel and shackle, but not great for tending device because the biner will be either getting bound up and possible cross loaded, and increased sitback if you tend to the bridge swivel. So once again, swiveleye is the best all around solution.
 

JTree

Well-Known Member
Location
East Texas
Other than the decreased bend radius, is there any argument against just clipping the swiveleye directly to the bridge? I can't imagine it would be that much different than the usual bridge ring. At least not the one's I've been using.
 

climbstihl

Well-Known Member
Location
Germany
You could also clip a regular biner from the shackle to the bridge if you don't need the swivel. I do remember reading that the TM instructions tell you not to clip directly to the bridge.
 

Joeybagodonuts

Well-Known Member
Location
Boondocks
Other than the decreased bend radius, is there any argument against just clipping the swiveleye directly to the bridge? I can't imagine it would be that much different than the usual bridge ring. At least not the one's I've been using.
Yes that's the intended purpose.. either the ring version or the swiva connected to your bridge..
Have you happen to see any of the informationals by Richard? There pretty dang informative covering A-Z & the reasoning behind the hardware used.. Watch all of them & you'll have the majority of your questions answered in a manner better than we can do for you... You know what i mean? They are spread throughout his channel by date, but if you search his individual channel, all of them will populate below in the results. There's at least 4 or 5.
 

rico

Well-Known Member
Location
redwoods
Other than the decreased bend radius, is there any argument against just clipping the swiveleye directly to the bridge? I can't imagine it would be that much different than the usual bridge ring. At least not the one's I've been using.
When I do use the swiveleye with the HHX I attach it directly to my rope bridge. Its too long in this configuration so adding a ring just makes it even longer. One of the greatest selling points of the HH is that it is the most compact unicender out there and absolutely kicks ass on a spar. Thats where I make my living!!!
 

JTree

Well-Known Member
Location
East Texas
Yes that's the intended purpose.. either the ring version or the swiva connected to your bridge..
Have you happen to see any of the informationals by Richard? There pretty dang informative covering A-Z & the reasoning behind the hardware used.. Watch all of them & you'll have the majority of your questions answered in a manner better than we can do for you... You know what i mean? They are spread throughout his channel by date, but if you search his individual channel, all of them will populate below in the results. There's at least 4 or 5.
*sigh* yeah.....I guess I'll just have to go through them. I watched a couple of them. It's not that I dislike the fact that the videos exist, but they are time consuming. I figured it would be faster to pull the collective, but if there is real benefit to watching them, I guess I'll plow through them when I get time.
 

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