CLIMBING HAZARDOUS OAK TREE

140, cutting with the lean, snap cut instead of face (probably with compromised hinge, if habits hold true).

200, dutchman in the near side.


Let the saw do the cutting, quit the back and forthing with it. Make a precise hinge or snap-cut. Dogs aid precision!

Consider if you need sapwood cuts when topping.


BREATHE
BREATHE
BREATHE

This race is an ultramarathon until the day you die.
I'm looking to go a long F'ing distance.

RUSHING KILLS!!!!!!!!!!


250 Dogs!
Don't use the cut until it falls method,
aka cut off the hinge,


unless maybe you are trying to avoid the barberchair from your dutchman from RUSHING your facecut.


BREATHE.

Play that Tahune Airwalk song (Chemical Brothers??) not death-metal in your head. Float up the tree, don't charge up the tree. Ease it over, calmly, not cut until you Know its Moving.


Consider guying/ a guy-line for that tree before climbing --- toss the throw line, install rope, Running Bowline to secure, Maasdam Continuous Rope Puller to tension. Sometimes overkill is better than underkill.




319 looks like a dutchman shadow on the far side of the hinge. I didn't see any hinge 'whiskers'. Uneven, sloping back-cut. Full wrap handles, FTW.
More stumpshot than you want. Spiral grain will F-up things, like your Hinge, amongst other problems. I think you were shooting into the clear, so no stumpshot necessary. Know when to use what.







Better customers want a skilled pro who's safe, over fast. Often, making things safe and boring is the best way to make things efficient. Being mentally frazzled from hoping a nasty tree doesn't collapse under you is not help the rest of the day.




Precision takes time on the learning end, but makes cutting big faces, positioned as you need them, forward, middle, rearward easy on the back end.

I tell people I'm training to examine the hinge area.
Look for defects hidden or easily seen.
Mark the front of the hinge on each side with the saw tip.
Cut the face- precisely, cleanly, no dutchman/ bypass, 'gunned' dead on target while sighting to a target as far away as possible, like across the street on the neighbor's garage door versus the customer's front lawn or curb. Get down behind the gunning sights, like a rifle, not a shooting from the hip with a shotgun.
Recognize that your gunning sight is offset from the tree by 6"-ish. That's one side of the trunk. Gunning from the other side is also offset by 6". you should be gunning to targets separated apart 12" plus the diameter of the tree at the cut. Your target objects in the distance on a 40" tree should be 52" apart.
Once the face-cut is clean. decide on how to cut the back-cut. Mark it, cut it perfectly.
Escape the stump!
Examine the hinge.
Dissect the whole fell.


to spin @rico 's words
This man has been doing this for a very long time but still takes the time to get things perfect.


Because he takes the time to get things perfect, he has been doing this a very long time.


My logger neighbor said in 43 years of PNW logging, he never got busted up too bad to go to work the next day...in the same breathe, he seriously said, "you always have to have your head in the game".
 
Scratch said:
What are the cuts he made at 2:50 for in this video?
Click to expand...



Eucalyptus, a different beast. Dense, slick, beastly big at times like nuts!! Poor compartmentalizers because they are normally burnt out in bush fires every 80 or so years, so why develop a long-life strategy, IIRC. Someone tell me if I'm FOS on that one.

They always use sapwood cuts when hinging wood over. This prevents the hinge sapwood from ripping down onto the climbers lanyard/ climbline, injuring him. You will often see it tear down to the sapwood cuts on Euc videos.

Important stuff.

On Eucs, StihlMadd can be seen making some kerfs in the bark before setting his rigging ropes to make sure there is enough grip.

Where's he been, anyway. Ben, ya?
 
southsoundtree said:
Eucalyptus, a different beast. Dense, slick, beastly big at times like nuts!! Poor compartmentalizers because they are normally burnt out in bush fires every 80 or so years, so why develop a long-life strategy, IIRC. Someone tell me if I'm FOS on that one.

They always use sapwood cuts when hinging wood over. This prevents the hinge sapwood from ripping down onto the climbers lanyard/ climbline, injuring him. You will often see it tear down to the sapwood cuts on Euc videos.

Important stuff.

On Eucs, StihlMadd can be seen making some kerfs in the bark before setting his rigging ropes to make sure there is enough grip.

Where's he been, anyway. Ben, ya?
Click to expand...
@southsoundtree Ben is hammering it out on instagram......your reply above was eloquently delivered Sean....did you see my message I sent you?
 
southsoundtree said:
I tell people I'm training to examine the hinge area.
Look for defects hidden or easily seen.
Click to expand...
That is a phenomenal point, do it before starting and after the notch is cut. Is there a dead spot? Made that mistake last week.
Is there a branch on one side? Seen folks cut from one side without checking the other side, oops should have notched above that guy.
Is there a branch stub buried inside the tree right on the hinge that will make the tree hold to one side or be harder to wedge over? Great post @southsoundtree super on point.
 
My hope is that you can learn valuable things here and pass them onto your YouTube viewers so I figured this would be a better place to do than YouTube, as the crowd here is much more knowledgable and discerning. If I am out of bounds here tell me to knock it off and I will.


My comments are only pointed towards the 1st tree, but it seems to be more of the same Kenny. Very rushed subpar cutting, and it appears that all the cuts on this tree are once again jacked up. Bypassed under-cuts, under shot back-cuts, and you gotta stop plowing through your hinge!. Watch the falling cut on the spar. You clearly had some serious bypass and basically had an unintended dutchman going on. You missed your backcut, knew it, but decided to go ahead anyhow. WTF? When your face closed the dutchman took over and swung the tree a few feet to the right. I can tell by the sights on your saw that you missed your intended lay by 4-7 feet at the tip of your spar. That could mean a smashed fence to a crushed roof in a scenario that mattered.

Now I am one of the most hyperactive, impatience, in a hurry mutherfuckers you could ever meet, but your movement when cutting makes me look like I have overdosed on some sedatives bro!! You must figure out how to force yourself to slow down and become much more deliberate and precise with your saw skills. I am not sure about your level of understanding concerning the fundamentals and mechanics of falling, but I would highly recommend you go seek out Douglas Dent's "Professional Timber Falling". Study and stick to the basics laid out in this wonderful book and I promise you will become a better cutter fairly quickly.
 
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I can’t add much than the others have already said. Dull chain and messed up cuts. If you were aiming to make a tapered hinge you did so opposite than what is needed to get the results you were looking for.

Take your time on all your cuts, but most important on the sketchy stuff. Looks like you were climbing scared, don’t climb scared! Or if you are scared it’s time to slow your ass down and be more methodical than ever. Double check every cut, and never make fuck it cuts.

Looks like every cut in your video was a fuck it cut. Repeat after me ‘don’t make fuck it cuts’

A good climber and a great groundie could have lowered that top, and swing that limb without making an leaf twitch.

Dull chain and perhaps a bent bar tip?! Never even consider a tree like that! Make sure the saw is cutting great before leaving the ground. Looks like plenty of wood on the ground to test the saw out on. If for what ever reason your saw dulls on the way to the top call for your sharp one which should be fueled up ready to go behind the tree
 
Guys, I was trying to digest this thread from the beginning and, in thinking about the salami cut (which I just read about in Beranek's "Fundamentals..." today), had a few questions...

So, it was mentioned by @swingdude, I think, that where the tree is leaning towards the desired lay anyway, a hinge is unnecessary. How close to the ground does this principle cease to apply? For example, would you use a salami cut 4' above the ground? I've cut plenty of leaners at ground level and always used hinges and bore cuts. I've done the salami before, but on small stuff on the ground.

Do you guys do the cut more or less vertically when you do this cut, on a bias across the grain? It seems like this would reduce the potential for drag, which might not be a negative in the first place. More generally put, what determines the angle that you set the cut on. Is as vertical as possible always better, without quintupling the amount of wood you have to cut through? Or what?

Does anyone who does this do any kind of undercut on the exit side to reduce the potential for peeling?
 
A slice/salami cut is extremely useful for clearing trees that are leaning and/or hung up in other trees. You simple reach up a few feet and make a well executed slice cut and repeat the process until the hung up tree is cleared. An indispensable cut when working in the woods. So yes, you can use a slice cut 4 feet above the ground if it is the appropriate cut for the situation. You also generally want to make the angle of your cut fairly step or you run the risk of it not sliding off the cut, which is the whole purpose of the cut.
 
LordFarkwad said:
Guys, I was trying to digest this thread from the beginning and, in thinking about the salami cut (which I just read about in Beranek's "Fundamentals..." today), had a few questions...

So, it was mentioned by @swingdude, I think, that where the tree is leaning towards the desired lay anyway, a hinge is unnecessary. How close to the ground does this principle cease to apply? For example, would you use a salami cut 4' above the ground? I've cut plenty of leaners at ground level and always used hinges and bore cuts. I've done the salami before, but on small stuff on the ground.

Do you guys do the cut more or less vertically when you do this cut, on a bias across the grain? It seems like this would reduce the potential for drag, which might not be a negative in the first place. More generally put, what determines the angle that you set the cut on. Is as vertical as possible always better, without quintupling the amount of wood you have to cut through? Or what?

Does anyone who does this do any kind of undercut on the exit side to reduce the potential for peeling?
Click to expand...
This would take a good 10 pages on it's own. It's a viable yet very dangerous tool. I've used it to take hung up trees down so large I had to double cut with a 28" bar. Taking tops, I have and will use it on the occasional to rare side. What can help is to take the bottom side first, even with a double thick kerf (essentially a tiny face). Cut the near corner upward on the same plane. Then reach around and cut the back corner on the far side, then you should be left with a T shape strip of holding wood. As you power through this the top will slightly tip to the direction of the double wide bottom and then release. Be ready cause it happens QUICK, and get that saw the fuck outta the way because it might get slapped.
 
One of my first jobs in the woods when I was 13-14 years old was following a timber faller around and limbing and bucking logs behind him, pulling scale, and clearing hangers.

The slice cut is a great cut to use when your tip tying fairly upright tops or whole trees because it never causes your top or tree to flatten out, but simply allows your top/tree to slide right off the cut while staying upright. Thus very little swing.
 
LordFarkwad said:
Guys, I was trying to digest this thread from the beginning and, in thinking about the salami cut (which I just read about in Beranek's "Fundamentals..." today), had a few questions...

So, it was mentioned by @swingdude, I think, that where the tree is leaning towards the desired lay anyway, a hinge is unnecessary. How close to the ground does this principle cease to apply? For example, would you use a salami cut 4' above the ground? I've cut plenty of leaners at ground level and always used hinges and bore cuts. I've done the salami before, but on small stuff on the ground.

Do you guys do the cut more or less vertically when you do this cut, on a bias across the grain? It seems like this would reduce the potential for drag, which might not be a negative in the first place. More generally put, what determines the angle that you set the cut on. Is as vertical as possible always better, without quintupling the amount of wood you have to cut through? Or what?

Does anyone who does this do any kind of undercut on the exit side to reduce the potential for peeling?
Click to expand...

You need to remove obstructions from the slipping top, so yes you would trim any branches, stubs, etc below and adjacent that the slipping top could strike or bind up on. Generally you don’t want it to bind on fibres either, so you don’t want it hinging and creating a bending moment on the hinge/pulling fibres etc.

Unless need to lean top, I cut lower part of spear/salami cut and install twigs so there is no sitdown when you proceed with the back cut (sitdown creates friction and may restrict slip making top hinge instead). I use either multiple twigs pushed straight into cut aligned with direction of slide; or twigs sideways to act as rollers - I generally don’t use sideways in super soft wood due to risk of restricting from sliding).

You do need chain speed to achieve this cut, unless you stagger the spear cuts (which I do in bigger wood - especially exposed to wind which can jam a saw blade if cutting deep with bottom cut. You generally need to cut 40% of the way with a spear cut if a single lower cut is used to restrict the pressure on the lower contact point of the cut, to avoid it digging in and having the top hinge over.

In bigger wood I can do 3-5 staggered overlapping cuts with a small backstrap release cut at the end which is safer anyway. The wood between the overlapping cuts acts to resist side bending just like a hinge does when felling.
 
rico said:
One of my first jobs in the woods when I was 13-14 years old was following a timber faller around and limbing and bucking logs behind him, pulling scale, and clearing hangers.

The slice cut is a great cut to use when your tip tying fairly upright tops or whole trees because it never causes your top or tree to flatten out, but simply allows your top/tree to slide right off the cut while staying upright. Thus very little swing.
Click to expand...

In this particular case, is "flattening out" being avoided because of the potential for getting hung?
 
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