Vision Changes and Issues Connected to Them

Bart_ said:
I was inspecting some mechanical equipment some years ago already and I thought a panel and it's structural bar were bent. Turned out it was the warpage of my fairly strong prescription in high index plastic (lighter) lenses. Was a sad eureka moment for me. A real case of "get some glasses, ref!" - your sight is bonafide degraded. When looked at dead center on axis the warpage wasn't present. This might affect other people too. If you swap a slightly older prescription or frame set of glasses on your world re-warps. Sliding your glasses up/down your nose re-warps the world too.

Lots of us in the vision club.
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Changing lenses really does make a difference. I wear contact lenses full time, have for 20 years now, and my vision is pretty decent with them on. I do have very poor depth perception though, which has always been a challenge working aloft. I’ve learned to compensate for it, either by measuring more things, for example measuring the length of my landing zone, to be sure a top/spar will fit, or taking very small pieces to ensure they will fit in the space available.

I still bump into things on occasion though, mostly skinny branches, as I cannot judge the distance from them hardly at all (I have no idea how far away that clothesline is unless I look at the posts on the ends!)

Put on my glasses though, and I have trouble walking upright. I won’t even try to drive with my glasses, I probably wouldn’t keep the truck on the road! That change of lenses, though still the same prescription, really throws me off.
 
southsoundtree said:
Sorry to hear it, everyone.





A plumb-bob,clinometer app and measuring tape may help when eyeballing trees is not working as it used to.
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I meant to mention, a stick-on 2-dimension bubble-level that sticks on the bar or starter or clutch cover, provided they are parellel to the bar.



Level cuts are more difficult on steep ground/ bad footing. I don't recall who suggested this, but someone else posted on the TH that it worked a treat.
 
southsoundtree said:
I meant to mention, a stick-on 2-dimension bubble-level that sticks on the bar or starter or clutch cover, provided they are parellel to the bar.



Level cuts are more difficult on steep ground/ bad footing. I don't recall who suggested this, but someone else posted on the TH that it worked a treat.
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If you have large enough dogs on your saw, you can stick them on there and you are matched with the bar.
 
Good post... raw honesty.... I've had some serious WTF moments myself this year.... Watching the bucket truck rolling backward down the drive with no one behind the wheel and thereby facing a split-second decision to run for the rolling truck to get on the brake pedal or just cringe and stand there to watch it go by-by down the hill.

Not sure about the vision thing, but I swear it doesn't take a lot of time off the game to lose your edge. I've made so many little oversights this year. What might be considered little errors, but in this biz a little error can be fatal... I've had to remind myself to slow down and re-think things before making any technical moves.

Brain fade with age must have something to do with it, but I think it's more that with decades of consistent work, the brain gets wired up to be thinking about all the million possible things that could go wrong at any given moment, and that there is always a mostly unconscious program running just below our normal level of consciousness, where all our past experience is stored and new data processed to plug into the equation of what is the fastest, easiest, safest way to accomplish this task. Every experienced arb has those wheels turning every moment of the day, but it's not something we are generally aware of.

Then we take some time off and when we get back the brain is no longer spending all that bandwidth to constantly run that program and so without noticing we have lost our edge. AND IN THIS BUSINESS... THAT'S HUGE!!!!

It's the same thing with driving around town. I used to know without a second thought how to get from any given part of my territory to any other part. It was automatic. Truck clearance, bridges, traffic at that time of day, possible DOT checkpoints to avoid, even down to which side of the street would be best to come from to chip or back into the driveway. Then I stopped plowing snow and cleaning 250 gutters every fall, and greatly expanded my territory and began relying on GPS, and the next thing you know I'm wondering if I'm losing my mind because I have to stop and think about the best way to get from point A to point B when It's only a few miles down the road. I decided that it was not my brain losing function, it was just that I was used to driving around the same roads all day every day for decades, and then I wasn't so my brain didn't need to store that info.
 
rico said:
My momma told me that I was gonna go blind if I kept cuffing my dummy. Instead of taking her advice I decided to do it till I just needed glasses...

Seriously though, I am in the same boat Steve. 2 major surgeries in the last 2 years and my vision has fallen off the map. Is it old age, too much anesthesia, a combination of both, the fucking vaccine, or something else? I do know that there is a percentage of the population who bodies have a very hard time clearing anesthesia from their nervous system, and for some it is almost impossible without help..I recently had some genetic testing done and wouldn't you know it I have a mutation that make it very difficult, if not impossible, for me to deal with anesthesia. Armed with this info I have recently begun working on my methylation pathways and supporting my liver with herbs, caster oil packs, and binders, and in less than a week I already see a positive shift in my vision. I am also using an eye chart (like the one at the eye doctor or DMV) to exercise my eye, which reportedly can help..Keep you posted.
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Work on the microbiome. Gut health is crucial. You sound like you've done your homework so you probably don't need much advice. PM me if you want more.
 
My eyes are just starting to slowly change, a little more effort focusing on things. It changes with my mood and lighting. This thread has been eye opening though, as the person who I worked with for 8 years wore safety bifocals. So many details I never thought about are becoming very clear, like his reluctance to work in the rain, measuring out face cuts on critical felling and more... I'm not sure if this was calculated by him due to vision issues or just subconscious work around as his eyes were never very good and relied on glasses since a kid (and saved him from the draft).
 
Great thread Steve - thanks for starting this.
There is hope though - I backcountry skied for years with a guy that was basically blind in one eye. He was an absolutely superb skier, even in steeps in tight trees (Ski Good or Eat Wood). So maybe there's hope for us all as we try and get our brains to adapt (and they do - to different focal lengths and prescriptions etc.) and keep productive. Good sleep/ rest sure helps too. In regards to Daniel's comment above, recognizing my own forgetting, I'm trying to slow down this year (no autopilot) and have even thought about a checklist (with little pictures?) as a reminder to load up harness with toys for the climb (I tend to climb sometimes with the kitchen sink) - easy to forget stuff if I'm gabbing away with the HO's. And I'm trying to use fewer gadgets (remember the hikers constantly staring at their GPS and then they walked off a cliff?) London cabbies have to know their town to get a permit. Maybe for some things we're relying too much on the silicon screen? Anyway, this thread has sure given me lots to think about. Thanks all.
Cheers
 
colb said:
Steve, my near vision has been declining for three years and it kinda sucks, lol.

Just to offer for your consideration, do you think that the guys out there felling all the time are also good TreeMek operators? Is it realistic to expect felling skills to remain high if we are off doing other things and don't have to fell trees for our doughnuts? Btdubs, I'm climbing less than a dozen times a year now. It's crazy.

When I followed and studied capuchin monkeys for a year in Raleighvallen National Park in Suriname I noticed that I was really present in it, compared to those who had been out there and returned home. They would forget small details like how many days a round of gouda would last without refrigeration,, and they could not know which monkey was aging out of a certain behavior. I realized as the time approached for me to leave that I would never again be as legit at field work as I was the last time I left the monkeys at day's end. As I got on the plane, my frame of reference was starting to change and - without motivation to excel in the field, since I was leaving - I was starting to forget small details. Those who remained were the legit field workers and I no longer belonged, like I wanted to.

When I leave a position in our industry, I cannot ever return to where I was. I might become a climber again, or a pure feller, but I''ll come to it as a different person, like re-reading a book and not recognizing it because my frame of reference changed from being a teenager to being a parent since I last read it. The only thing for it - for me - is to use the energy of that impossible-to-fulfill longing-to-return as a way to motivate me to become all I can be in my new circumstance. A lot of this last paragraph is a paraphrase or reframing of a four podcast series about Leo Messi. It was made immediately prior to the World Cup by Jazmine Garsd.

I wish you success in processing your current experience. Thanks for sharing so much with me and The Buzz over the last decade I've been here.
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Wow. You always operate in a space that makes me want to read everything twice. That was beautiful and so insightful. Why don't I know you were doing field work with monkeys in South America? I agree with your initial question......the question I have been asking is..............is being a good operator enough for me? I don't know. I have been asking this question a lot as of late.
Those who remained were the legit field workers and I no longer belonged, like I wanted to.
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I'm struggling to accept that I no longer belong like I wanted to. I was sorta in the belonging club for a while but I am still clinging to those thoughts and feelings even though I'm no longer there. Its difficult to explain. Leaving "the field" has left an empty spot in my "me" and it hurts. Much like the retirement from the FD. Both things I felt part of, and felt good at, are gone and it's starting to effect me. Its been a tough 8-10 months.

I love the reading analogy and I identify with what you are saying. I threw all my energy into the new thing and attained a level I'm proud of. Mission accomplished, now what? Still comes back to, maybe its not my calling, maybe climbing is, maybe neither are. Even if I went back to climbing....after aging 5 years it could never be the same as it was. Not saying it wouldn't be great. Perhaps I'm just clinging to the past.

I appreciate you and our friendship over the last decade. I soak in the insight.
 
Bart_ said:
I was inspecting some mechanical equipment some years ago already and I thought a panel and it's structural bar were bent. Turned out it was the warpage of my fairly strong prescription in high index plastic (lighter) lenses. Was a sad eureka moment for me. A real case of "get some glasses, ref!" - your sight is bonafide degraded. When looked at dead center on axis the warpage wasn't present. This might affect other people too. If you swap a slightly older prescription or frame set of glasses on your world re-warps. Sliding your glasses up/down your nose re-warps the world too.

Lots of us in the vision club.
Click to expand...
Interesting. During my rethinking process I've considered a look without the glasses and to move and get a different angle for the view. I do notice difference between all my glasses. Especially the wraps.
 
evo said:
My eyes are just starting to slowly change, a little more effort focusing on things. It changes with my mood and lighting. This thread has been eye opening though, as the person who I worked with for 8 years wore safety bifocals. So many details I never thought about are becoming very clear, like his reluctance to work in the rain, measuring out face cuts on critical felling and more... I'm not sure if this was calculated by him due to vision issues or just subconscious work around as his eyes were never very good and relied on glasses since a kid (and saved him from the draft).
Click to expand...
Interesting. Look at the post with RICO and look at my post after with the link. Maybe exercising your eyes could delay the process for you for a while. My eye decline is directly related to the amount of time on a smart phone. When my laptop died and I couldn't replace it, I spent 2 years using the phone as my computer. That did me in. The rain sucks when you need to see for sure. I had safety bifocals also. A super small corrective area that they do for the military. Those rocked. Everything was good until I need a full RX.
 
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ghostice said:
Great thread Steve - thanks for starting this.
There is hope though - I backcountry skied for years with a guy that was basically blind in one eye. He was an absolutely superb skier, even in steeps in tight trees (Ski Good or Eat Wood). So maybe there's hope for us all as we try and get our brains to adapt (and they do - to different focal lengths and prescriptions etc.) and keep productive. Good sleep/ rest sure helps too. In regards to Daniel's comment above, recognizing my own forgetting, I'm trying to slow down this year (no autopilot) and have even thought about a checklist (with little pictures?) as a reminder to load up harness with toys for the climb (I tend to climb sometimes with the kitchen sink) - easy to forget stuff if I'm gabbing away with the HO's. And I'm trying to use fewer gadgets (remember the hikers constantly staring at their GPS and then they walked off a cliff?) London cabbies have to know their town to get a permit. Maybe for some things we're relying too much on the silicon screen? Anyway, this thread has sure given me lots to think about. Thanks all.
Cheers
Click to expand...
Great reply. Interesting to see everyones different but similar take on the situation. GPS and Pokemon, the doom for screen addicts. Good luck on your mental exercises.
 
Reach said:
Changing lenses really does make a difference. I wear contact lenses full time, have for 20 years now, and my vision is pretty decent with them on. I do have very poor depth perception though, which has always been a challenge working aloft. I’ve learned to compensate for it, either by measuring more things, for example measuring the length of my landing zone, to be sure a top/spar will fit, or taking very small pieces to ensure they will fit in the space available.

I still bump into things on occasion though, mostly skinny branches, as I cannot judge the distance from them hardly at all (I have no idea how far away that clothesline is unless I look at the posts on the ends!)

Put on my glasses though, and I have trouble walking upright. I won’t even try to drive with my glasses, I probably wouldn’t keep the truck on the road! That change of lenses, though still the same prescription, really throws me off.
Click to expand...
SO true. The change can almost be nauseating for a while. It was so difficult to adjust to progressives. Spent a couple days feeling car sick while sitting still. I cant imagine the distance issue you have. Thats tough
 
Daniel said:
Good post... raw honesty.... I've had some serious WTF moments myself this year.... Watching the bucket truck rolling backward down the drive with no one behind the wheel and thereby facing a split-second decision to run for the rolling truck to get on the brake pedal or just cringe and stand there to watch it go by-by down the hill.

Not sure about the vision thing, but I swear it doesn't take a lot of time off the game to lose your edge. I've made so many little oversights this year. What might be considered little errors, but in this biz a little error can be fatal... I've had to remind myself to slow down and re-think things before making any technical moves.

Brain fade with age must have something to do with it, but I think it's more that with decades of consistent work, the brain gets wired up to be thinking about all the million possible things that could go wrong at any given moment, and that there is always a mostly unconscious program running just below our normal level of consciousness, where all our past experience is stored and new data processed to plug into the equation of what is the fastest, easiest, safest way to accomplish this task. Every experienced arb has those wheels turning every moment of the day, but it's not something we are generally aware of.

Then we take some time off and when we get back the brain is no longer spending all that bandwidth to constantly run that program and so without noticing we have lost our edge. AND IN THIS BUSINESS... THAT'S HUGE!!!!

It's the same thing with driving around town. I used to know without a second thought how to get from any given part of my territory to any other part. It was automatic. Truck clearance, bridges, traffic at that time of day, possible DOT checkpoints to avoid, even down to which side of the street would be best to come from to chip or back into the driveway. Then I stopped plowing snow and cleaning 250 gutters every fall, and greatly expanded my territory and began relying on GPS, and the next thing you know I'm wondering if I'm losing my mind because I have to stop and think about the best way to get from point A to point B when It's only a few miles down the road. I decided that it was not my brain losing function, it was just that I was used to driving around the same roads all day every day for decades, and then I wasn't so my brain didn't need to store that info.
Click to expand...
Thanks for responding Daniel. Couple interesting points. Some of what you are talking about with the back of the brain work is Heuristics. It's a pretty cool concept of how we take mental shortcuts based on previous experiences and knowledge. Sometimes its great, sometimes not. Its not exactly what you are talking about but kinda. I wrote an article from my EXPO talk about Heuristic Traps and how they play into accidents in our industry. I think its next months issue. I find it pretty interesting and something nobody considers when looking at safety in out industry or many others. If you read it, I'd love your feedback and that of others with decades in the game.

As for the driving and GPS. I don't think we purge the information because we dont need it. I think we are no longer exercising that part of the brain and it has atrophy. Sort of like those muscles you stop using as often because you no longer do that activity. I think if you were to put some time into trying the nonGPS thing on a trip or two a day, you'd eventually progress to where you were when you didn't have a GPS. I never needed a list until I made lists. Now I cant function without a list. I cant even remember phone numbers because they're in my phone. I can Damn sure tell you my phone number for the house I lived in from age 6months old to 14. 201-464-8072. Good old South St New Providence NJ. OI think if we don't use it we loose it. Some of those stories are pretty scary. Hope you get a break from that and have lots of high brain function stories next time!
 
Steve Connally said:
Thanks for responding Daniel. Couple interesting points. Some of what you are talking about with the back of the brain work is Heuristics. It's a pretty cool concept of how we take mental shortcuts based on previous experiences and knowledge. Sometimes its great, sometimes not. Its not exactly what you are talking about but kinda. I wrote an article from my EXPO talk about Heuristic Traps and how they play into accidents in our industry. I think its next months issue. I find it pretty interesting and something nobody considers when looking at safety in out industry or many others. If you read it, I'd love your feedback and that of others with decades in the game.

As for the driving and GPS. I don't think we purge the information because we dont need it. I think we are no longer exercising that part of the brain and it has atrophy. Sort of like those muscles you stop using as often because you no longer do that activity. I think if you were to put some time into trying the nonGPS thing on a trip or two a day, you'd eventually progress to where you were when you didn't have a GPS. I never needed a list until I made lists. Now I cant function without a list. I cant even remember phone numbers because they're in my phone. I can Damn sure tell you my phone number for the house I lived in from age 6months old to 14. 201-464-8072. Good old South St New Providence NJ. OI think if we don't use it we loose it. Some of those stories are pretty scary. Hope you get a break from that and have lots of high brain function stories next time!
Click to expand...
Please link it here when it comes out. Thanks again for the wesspur informational I hope to see more of that from you and them. What you bring to the table is a great value to the industry
 
Thanks @evo I'll try to remember. I've been after @Mark Chisholm to get my most recent patient assessment article up on the site for a while but that guy is so busy and everybody wants something from him. Its a solid article and the subject from the Wesspur short is covered in more detail.
 
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