- Location
- Tonimbuk, Victoria, Australia
Thanks for the information
Hitch Hiker
- Thread starter bonner1040
- Start date
chris_girard
Branched out member
- Location
- Gilmanton, N.H.
Funny
I like it!
I like it!
- Location
- Renton, WA USA
[ QUOTE ]
What hitch cord are you using? With smaller hitch cord the stoppers will definitely be more difficult to get out.
The stopper that comes tied in the beeline that came with my HH seems way easier to untie than the way I would tie a stopper. I just made sure to duplicate the way it came tied and now I'm tying all stoppers that way. At least I think I am!
[/ QUOTE ]
I have been using HRC but spent a few hours today on the HH and the beeline it came with.
It's true the cord it came with is easier to dealt with in terms of tying it short and unties much easier.
I liked how the hrc worked better, but I guess it's all about compromises. Might try the orignal cord for a while more....
In terms of stopper knots, interesting about what the instructions to the ergo say is an incorrect stopper on their bridge.
What hitch cord are you using? With smaller hitch cord the stoppers will definitely be more difficult to get out.
The stopper that comes tied in the beeline that came with my HH seems way easier to untie than the way I would tie a stopper. I just made sure to duplicate the way it came tied and now I'm tying all stoppers that way. At least I think I am!
[/ QUOTE ]
I have been using HRC but spent a few hours today on the HH and the beeline it came with.
It's true the cord it came with is easier to dealt with in terms of tying it short and unties much easier.
I liked how the hrc worked better, but I guess it's all about compromises. Might try the orignal cord for a while more....
In terms of stopper knots, interesting about what the instructions to the ergo say is an incorrect stopper on their bridge.
chris_girard
Branched out member
- Location
- Gilmanton, N.H.
[ QUOTE ]
In terms of stopper knots, interesting about what the instructions to the ergo say is an incorrect stopper on their bridge.
[/ QUOTE ]
Same thing with the TreeMOTION. It is a double overhand stopper knot tied in the traditional way and they say that the method that we are using to tie the double overhand stopper knot on the HH is the incorrect method.
Like I said before, I do not believe this to be true.
In terms of stopper knots, interesting about what the instructions to the ergo say is an incorrect stopper on their bridge.
[/ QUOTE ]
Same thing with the TreeMOTION. It is a double overhand stopper knot tied in the traditional way and they say that the method that we are using to tie the double overhand stopper knot on the HH is the incorrect method.
Like I said before, I do not believe this to be true.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
In terms of stopper knots, interesting about what the instructions to the ergo say is an incorrect stopper on their bridge.
[/ QUOTE ]
Same thing with the TreeMOTION. It is a double overhand stopper knot tied in the traditional way and they say that the method that we are using to tie the double overhand stopper knot on the HH is the incorrect method.
Like I said before, I do not believe this to be true.
[/ QUOTE ]
This is more about untying and stationary setting than whether the stopper will hold under load.
A bridge, when the time comes to replace it, can just be cut off. The standard setting of the Double Overhand knot under load sets hard. This is good on a bridge that will not need to be retied, once adjusted, to the right length.
The hitch on the Hitch Hiker needs a knot that will set under load but still be easily loosened for length adjustment or resetting.
Even though both knots start the same, the way they are set makes a big difference on how they untie after being loaded.
Dave
[ QUOTE ]
In terms of stopper knots, interesting about what the instructions to the ergo say is an incorrect stopper on their bridge.
[/ QUOTE ]
Same thing with the TreeMOTION. It is a double overhand stopper knot tied in the traditional way and they say that the method that we are using to tie the double overhand stopper knot on the HH is the incorrect method.
Like I said before, I do not believe this to be true.
[/ QUOTE ]
This is more about untying and stationary setting than whether the stopper will hold under load.
A bridge, when the time comes to replace it, can just be cut off. The standard setting of the Double Overhand knot under load sets hard. This is good on a bridge that will not need to be retied, once adjusted, to the right length.
The hitch on the Hitch Hiker needs a knot that will set under load but still be easily loosened for length adjustment or resetting.
Even though both knots start the same, the way they are set makes a big difference on how they untie after being loaded.
Dave
chris_girard
Branched out member
- Location
- Gilmanton, N.H.
Scroll half way down in my original Hitch Hiker thread to read Mahk's comments and his ISA article as well.
http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/showflat.p...true#Post334618
http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/showflat.p...true#Post334618
- Location
- Bellingham
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I was REALLY against the stopper knot/backbone idea at first.
After using the HH as much as I have I wouldn't trade mine in for a model that utilized eye2eye cords. There are too many advantages to the dogbone. Fine tuning the hitch length being foremost and cost/ease of replacing used cords and trying new ones being a close second.
It IS different but that doesnt mean we HAVE to change it just so it fits in the nice comfortable box we are used to. I can set/unset my HH with gloves on and have never had any problems breaking the stopper knot on the adjustable side of my hitch cord.
Just my .02
[/ QUOTE ]
Actually I said eye to eyes but what I would defintely use is tied knots for tunability (and cost).
I like my cord kind of snug and it takes me fiddling to get the stopper knot close enough to suit me. And untying the stopper after a 100 ft descent (seems like the stopper is set even tighter with HTP) takes me more time than I am happy about. Was kind of cursing that yesterday again.
Maybe I am just not skilled enough with stopper knots. Maybe there is something I can insert into the knot while tying to make it untie easier...like a small loop of throwline
So still dreaming about some sort of way to slide on/off a pretied knot/eye on the right side but have it secure. I would love that.
But since no one else feels the same way, it's likely a personal problem.
[/ QUOTE ]
I definitely feel you, man. It would be sweet if the dogbone just had snaps on the sides so a eye to eye could clip right on. You could also have it be a flat rod with large screws that lock the eyes in place, but there would need to be some smart engineering to make that feel safe...
And of course, what that would do to overall strength and performance would be something you'ld only be able to find out after putting all the work into building it, and could be totally not worth it.
Would be pretty cool to see someone try.
Ian
[ QUOTE ]
I was REALLY against the stopper knot/backbone idea at first.
After using the HH as much as I have I wouldn't trade mine in for a model that utilized eye2eye cords. There are too many advantages to the dogbone. Fine tuning the hitch length being foremost and cost/ease of replacing used cords and trying new ones being a close second.
It IS different but that doesnt mean we HAVE to change it just so it fits in the nice comfortable box we are used to. I can set/unset my HH with gloves on and have never had any problems breaking the stopper knot on the adjustable side of my hitch cord.
Just my .02
[/ QUOTE ]
Actually I said eye to eyes but what I would defintely use is tied knots for tunability (and cost).
I like my cord kind of snug and it takes me fiddling to get the stopper knot close enough to suit me. And untying the stopper after a 100 ft descent (seems like the stopper is set even tighter with HTP) takes me more time than I am happy about. Was kind of cursing that yesterday again.
Maybe I am just not skilled enough with stopper knots. Maybe there is something I can insert into the knot while tying to make it untie easier...like a small loop of throwline
So still dreaming about some sort of way to slide on/off a pretied knot/eye on the right side but have it secure. I would love that.
But since no one else feels the same way, it's likely a personal problem.
[/ QUOTE ]
I definitely feel you, man. It would be sweet if the dogbone just had snaps on the sides so a eye to eye could clip right on. You could also have it be a flat rod with large screws that lock the eyes in place, but there would need to be some smart engineering to make that feel safe...
And of course, what that would do to overall strength and performance would be something you'ld only be able to find out after putting all the work into building it, and could be totally not worth it.
Would be pretty cool to see someone try.
Ian
I hear what you all are saying, though the HH has totally exposed the incredible effect of only minimal differences in hitch cord length for different users, all given the same materials to work with. In other words, the only variables being the climber and the length between stopper knots.
It's a bit of a catch 22. I just have to refer to the amount of time it took me to find the right climb line/hitch cord combo for DdRT, never mind all the new SRT configurations. You just have to stick with it and try try try until it works...for now. I'm sure the innovation will come along!
It's a bit of a catch 22. I just have to refer to the amount of time it took me to find the right climb line/hitch cord combo for DdRT, never mind all the new SRT configurations. You just have to stick with it and try try try until it works...for now. I'm sure the innovation will come along!
[ QUOTE ]
...It's a bit of a catch 22. I just have to refer to the amount of time it took me to find the right climb line/hitch cord combo for DdRT, never mind all the new SRT configurations. You just have to stick with it and try try try until it works...
[/ QUOTE ]
This is sound advice.
While testing a pre-production prototype, I used a grizzly spliced eye-to-eye hitch. I thought it worked great. However, after using the dogbone that allows small hitch length adjustments, I would never go back. There is just no way you can milk the full potential out of the Hitch Hiker with a fixed length hitch.
Dave
...It's a bit of a catch 22. I just have to refer to the amount of time it took me to find the right climb line/hitch cord combo for DdRT, never mind all the new SRT configurations. You just have to stick with it and try try try until it works...
[/ QUOTE ]
This is sound advice.
While testing a pre-production prototype, I used a grizzly spliced eye-to-eye hitch. I thought it worked great. However, after using the dogbone that allows small hitch length adjustments, I would never go back. There is just no way you can milk the full potential out of the Hitch Hiker with a fixed length hitch.
Dave
Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
[ QUOTE ]
It is its own knot. The 'HH Knot' or 'HH Stopper'
[/ QUOTE ]
I have been having some thoughts on the HH Stopper knot, it is probably not a big deal but with so many using the HH now I could see someone having an issue.
I like the HH stopper knot because it is easy to use but it also easily comes untied. I'm wondering if the Stevedore stopper was considered.
My HH stopper knot research. If you get bored at least skip to about 12:45
It is its own knot. The 'HH Knot' or 'HH Stopper'
[/ QUOTE ]
I have been having some thoughts on the HH Stopper knot, it is probably not a big deal but with so many using the HH now I could see someone having an issue.
I like the HH stopper knot because it is easy to use but it also easily comes untied. I'm wondering if the Stevedore stopper was considered.
My HH stopper knot research. If you get bored at least skip to about 12:45
Interesting video, Yoyoman
I haven't noticed the double overhand HH stopper knot loosening up in use. Then again, I've long been content (25 years) using a simple bowline as a termination knot on my climbing line (BlueStreak or SafetyBlue High Vee) even though an anchor hitch or double fisherman's would be more "secure".
I haven't noticed the double overhand HH stopper knot loosening up in use. Then again, I've long been content (25 years) using a simple bowline as a termination knot on my climbing line (BlueStreak or SafetyBlue High Vee) even though an anchor hitch or double fisherman's would be more "secure".
- Location
- Orange, MA
Used it today for the first real serious prune job.
All I can say is; amazing.
Kudos to pctree and bonner on a fantastic tool!
All I can say is; amazing.
Kudos to pctree and bonner on a fantastic tool!
bonner1040
Branched out member
- Location
- Boston
I didn't do anything! Don't thank me.
- Location
- Orange, MA
I thought you were in on the R&D, hence all the videos? Either way, super job!
Only ran into a few snags, but just first timer woes. Rope walked up a cinched line, worked a bit on the way up, tied in up top with a ring/ring and butterfly, redirected 2-3 times in this big beauty sugar maple, and it certainly made things easier, and most of all, safer. If you were to have climbed ddrt, definitely would have been in danger of taking some huge whippers while repositioning, but not srt! ;-)
Only ran into a few snags, but just first timer woes. Rope walked up a cinched line, worked a bit on the way up, tied in up top with a ring/ring and butterfly, redirected 2-3 times in this big beauty sugar maple, and it certainly made things easier, and most of all, safer. If you were to have climbed ddrt, definitely would have been in danger of taking some huge whippers while repositioning, but not srt! ;-)
bonner1040
Branched out member
- Location
- Boston
I was lucky enough to finally bother Paul enough to buy a early production model. The video content is really a result of being enamored with the system and a love of producing the video content. Plus I think Pauls a stand up guy and I thought it might help.
Usually, when I send Paul an email with 5 questions I get one answer, lucky for me his phone number was on his website
Like anything I use I have offered my opinions on it, but the vision, production and research wasnt one bit mine.
If anyone deserves recognition for helping with R&D its probably Dave. I would hate to take credit where it wasnt due.
Usually, when I send Paul an email with 5 questions I get one answer, lucky for me his phone number was on his website
Like anything I use I have offered my opinions on it, but the vision, production and research wasnt one bit mine.
If anyone deserves recognition for helping with R&D its probably Dave. I would hate to take credit where it wasnt due.
Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
[ QUOTE ]
Used it today for the first real serious prune job.
All I can say is; amazing.
Kudos to pctree and bonner on a fantastic tool!
[/ QUOTE ]
I too played in my favorite white oak today, up and down a bunch of times, SRT up DdRT and SRT down, so easy to switch, went way out on a little limb with a great 3:1 MA, so easy to return, it is very compact, easy to set up and feels so comfortable in the tree.
It is brilliant!
Used it today for the first real serious prune job.
All I can say is; amazing.
Kudos to pctree and bonner on a fantastic tool!
[/ QUOTE ]
I too played in my favorite white oak today, up and down a bunch of times, SRT up DdRT and SRT down, so easy to switch, went way out on a little limb with a great 3:1 MA, so easy to return, it is very compact, easy to set up and feels so comfortable in the tree.
It is brilliant!
- Location
- Smoky Mountains
Has anybody tried this? I tried it out yesterday and it worked very well. The object is being able to work both sides of a large canopy. This is a crude set up, using stuff I had on hand at the moment. I would say that you could use a pinto pulley on the HH carabiner to avoid having your drt line rub against the ascent line if it rotated as you worked.
In case it doesn't make sense in the photo, I climed srt on the HH, once in position, I installed a drt system onto the HH carabiner and routed the line to the opposite side of the tree. I worked that side then came down to the line, pulled out the stopper knot and my drt line and pulled the HH down with the additional line and micro pulley...worked the other side of the tree SRT on the HH. I doubt I am the first person to think of this but I haven't seen it.
In case it doesn't make sense in the photo, I climed srt on the HH, once in position, I installed a drt system onto the HH carabiner and routed the line to the opposite side of the tree. I worked that side then came down to the line, pulled out the stopper knot and my drt line and pulled the HH down with the additional line and micro pulley...worked the other side of the tree SRT on the HH. I doubt I am the first person to think of this but I haven't seen it.
Attachments
Interesting concept, Tenn. What about setting multiple routes through the crown by tying in another line for SRT use? You can add in an Alpine Butterfly and Tie in a second line by using a double Sheet Bend in the eye if the Butterfly. You can route the second line by tossing it (with some skill & luck) through the desired path of the other side of the tree and run SRT on both sides.
- Location
- Cleveland, OH
Hey guys,
This may have come up already, but keep an eye out for this little jam-up. My tether for advancing the HH while ascending worked its way over the top of the frame, and kept the carabiner from pinching on the line properly when loaded. It didn't cause a problem, as it was cockeyed enough to make me notice it. I'm going to shorten it up more, and see how it works, but I wonder how short it needs to be, if it keeps walking around the carabiner when inverted.
This may have come up already, but keep an eye out for this little jam-up. My tether for advancing the HH while ascending worked its way over the top of the frame, and kept the carabiner from pinching on the line properly when loaded. It didn't cause a problem, as it was cockeyed enough to make me notice it. I'm going to shorten it up more, and see how it works, but I wonder how short it needs to be, if it keeps walking around the carabiner when inverted.
Attachments
- Location
- Smoky Mountains
Overpaid, I don't think it needs to be that long. Might solve your problem. Thanks though!
Oceans - Yeah, It is probably somewhat overdone. I really just wanted to try it after it popped into my head. The system could be streamlined a bit with the use of a smaller line for the HH retrieval...probably several other things for that matter.
Definitely not the only way to do it but It seemed quick enough to set up. I haven't tried the alpine butterfly but it seems like it might be difficult to retrieve two lines with multiple redirects?? Also I didn't have to reset my HH in the tree which was great...
Oceans - Yeah, It is probably somewhat overdone. I really just wanted to try it after it popped into my head. The system could be streamlined a bit with the use of a smaller line for the HH retrieval...probably several other things for that matter.
Definitely not the only way to do it but It seemed quick enough to set up. I haven't tried the alpine butterfly but it seems like it might be difficult to retrieve two lines with multiple redirects?? Also I didn't have to reset my HH in the tree which was great...
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