evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
If you ever get out this way I’ll give you a tour, and hopefully it would line up with a cabling job.
real tree work
- Thread starter Daniel
- Start date
- Status
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
Loud and clear, if my opinion is warranted I would have advocated locking the thread at post #1
Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
All your contributions to this thread .... above is page one
page 2
page 4
page 5....
the above is your total contribution to this thread.... Between you and the others who spew ugliness, it's amazing any aspect of tree work gets discussed... Every time I start a thread you just barf the same garbage all over it.. do you think anyone really wants to hear that? Do you feel good about yourself when you climb into bed at night? Like you got something accomplished? When I say pathetic, that's what I AM talking about... This is how you choose to live your life. Have you nothing better to do?
I try to ignore it, but it definitely hurts the container and retards the conversation. People with something to say get intimidated and walk.
And it takes 5 pages for Tom to put a lid on it... what great moderation...
And back to the subject of tree work.. Did they really change the definition of thinning? that's mind-blowing...
- Location
- Retired in Minneapolis
You don't have a clue.
My first inclination was at #7
Would you be happy with that?
Explain why your last posts shouldn't be considered bickering..without bickering.
data farm 26
Been here a while
- Location
- Casablanca
It's crazy what the internet has done to the human mind both collectively and individually. We will likely never fully understand what happened.
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
I'm surprised you didn't at post #7, and more surprised you haven't banned on post #103
southsoundtree
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Olympia, WA
People only s_it all over one member's thread.
What is the commonality?
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Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
I haven't put in a lot of thru rods, but enough. My take on it is that pattern shouldn't matter.... the steel should be strong enough to easily handle anything the tree can throw at it once the cables are in... once the cables are in the tree can't force the crotch open, but the destructive power to the split (already started in the branch union) comes as the two stems twist side to side, back and forth, in the wind. I have seen one large well-cabled oak split right down to the ground from about 20'. the split didn't open, but it still traveled down the trunk to the crown.
Once we understand that the thru rods are not there to hold the stems together, it's much easier to believe that they will easily stop the twisting motion from tearing down the stem... I honestly don't think placement matters much either. I think that we should just get two rods in wherever we can most easily accomplish that with one of them above the split, but not necessarily above the crotch, and the other at or above the lowest point showing a crack.
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evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
Placement matters
Reason for installing matters
Above the union matter
Size does matter
Been a thing with data backing it up for more than a little while now.
Matias
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Butte County
Yea, you gotta learn from other people's mistakes- you'll never live long enough to make them all yourself.
Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
I'd like to see it...
One might technically or theoretically be stronger than the other, but if both are sufficient to do the job, then it doesn't matter...
How many people have actually seen a thru bolt fail?
The only one I ever saw fail was between two trees.. big white oak..
you're not going to find that in the books..
One might technically or theoretically be stronger than the other, but if both are sufficient to do the job, then it doesn't matter...
How many people have actually seen a thru bolt fail?
The only one I ever saw fail was between two trees.. big white oak..
you're not going to find that in the books..
Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
Science doesn;t mind being questioned.. dogma does
This is all you have?....
" Between you and the others who spew ugliness, it's amazing any aspect of tree work gets discussed... Every time I start a thread you just barf the same garbage all over it.. do you think anyone really wants to hear that? Do you feel good about yourself when you climb into bed at night? Like you got something accomplished? When I say pathetic, that's what I AM talking about... This is how you choose to live your life. Have you nothing better to do? "
Daniel Murphy, the above narrative reads exactly the way I figured you would respond. It reeks of your narcissistic personality, where anyone who rebukes you publicly for your lack of skill or blatant lack of understanding simple physics , which is very obvious a lot of the time, you get bent out of shape and hostile. I am so fortunate we have never met. There have only been two people in all these years on treebuzz that I have no desire to interact personally with and you are one of them. Your lack of understanding simple physics is clear in post #108 where you write this.....
" Once we understand that the thru rods are not there to hold the stems together, it's much easier to believe that they will easily stop the twisting motion from tearing down the stem... I honestly don't think placement matters much either. I think that we should just get two rods in wherever we can most easily accomplish that with one of them above the split, but not necessarily above the crotch, and the other at or above the lowest point showing a crack. "
" Between you and the others who spew ugliness, it's amazing any aspect of tree work gets discussed... Every time I start a thread you just barf the same garbage all over it.. do you think anyone really wants to hear that? Do you feel good about yourself when you climb into bed at night? Like you got something accomplished? When I say pathetic, that's what I AM talking about... This is how you choose to live your life. Have you nothing better to do? "
Daniel Murphy, the above narrative reads exactly the way I figured you would respond. It reeks of your narcissistic personality, where anyone who rebukes you publicly for your lack of skill or blatant lack of understanding simple physics , which is very obvious a lot of the time, you get bent out of shape and hostile. I am so fortunate we have never met. There have only been two people in all these years on treebuzz that I have no desire to interact personally with and you are one of them. Your lack of understanding simple physics is clear in post #108 where you write this.....
" Once we understand that the thru rods are not there to hold the stems together, it's much easier to believe that they will easily stop the twisting motion from tearing down the stem... I honestly don't think placement matters much either. I think that we should just get two rods in wherever we can most easily accomplish that with one of them above the split, but not necessarily above the crotch, and the other at or above the lowest point showing a crack. "
But hey you carry on, you always do. What I do with my life in or out of the trees has no relevence to you thankfully. You just need to do you. I have a beautiful life and live in one of the most peaceful parts of the world. Just saying.....now go and brush up on your reading Tom needs his questions answered.
Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
Ya Swing,
Your ugly posts and the island vibe seem quite a strange combination... Whatever it is that you are so hateful towards me about is just a mirror. When you have that kind of hate inside you, there's something "not beautiful" about you and your life. It's tough to rebut a statement of pure slander when it's made without supporting evidence. Ad hominem attacks are generally a sign of weakness in one's argument. When the facts aren't on your side, just throw mud.
As far as lack of skills goes: You have put zero cables in... SO we're about 1,000 to zero in that department. Thru rods probably 25 to zero. So there's that. And here a guy who has never put in a thru rod tells me I don't understand physics because I question industry standards on the subject, as if industry standards have never been changed before. If anyone wants to discuss the physics let's do it.... ship masts and lumber for construction projects do not necessarily translate to trees swaying in the wind.
Then you said I was too fat to prune a tree: "You sure can't, you are too fat and not athletic enough. Plus you are all talk. ". That's slander. It's actually illegal. Under Pennsylvanian law, a private figure defamation plaintiffs must prove that their respective defendants willingly made false statements of fact or acted negligently by broadcasting or publishing the contested comments. I have put up a dozen or more videos of reduction pruning on very large trees, and hundreds of other videos. And I've published two articles in TCI magazine. That's not all talk. By contrast, what have you done to forward the industry?
Here's the description on the video of the oak that was "tucked in" with reduction pruning on the long over-reaching side limbs. I like the before and after on this video best because there was room to stand back and show the entire tree on this 80' oak. Posted again here with the description on YouTube
This large oak was standing out in the front yard by itself. The client asked me to elevate the entire tree. While I was happy to reduce and elevate the limbs growing over the street to allow 12-15' of clearance for vehicles, if I had removed lower limbs on the west side of the trunk, the tree would be subjected to some brutal late afternoon summer sun. Full sun beating on the trunk when it's 102 degrees on a late July afternoon will stress the tree tremendously. If there are other trees growing on the western side to shade the trunk then it's not as important, but here it was very important. The lower limbs on the western side of the tree also protect the roots from overheating.I took a lot of weight off the lower horizontal limbs on at least the bottom half of the canopy but made no cuts on the top. Tress evolved to grow up in the a wooded environment. Planting a tree where there is wide open space to grow, whether it be over the road, or the roof, the swimming pool, or just open lawn area is a very unnatural setting. Trees evolved to compete for light and when the tree has open sky in one or more directions, it will tend to reach for the light, often outgrowing it's ability to support it's larger horizontal limbs, which will succumb in a wind or ice storm. Even summer limb drop is usually the result of unchecked growth of large horizontal limbs. Taking some weight off the ends of these limbs is a good way to protect them from storm damage. The amount of weight and length to take off will depend on the species, health and age of the tree, as well as the structural integrity of the limb, how overgrown it is, and the potential it has to damage property if it fails. The folks who claim to be experts in developing standards for tree care have admitted that they don't know how to codify the judgments needed to determine how much to take off any given limb. So they just don't teach the practice of reduction pruning on horizontal limbs. That has unfortunately done a disservice to the industry as pruning practices have continued to emphasize elevation and "crown cleaning", thinning, as well as the removal of adventitious sprouts, all of which are very detrimental to the long-term health of trees. I was happy the client listened to my suggestions and allowed me to leave the lower limbs on the west side of this tree. Of course reduction pruning is much easier to perform from a bucket truck than when climbing. If you were climbing this tree, you would need to limb walk out to each branch tip and make the desired cuts from a challenging body position. I theorize that pruning practices have developed to remove entire limbs back to the main stem or stems because it was simply easier to make these cuts from rope and saddle. But now that bucket trucks are more common in the industry, the mindset of arborists is slow to change. I hope this video offers a glimpse into my world. I used to go up and gut trees by removing inner branches, but no more.
Your ugly posts and the island vibe seem quite a strange combination... Whatever it is that you are so hateful towards me about is just a mirror. When you have that kind of hate inside you, there's something "not beautiful" about you and your life. It's tough to rebut a statement of pure slander when it's made without supporting evidence. Ad hominem attacks are generally a sign of weakness in one's argument. When the facts aren't on your side, just throw mud.
As far as lack of skills goes: You have put zero cables in... SO we're about 1,000 to zero in that department. Thru rods probably 25 to zero. So there's that. And here a guy who has never put in a thru rod tells me I don't understand physics because I question industry standards on the subject, as if industry standards have never been changed before. If anyone wants to discuss the physics let's do it.... ship masts and lumber for construction projects do not necessarily translate to trees swaying in the wind.
Then you said I was too fat to prune a tree: "You sure can't, you are too fat and not athletic enough. Plus you are all talk. ". That's slander. It's actually illegal. Under Pennsylvanian law, a private figure defamation plaintiffs must prove that their respective defendants willingly made false statements of fact or acted negligently by broadcasting or publishing the contested comments. I have put up a dozen or more videos of reduction pruning on very large trees, and hundreds of other videos. And I've published two articles in TCI magazine. That's not all talk. By contrast, what have you done to forward the industry?
Here's the description on the video of the oak that was "tucked in" with reduction pruning on the long over-reaching side limbs. I like the before and after on this video best because there was room to stand back and show the entire tree on this 80' oak. Posted again here with the description on YouTube
This large oak was standing out in the front yard by itself. The client asked me to elevate the entire tree. While I was happy to reduce and elevate the limbs growing over the street to allow 12-15' of clearance for vehicles, if I had removed lower limbs on the west side of the trunk, the tree would be subjected to some brutal late afternoon summer sun. Full sun beating on the trunk when it's 102 degrees on a late July afternoon will stress the tree tremendously. If there are other trees growing on the western side to shade the trunk then it's not as important, but here it was very important. The lower limbs on the western side of the tree also protect the roots from overheating.I took a lot of weight off the lower horizontal limbs on at least the bottom half of the canopy but made no cuts on the top. Tress evolved to grow up in the a wooded environment. Planting a tree where there is wide open space to grow, whether it be over the road, or the roof, the swimming pool, or just open lawn area is a very unnatural setting. Trees evolved to compete for light and when the tree has open sky in one or more directions, it will tend to reach for the light, often outgrowing it's ability to support it's larger horizontal limbs, which will succumb in a wind or ice storm. Even summer limb drop is usually the result of unchecked growth of large horizontal limbs. Taking some weight off the ends of these limbs is a good way to protect them from storm damage. The amount of weight and length to take off will depend on the species, health and age of the tree, as well as the structural integrity of the limb, how overgrown it is, and the potential it has to damage property if it fails. The folks who claim to be experts in developing standards for tree care have admitted that they don't know how to codify the judgments needed to determine how much to take off any given limb. So they just don't teach the practice of reduction pruning on horizontal limbs. That has unfortunately done a disservice to the industry as pruning practices have continued to emphasize elevation and "crown cleaning", thinning, as well as the removal of adventitious sprouts, all of which are very detrimental to the long-term health of trees. I was happy the client listened to my suggestions and allowed me to leave the lower limbs on the west side of this tree. Of course reduction pruning is much easier to perform from a bucket truck than when climbing. If you were climbing this tree, you would need to limb walk out to each branch tip and make the desired cuts from a challenging body position. I theorize that pruning practices have developed to remove entire limbs back to the main stem or stems because it was simply easier to make these cuts from rope and saddle. But now that bucket trucks are more common in the industry, the mindset of arborists is slow to change. I hope this video offers a glimpse into my world. I used to go up and gut trees by removing inner branches, but no more.
Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
Here's another unlisted video on apical dominance:
Shadowscape
Been here a while
- Location
- far north
Gad, what an ego! I've never met someone quite so in love with the sound of his own voice.
flushcut
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Delavan, WI
Threads like this I wish everybody was in a room together. Lol
What happened to the popcorn smiley?
Carry on gentlemen the entertainment is priceless.
What happened to the popcorn smiley?
Carry on gentlemen the entertainment is priceless.
Shadowscape
Been here a while
- Location
- far north
What Dan Murphy wants is for the rest of the world to say he is absolutely right about whatever it is he is saying, and he won't quit until he hears that, which is why he doesn't quit. I have not been around here long, but it didn't take me but a few minutes to get his motives. He dreams of being that person people reference when discussing a tough situation.
What he will end up being is the fellow that made everybody leave Tree Buzz for another arborist forum.
Why else would he hang around a place he calls a cesspool?
What he will end up being is the fellow that made everybody leave Tree Buzz for another arborist forum.
Why else would he hang around a place he calls a cesspool?
And this was the perfect opportunity for me to use the popcorn smiley emoji just once before I die.Threads like this I wish everybody was in a room together. Lol
What happened to the popcorn smiley?
Carry on gentlemen the entertainment is priceless.
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