ISA and religion

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I am correct in what i read right?

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No.


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I have no problem with the "secularness" of the ISA only the attitude of some toward my beliefs.

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As long as their attitude is their personal view, you'll have to deal with it. On the other hand I would oppose any effort by an official agent of the ISA to take a position for or against your beliefs.


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so if a guy sits with my Christian friends and i to eat lunch and we pray together and offend him then are we violating ISA policy?

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I don't know that ISA has any official policy on this issue. You and your friends are free do whatever you like as an individual or a group of individuals at any ISA event. What you should not do is use an official position in ISA to promulgate your personal religious views.
 
A moment of reflection and calm can be a good thing. I've seen this at ISA events, but never with specific denominational references, like JC or Yahweh or the Soaring Rigatoni Angels.

It's weird that people refer to religion and Christianity as if they were synonymous. I'm avidly religious--Buddhism has snuck into detective articles, and sikhism and biogenics and arborism and more, from the movable feast of faiths.

Christianity is there in the mix, good stuff like humility and charity. Hard to argue with love thy neighbor as you love yourself, but that is seldom followed in 2012, in the good old narcissistic US of A.
 
Well I'm not one of "THOSE" Christians, they get on my nerves. I'm Just a follower of The Way. I prefer to pray alone, although true power comes when people unite over a subject and pray about it. But all this is for another thread. This is about someone getting offended at lunch time prayer and the ISAs stance on that organized prayer.

Semantics I know, but what becomes organized? If I plan a prayer meeting before a comp is that "organized" in the eyes of the ISA? If so does that violate policy of the organization?
 
"Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; and being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him." (Heb. 5:9.)

We see how all of the human family are getting their knowledge by contact and actual experience with sin and its penalty--misery and death. And we believe, as we have previously expressed, that the heavenly creatures--angels and arch-angels, are learning the same lessons by watching man's experiences. Thus mankind in general, and the church in particular, is made a "spectacle to angels." (1 Cor. 4:9.)
 
I don't want someone telling me what to pray or believe, surely not the ISA. Hell they are still arguing about topping bradfords for crying out loud! :-) All I want is what is considered organized; because a couple of friends and i are considering having a prayer meet/worship before the comps and conventions on sundays.
 
Jeff,
I don't think it's a matter of someone telling you what to pray/believe, that is up to every individual. In my eyes, it is usually someone getting up and saying "let us pray" or something to that effect, while some present may be uncomfortable and not necessarily want to participate. I personally think it is distasteful, in the sense that the they are assuming that everyone shares their belief and would like to be a part of it... A more pc way to go about it would be at a group gathering/comp/etc if someone wants to lead a prayer, announce that there will be a prayer in 5 minutes in an area and all who like are welcome. I respect others beliefs and they should respect mine. I'll pray to the temple of the trees, but if you would not like to join in, I do not want you to feel bad for walking away.
 
But the more I think about it, the more it bothers me. We are potentially alienating non-Christians every time we do this.

Dude, seriously everyone, including you needs to stop worrying about offending others. You CHOOSE to be offended. You choose to be uncomfortable, take responsiblity for your universe and see that its all you. If you or anyone else wishes to feel alienated its your choice. ISA shouldn't need an official policy on this because its you and anyone else who is "uncomfortable" about this. Tolerance is not just some BS left wing tripe. Live it.
 
GlennButler, who I understand to be strongly Christian in his beliefs has this right.

The ISA is a secular organisation and should not espouse a religious belief one way or the other.

This fact does not preclude individuals from praying privately or with groups of like minded observers, however they would be well advised to follow the cautionary advice of one Jesus Christ from his famed Sermon on the Mount at Matthew 6:5-8, in his preface to the Lord's Prayer.

I'm as tolerant as you can possibly imagine, if you wish to pray alone or as a group I will respectfully allow you space and time to do so, in fact if you need to bow to Mecca while you do so and lack a ground covering, I will lend you a blanket. But if you attempt to lead ME in prayer, I will make farting sounds with my armpit throughout the entire proceeding.

Northwind
 
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I don't want someone telling me what to pray or believe

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No one is doing this.


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All I want is what is considered organized

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Are you acting in an official capacity (volunteer or paid) at an ISA or chapter event? Yes? Then keep your religious views to yourself. No? Then perform whatever religious acts you like.


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GlennButler, who I understand to be strongly Christian in his beliefs has this right.

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I have purposefully omitted any statements about my religious views. My personal feelings about the ultimate causes of the universe are irrelevant to this discussion.
 
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I don't want someone telling me what to pray or believe

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No one is doing this.


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All I want is what is considered organized

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Are you acting in an official capacity (volunteer or paid) at an ISA of chapter event? Yes? Then keep your religious views to yourself. No? Then perform whatever religious acts you like.


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GlennButler, who I understand to be strongly Christian in his beliefs has this right.

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I have purposefully omitted any statements about my religious views. My personal feelings about the ultimate causes of the universe are irrelevant to this discussion.

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Your logic is impeccable, your clarity of thought enviable. One can only hope the target audience can follow along.

Northwind
 
Interesting thread. I have been to a fair amount of Wisconsin Arborist Association gatherings as well as the last four TCIA expos. I don't recall prayer before meals at any of them.
 
Jeff, did you even read my original post? I clearly said I would be fine with the people at my table asking to pray together before the meal. Same would go for a few friends praying together for a safe contest, as long as none of them stands up as an official of the event and prays over a loudspeaker at gear check or something like that. Organize all you want. Unofficially.

This is about the ISA inviting a local pastor to speak from the dais before the luncheons. It is an official part of the program. Sometimes I rather like what they come up with, but other times I feel like I've been forced into a sermon. I don't like sermons. That's why I don't go to church.

In both cases, it's not just about me. I might enjoy a fairly non-denominational call to tend God's garden. On the other hand, a Muslim might feel his beliefs are being attacked and decide this is not the organization for him. We must remember we live in a pluralist society and not everyone at our events is going to be like us--and, according to what I was taught about America as a kid, that is a good thing.

Here's an example: I have attended Catholic churches a couple of times with friends. I was a welcome guest (and decidedly Christian at the time) but their rituals were unfamiliar. When they started reciting the liturgy, standing, kneeling, taking communion--all that was fine, but it wasn't "my" religion and I politely sat and observed as an outsider.

That's fine at a Catholic church, but I do not want to feel like an outsider at ISA events. I am a member here, same as the Christians, and I should not be made to feel separate from the proceedings.
 
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