Hitch hiker/2/x thread

Ok.. so.. I finally got some of that fuzzy HRC to try on this HHX... & What do ya know.. all issues I've had with engagement have disappeared.. the smooth cover of the Drenaline & the fuzzy HRC is the shit!! It grabs like it should & releases like no other 8mm cordage I've experienced.. when i try to collapse the coils, it's almost as if they are greased... Hopefully this don't change much as it wears in..

Also..
This message had been brought to you by the letter H.. the Knut-H!!
 
This Yale 12.6mm Kernmaster / Beeline combo is slippy, it's a super new rope. So maybe it just needs a wash and some wear in time, right now it won't creep from a stop. It does gently slide to a stop when releasing the hitch while bombing. Kinda neat "soft" stop, kinda unsettling feeling like the hitch isn't instantly grabbing.
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Tom Lynch said:
This Yale 12.6mm Kernmaster / Beeline combo is slippy, it's a super new rope. So maybe it just needs a wash and some wear in time, right now it won't creep from a stop. It does gently slide to a stop when releasing the hitch while bombing. Kinda neat "soft" stop, kinda unsettling feeling like the hitch isn't instantly grabbing.
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Try reversing the direction you are wrapping that knut h. As in the video from climbing innovations, Richard pointed out, and I have found it to be true, that if the tails of the hitch cord are parallel to the dog bone slot, the hitch will grab and tend better. So if the spine is facing you, with the knut h wrap around the back, then under, and back the other way across the front, followed by your wraps with the top side tail coming down the spine side. Let me know if it works better, I'm curious if you get the same result I did.
That rope looks nice and thick! I was just thinking I wish they made safari/explorer in 12.5. I'm still using my 13 mm km3 in the hh2 and I love it. Its a bit nubbier than km3 max or kernmaster, so easier to grab, but runs through rope tools slightly less smoothly.
 
RBJtree said:
Try reversing the direction you are wrapping that knut h. As in the video from climbing innovations, Richard pointed out, and I have found it to be true, that if the tails of the hitch cord are parallel to the dog bone slot, the hitch will grab and tend better. So if the spine is facing you, with the knut h wrap around the back, then under, and back the other way across the front, followed by your wraps with the top side tail coming down the spine side. Let me know if it works better, I'm curious if you get the same result I did.
That rope looks nice and thick! I was just thinking I wish they made safari/explorer in 12.5. I'm still using my 13 mm km3 in the hh2 and I love it. Its a bit nubbier than km3 max or kernmaster, so easier to grab, but runs through rope tools slightly less smoothly.
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Now.. I've been coming at it from a different angle.. no pun intended.. I've always felt that wrapping to the spine side made it noticablely harder to tend depending on circumstance... i know Rich has some suggestions specifically for certain hitches, however, it wasn't until Rico mentioned how much easier tending was when wrapping to to bone side that i actually tried it & noticed a huge difference in tending performance.. That's not to say, that in my personal experience, there wasn't a compromise in other aspects though..

I do want to note something i thought was odd in one of his "hitch cord testing" videos that I'm wondering if anyone else picked up on.. In that video where that large selection of hitch cords were being run through & then deliberated on about performance aspects.. He would show how easy it was too tend each selection after landing on the ground.. The issue i saw within that was, on every landing he continued downward with only hand pressure on the device.. In others words, only showcasing the cordage/hitch tending ability after being broken free of any binding weight that would be on it in most situations aloft.. When I'm in the tree, I'm not paying out unweighted slack before trying to tend things.. 99% of the time, that hitch is loaded with my hefty ass. I think that's why all those combos worked so easily on camera. This isn't an attack on him by any means, I could never hold a candle to the content/effort he provides.. It was probably just a matter of expedience/time/filming.. Its just something I've been wondering if anyone else picked up on..
 
About Richard’s testing method, as long as all the hitches are tensioned the same by hand, it is a valid process. If only testing one hitch you would want full body weight, as you’re stating.
 
I have tried both configurations and notice a slight difference. The hitch engagement seems to be more related to the length of the legs and the "finish" or how the lengths differ. If the lower leg of the hitch or the upper leg (to the wraps) engages first. Also how much memory the cordage has. As shown it instantly was engaging, just with not a lot of force. I mostly attribute this to the "waxy" feel of the new rope, also the tighter / slippery jacket. But I will try tieing it opposite next time (& adding a turn), for science! Also, it is kinda unnerving to me to have that much motion that I'm not expecting.

I love that I can throw up a photo and a few words and get all kinds of feedback, speeding up my learning curve and exposing me to new ideas. I'd otherwise never think of!
 
I kinda like that soft stop you were explaining above..
I find i allows me to load the hitch a bit harder without having it bind up & become a dedicated effort to break free after.. obviously there's a soft stop & then there's not enough wraps & slipping... But it sounds as if you close to that happy medium.
 
Tom Lynch said:
This Yale 12.6mm Kernmaster / Beeline combo is slippy, it's a super new rope. So maybe it just needs a wash and some wear in time, right now it won't creep from a stop. It does gently slide to a stop when releasing the hitch while bombing. Kinda neat "soft" stop, kinda unsettling feeling like the hitch isn't instantly grabbing.
View attachment 62587
Click to expand...
If its a little too slippery try shortening up the hitch a little, or have the prussic legs load from the other side (spin the hitch 180 degrees in relation to the HH).
 
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I'm still rocking a HH1. I'm fighting rope flattening. Not a hug issue as of yet, but today it started raining on me and when I hit the flat parts, I'd slide a bit. Not a fast slide or anything, but enough to be more than a bit annoying. I had the same issue out of the BDB. This, more than anything is making me consider going back to the wrench. I really don't want to, but I feel like I am ruining climbing lines....and the cost of new climbing lines is too high to ignore.

Any words of wisdom? Is the HHX more friendly with the pronounced rounded spine? Are yall just embracing flat rope and adjusting your cord/knot selection as the rope flattens? I don't want to give up on the compact multicenders.
 
What rope? Honestly, I have never had rope flatten from using the HH. I have used the HH1, HH2, and the HHX. All have been very rope friendly. I always assumed it was because the rope passed through the hitch last and so was forced into a rounded shape, naturally.

I definitely got flattening from the BDB. Sorry, I know all that is not much help to you.
 
I remember my yale 16 strand flattening with the hh2, I'm not sure it created any issues. I've since upgraded to a 24 strand before I ever wore that rope out so I'm not sure if it had any longevity issues
 
The rope I'm seeing issue with is 16 strand arbormaster. Haven't spent significant time on the hh and any of my double braids as of yet.

I like climbing on 16 strand rope, tho. Not sure why really, TBH. It's bouncy, stretches what feels like 2 feet from unloaded to loaded, and it's not nice on the hands. I just feel like it's more rugged going through a natural crotch. I like that I can see the strength bareing element when I'm inspecting it too.

After the rain passed (only 3 hours) I hopped back on the same rope and it was fine. In fact the rope seemed to have regained it's shape after a brief dry time spread out on the garage floor. Strange. Meh....Imma fly some double braid on the working end of the basal tie tomorrow and see what it does.
 
I have had some flattening from the hh2 on imori. Not a whole lot, but enough to make it start slipping a little. Imori is very soft and easy to flatten. I haven't used it on any 16 strand. It hasn't done anything bad to 11mm km3 max or 13mm km3. But I honestly don't have 100's of hours on any of these ropes with the hh2. The bdb has eventually crushed everything I put it on for a significant amount of time, but it still works good anyway.
 
JTree said:
but I feel like I am ruining climbing lines....and the cost of new climbing lines is too high to ignore.

Any words of wisdom?
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I never knew our lines could be ruined by flattening, is that accurate..? I've always heard about "rope flattening devices", but always took it as more of a personal pet peeve than an actual abuse concern. Yeah technically speaking, pinching/crushing/smashing rope between two metal objects should always raise an eyebrow, but aren't our climbing lines as well as devices designed around this exact idea? The idea being that our much needed friction may be applied by pinching it between two smooth/contoured objects, hence they design the rope to be able to take that sort of abuse..?

To follow on others responses, i too see my NER 16 stand flatten like a pancake, but I like it for the same reasons you do J-tree.. I actually just bought a new hank of it VS going with a newer fancy line. Something i don't have to shame myself for NC'ing.

In follow up on the HHX, I've seen mine flatten every rope I've run through it, with 16 strand being flattened the most if memory serves correctly... But again, it's like that by design, if it wasn't ok or ruined rope super fast wouldn't it be shunned by the community just as fast?
 
A section of True Blue has permanently flatten even after numerous attempts to correct it, I imagine Arborplex would be worse with the memory it has.
 
The last time I used 16 strand climbing lines was when I was still climbing on an MRS and traditional hitchs. Even back then it was not unusual to have uneven wear and shape changes on different lines. I always blamed it on either manufacturing inconsistencies or excessive sectional loading.
 
Joeybagodonuts said:
I never knew our lines could be ruined by flattening, is that accurate..? I've always heard about "rope flattening devices", but always took it as more of a personal pet peeve than an actual abuse concern. Yeah technically speaking, pinching/crushing/smashing rope between two metal objects should always raise an eyebrow, but aren't our climbing lines as well as devices designed around this exact idea? The idea being that our much needed friction may be applied by pinching it between two smooth/contoured objects, hence they design the rope to be able to take that sort of abuse..?

To follow on others responses, i too see my NER 16 stand flatten like a pancake, but I like it for the same reasons you do J-tree.. I actually just bought a new hank of it VS going with a newer fancy line. Something i don't have to shame myself for NC'ing.

In follow up on the HHX, I've seen mine flatten every rope I've run through it, with 16 strand being flattened the most if memory serves correctly... But again, it's like that by design, if it wasn't ok or ruined rope super fast wouldn't it be shunned by the community just as fast?
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I don't mind seeing a rope malshaped so long as the friction device I'm hanging on provides enough friction to continue hanging on the flattened section. Mine fluffed back up given time to relax and dry, tho, so it looks like I'm good. Arbormaster lives to fight another day.
 
16-strand ropes like to take on a sort of "rounded square" shape when they're loaded... especially when they're being squeezed or rolled over an edge. I've not seen one stay that way, though.

All mechanicals flatten or distort the rope shape when loaded, but it doesn't seem to do any short term damage to them. I wouldn't doubt that there is long term loss of strength from crushing the core fibers, on some ropes. I think it's just something we have to live with.
 
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