Fu*%face Von Clownstick

Muggs said:
Coke or Pepsi. You can have absolutely any drink you want. Whatever you want. As long as it's a Coke. Or a Pepsi.
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Muggs said:
The fake Left/Right narrative is an intentional false dichotomy designed by the elites to divide and conquer. And it is working beautifully.
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Where would you put Trump in all this? He certainly isn’t left or right, so is he an elite, or is he simply a good old fashioned existential threat to America?
 
rico said:
Where would you put Trump in all this? He certainly isn’t left or right, so is he an elite, or is he simply a good old fashioned existential threat to America?
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He is a narcissist who has been talking about political aspirations for decades. He is an opportunist who found a way to cash in on the disaffected viewpoints of millions of Americans who have been feeling for 30 years or more that the people at the top were intentionally putting foreign interests ahead of domestic ones. I think people voted for him because he was an actual political outsider and he said he was going to approach things differently. And after decades of mismanagement by "professional" politicians, I think people just figured what the hell, lets see what this guy does. There are an awful lot of people who just want to burn things down. On both sides of the aisle, by the way.

It was also the red hat/blue hat game. It was clear to me that a red hat was going to win, after 8 years of blue hats. I don't think that it really mattered if it was DJ or anybody else, I think a red hat was going to get in. That's not how things go historically in the long run of course, but that's how they've gone since 1992. 8 years of blue, followed by 8 years of red, rinse and repeat. I just think Trump in 2016 was a product of the times.

As far as Trump from 2016 to now, I have no idea. He's off the rails. What was he trying to accomplish? No idea. Where did all the nonsense come from about him sticking up for Christian ideals or some such nonsense? No idea. I can tell you, from a media perspective, as someone outside the US, that the media has long portrayed the red hats as imbeciles. Dubya was just supposed to be some southern hick. Red hats are portrayed as dummies, blue hats are portrayed as sophisticated. Control the media, control the narrative.

I also feel like, as far as the media narrative is concerned, the very fabric of reality itself was torn in two the day that Trump was elected. Half of the country were lead to believe that they were living under Hitler himself (literally Hitler!!). And if that's what you believed then it seems perfectly justified to react the way that people did. The world now has two very separate realities, again, as far as the media narratives are concerned. I understand this myself all too well. The emergence of the biosecurity dictatorship under the pretenses of covid-1984, including the suspension of freedom of association, freedom of travel, freedom of worship, freedom of commerce, and freedom of bodily autonomy, were all things that I could never imagine I would ever see in my lifetime. Meanwhile, the Normals were going around saying things like "if it saves just one life!". This is exactly what I'm talking about with 2 separate, parallel realities.

I think for me what it really boils down to is this: what if DJ is thrown in jail tomorrow. Do the problems go away? Is it really Trump that's the problem? He only came on scene in 2016. Was everything just fine before then? If they finally "got him", does that change the fact that, at least as far as online communication is concerned, one half of the country hates the other half, and that the feeling is mutual?

Ultimately I just wish people would stop looking to government to solve their problems. That is the root cause of most of this insanity, as far as I'm concerned.
 
It is pretty clear that I do not like Trump, but I have friends who are trumpsters, and though I can’t for the life of me understand how they have been so mind-fucked by this grifter, I certainly don’t hate them, and they certainly don’t hate me.

And yes, if a president loses an election, refuses to leave office, and uses the power of the presidency in an attempt to overturn the election, committing multiple felonies in the process, then he is a big fucking problem.
 
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Muggs said:
He is a narcissist who has been talking about political aspirations for decades. He is an opportunist who found a way to cash in on the disaffected viewpoints of millions of Americans who have been feeling for 30 years or more that the people at the top were intentionally putting foreign interests ahead of domestic ones. I think people voted for him because he was an actual political outsider and he said he was going to approach things differently. And after decades of mismanagement by "professional" politicians, I think people just figured what the hell, lets see what this guy does. There are an awful lot of people who just want to burn things down. On both sides of the aisle, by the way.

It was also the red hat/blue hat game. It was clear to me that a red hat was going to win, after 8 years of blue hats. I don't think that it really mattered if it was DJ or anybody else, I think a red hat was going to get in. That's not how things go historically in the long run of course, but that's how they've gone since 1992. 8 years of blue, followed by 8 years of red, rinse and repeat. I just think Trump in 2016 was a product of the times.

As far as Trump from 2016 to now, I have no idea. He's off the rails. What was he trying to accomplish? No idea. Where did all the nonsense come from about him sticking up for Christian ideals or some such nonsense? No idea. I can tell you, from a media perspective, as someone outside the US, that the media has long portrayed the red hats as imbeciles. Dubya was just supposed to be some southern hick. Red hats are portrayed as dummies, blue hats are portrayed as sophisticated. Control the media, control the narrative.

I also feel like, as far as the media narrative is concerned, the very fabric of reality itself was torn in two the day that Trump was elected. Half of the country were lead to believe that they were living under Hitler himself (literally Hitler!!). And if that's what you believed then it seems perfectly justified to react the way that people did. The world now has two very separate realities, again, as far as the media narratives are concerned. I understand this myself all too well. The emergence of the biosecurity dictatorship under the pretenses of covid-1984, including the suspension of freedom of association, freedom of travel, freedom of worship, freedom of commerce, and freedom of bodily autonomy, were all things that I could never imagine I would ever see in my lifetime. Meanwhile, the Normals were going around saying things like "if it saves just one life!". This is exactly what I'm talking about with 2 separate, parallel realities.

I think for me what it really boils down to is this: what if DJ is thrown in jail tomorrow. Do the problems go away? Is it really Trump that's the problem? He only came on scene in 2016. Was everything just fine before then? If they finally "got him", does that change the fact that, at least as far as online communication is concerned, one half of the country hates the other half, and that the feeling is mutual?

Ultimately I just wish people would stop looking to government to solve their problems. That is the root cause of most of this insanity, as far as I'm concerned.
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Good stuff Muggs. Agree with pretty much all of that.
 
Muggs said:
He is a narcissist who has been talking about political aspirations for decades. He is an opportunist who found a way to cash in on the disaffected viewpoints of millions of Americans who have been feeling for 30 years or more that the people at the top were intentionally putting foreign interests ahead of domestic ones. I think people voted for him because he was an actual political outsider and he said he was going to approach things differently. And after decades of mismanagement by "professional" politicians, I think people just figured what the hell, lets see what this guy does. There are an awful lot of people who just want to burn things down. On both sides of the aisle, by the way.

It was also the red hat/blue hat game. It was clear to me that a red hat was going to win, after 8 years of blue hats. I don't think that it really mattered if it was DJ or anybody else, I think a red hat was going to get in. That's not how things go historically in the long run of course, but that's how they've gone since 1992. 8 years of blue, followed by 8 years of red, rinse and repeat. I just think Trump in 2016 was a product of the times.

As far as Trump from 2016 to now, I have no idea. He's off the rails. What was he trying to accomplish? No idea. Where did all the nonsense come from about him sticking up for Christian ideals or some such nonsense? No idea. I can tell you, from a media perspective, as someone outside the US, that the media has long portrayed the red hats as imbeciles. Dubya was just supposed to be some southern hick. Red hats are portrayed as dummies, blue hats are portrayed as sophisticated. Control the media, control the narrative.

I also feel like, as far as the media narrative is concerned, the very fabric of reality itself was torn in two the day that Trump was elected. Half of the country were lead to believe that they were living under Hitler himself (literally Hitler!!). And if that's what you believed then it seems perfectly justified to react the way that people did. The world now has two very separate realities, again, as far as the media narratives are concerned. I understand this myself all too well. The emergence of the biosecurity dictatorship under the pretenses of covid-1984, including the suspension of freedom of association, freedom of travel, freedom of worship, freedom of commerce, and freedom of bodily autonomy, were all things that I could never imagine I would ever see in my lifetime. Meanwhile, the Normals were going around saying things like "if it saves just one life!". This is exactly what I'm talking about with 2 separate, parallel realities.

I think for me what it really boils down to is this: what if DJ is thrown in jail tomorrow. Do the problems go away? Is it really Trump that's the problem? He only came on scene in 2016. Was everything just fine before then? If they finally "got him", does that change the fact that, at least as far as online communication is concerned, one half of the country hates the other half, and that the feeling is mutual?

Ultimately I just wish people would stop looking to government to solve their problems. That is the root cause of most of this insanity, as far as I'm concerned.
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I agree with some of what you said, and disagree with some. Trump needs to go to jail for trying to overturn the election; hording classified documents and showing them to friends; not turning over classified documents when asked by the Government. Prison needs to happen. Will it change anything? No, but it will show others that a coup of our Government is not going to happen and it is not taken lightly.
I agree that people need to quit looking to the Government to solve their problems, but that really is not what it is about. People need to pick someone to lead the country in a direction they think it needs to go, and that is what should be happening. But sadly it has become a popularity contest where ideas and leadership have gone by the wayside and no one says what they think should be done, but instead just knock whoever is running against them. Pound the other guy down so you look better than they. I have no interest in wanting a president who just badmouths other people when they are running for the office.
I'm for a test to be able to vote, because clearly a lot of people have no idea what the Constitution actually says other than they can carry a gun if they want to. And it seems most have little understanding of how the Government works.
Trump got elected because he was popular with the masses on his reality TV show for yelling and screaming at people. Why anybody with half a brain watched that crap is beyond me, but that is one of the reasons he became popular. Then his lies about building a wall and having Mexico pay for it got the anti-Mexicans crossing the border people all worked up. And why they believed he was capable of making Mexico pay for something he wanted to build is totally beyond my comprehension. Just more brainless masses. A test that includes the key parts of our constitution is needed in order to vote, but since the idiot masses would have to vote on that, it isn't going to happen either.
Our Supreme Court has turned into a circus of politicians rather than judges that interpret the law. It seems it is always reds against blues in all forms of government these days instead of, let's get together and compromise on the issues. It is just bash the other side and try and discredit them. We are in a bad way at the moment, and I fear for the wellbeing of our country. If I was 20 years younger I would leave because I think it is only going to get worse. But I am too old now and will ride it out. And I think we have gone way overboard with the 2nd Amendment and guns. It says, In order to maintain a well regulated militia... We have a well regulated militia, it is called the military and the reserves. We don't need Joe Schmo walking around with a concealed handgun who has no idea how it works, or how to be safe with it, or what the laws say he can do with it, because he is the one I am most terrified of.
 
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Muggs said:
He is a narcissist who has been talking about political aspirations for decades. He is an opportunist who found a way to cash in on the disaffected viewpoints of millions of Americans who have been feeling for 30 years or more that the people at the top were intentionally putting foreign interests ahead of domestic ones. I think people voted for him because he was an actual political outsider and he said he was going to approach things differently. And after decades of mismanagement by "professional" politicians, I think people just figured what the hell, lets see what this guy does. There are an awful lot of people who just want to burn things down. On both sides of the aisle, by the way.
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While I can accept that trump merely exposed the hate, racism, economic/social inequity, and misogyny that already existed, he is massively responsible for nurturing those social issues from the presidential bully-pulpit (which he had no right to do per his oath of office). Was a percentage of Germans predisposed to Hitler's machinations? Yes. Was it the best path for Germany or its people? History would indicate not. Like Hitler, trump made it acceptable to hate openly, and to violently crush one's opponents. "Heil Hitler!" "Trump sent us!" It's all the same . . .

So, yes, punishing trump and his helpers is probably the most important (and patriotic) thing that the U.S. can do to right itself. Will putting them down save us from ourselves? No, we need to accomplish that with a massive and far-reaching reality check.

Honestly, when I learn that someone (a friend, a family member, a stranger) still supports trump, I lose almost all respect for them--and trust in them. To support trump is to hate and disparage much of what I (and my forebears) believe in. For me, it's not OK for anyone to rationalize another vote for trump (or disantis, or any of these other vicious, hatemongers) by stating that they have a right to disagree politically, and to vote for any candidate they choose. When you hire an employee, do you assign the same value to each candidate, or do you assess their behavior and accomplishments?

To be a credible presidential candidate, one must have a firm knowledge of history, government, ethics, and be able to read a daily briefing that hasn't been watered down to a one-page, large-print summary. Has trump ever (accurately) framed any of his opinions or decisions in a comprehensive historical context? No? Then he is not qualified to be president--and never was. Therefore, one does our country a dangerous disservice by voting for him.

Meanwhile, to go on thinking that trump is (ever was) a political outsider is nonsense, for he has used legal loopholes and political connections to steal from, and destroy, others throughout his life. In any case, why should any of us be willing to forfeit our own principles, our ability to reason, and our responsibilities as U.S. citizens in the name of any one person!

Trump is a criminal--a selfish, rabid animal who should be caged to help ensure public safety. That way, his followers (and the world) will see that our country's soul is still intact--and that buying ever more guns for the next coup is not the answer. Just ask proud-boy Enrique Tarrio, who might now be jailed for 30 years. As he should be. (I'd make him and trump bunk-mates.)

Again, will punishing trump and his cohorts solve all of the inequities that led to him being elected in the first place? Absolutely not! Will it send a message that we still believe in fairness, justice, human rights, equitable education, and each other? It will.
 
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Muggs said:
Meanwhile, the Normals were going around saying things like "if it saves just one life!".
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“whoever saves one life, saves the world entire”

We all like to piss and moan about all the suffering and inconvenience we had to endure during covid, but maybe, just maybe, all those covid measures saved the life of one of your loved ones?
 
covid.cdc.gov

COVID Data Tracker

CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.
covid.cdc.gov

I also think it’s interesting to note that according to the CDC, more than 92% of voting age Americans have gotten vaccinated. That means that a lot of the folks screaming about computer chips that fit through needles and somehow had enough power to send a tracking signal mostly all got vaxed. A statistically significant percentage of Trump voters do care about their neighbors, even if they spew hate speech when interviewed.
 
I didn't care if you did not want to wear a mask during covid, that was your right. What I did care about was you spreading it to me. That is just being a stupid individual with no caring for other people's lives. You carried, MY RIGHTS beyond yourself that could kill other people who have rights as well. Just selfish complaining for the sake of saying you have rights. Fuck all you who refused to wear a mask in the grocery store, or other public places. I suppose if you had smallpox, you would do the same. Bastard assholes.
As a side note, I lost four good friends to covid. And no, they were not all old. One was 19 and one was 43.
 
We all recognize the faulty logic of this argument, whether we care to admit it or not. Hundreds of people die in the US every year in swimming pool accidents. Where are the public demands for health officials and bureaucrats to force the closure of all backyard swimming pools?

We can all agree that if we forced every single driver and passenger in vehicles on the roads to wear full body harnesses and helmets, similar to NASCAR, and we reduced the speed limits on the roads by 80%, that we would save hundreds of thousands of lives. Hell, we could prevent every, single, fatality and injury on the roads, if we could just force everybody to stop driving. But we don't do it. Why? Maybe because somewhere, in some tiny little back pocket of our brains, we all understand that life involves risk.

There are literally thousands of things that government over-reach could force on the population that would save a lot more than just one life.
 
And millions of people weren’t forced to get vaccinated and chose to accept the perceived risks and get vaccinated anyway. The vitriol around the notion of getting vaccinated was over the top, and not backed up with action. Unless you think the CDC just makes up those numbers to deceive people into thinking that not all magats are as shitty as they purport themselves to be.
 
Muggs said:
We all recognize the faulty logic of this argument, whether we care to admit it or not. Hundreds of people die in the US every year in swimming pool accidents. Where are the public demands for health officials and bureaucrats to force the closure of all backyard swimming pools?

We can all agree that if we forced every single driver and passenger in vehicles on the roads to wear full body harnesses and helmets, similar to NASCAR, and we reduced the speed limits on the roads by 80%, that we would save hundreds of thousands of lives. Hell, we could prevent every, single, fatality and injury on the roads, if we could just force everybody to stop driving. But we don't do it. Why? Maybe because somewhere, in some tiny little back pocket of our brains, we all understand that life involves risk.

There are literally thousands of things that government over-reach could force on the population that would save a lot more than just one life.
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There’s other more logical reasons why we don’t have those laws. They wouldn’t have the effect you’re hypothesizing. The masks were a public health issue. Similarly, you’re allowed to shit wherever you want on your private property so long as your shit doesn’t contaminate the public water supply. You can’t shit into the creek that flows through your property, because it’s pretty likely to make folks downstream sick. That’s why the masks were mandatory in most places, but not the vaccine. It’s a matter of how likely it is to affect a majority of people.

Also, I’m pretty sure that mask mandates came down from state governments not federal. I may have forgotten, but the federal government only authorized the states to do it, and only mandated it to their own employees. Lots of places around here were mask free zones.
 
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