Sexism and Homophobia in Arborculture/TreeLife?

[moss]

I have much more to say but my groundie is getting restless and we’ve run out of coffee so it’s time to jump up this walnut...

Can we address the seemingly trivial but actually significant problem of "restless groundies"? I could go on an on but I won't! Someone please start a thread titled "The problem with restless groundies!". Thank you.
-AJ

 

[rico]

A long time ago I was looking at some "yard junk" for sale in Owl's Head, ME, my father-in-law who spent a lifetime on the water, offshore on trawlers etc. was with me. He pointed out a large sheave on a curved steel pipe/piece and with great reservation told me what it's called. Used to redirect a winch line to pull lobster traps. The name of it is a reference to hanging black men by the neck. It is yet another casually and mostly unconsciously used term that carries so much difficult history.

Great thread, agree that it's a problem in general, not specific to tree work. Doesn't mean that tree workers can't smarten up about it and take the lead in our work environment and in public forums wiping out the B.S. around sexism and racism.
-AJ

Here's the kind of hate filled ignorant bulshit that other arb forums allow to go unchecked-



I for one applaud the mods for doing their very best to keep this kind of ignorance and hate off of the pages of our forum...

 

[moss]

Here's the kind of hate filled ignorant bulshit that other arb forums allow to go unchecked-

View attachment 76273

I for one applaud the mods for doing their very best to keep this kind of ignorance and hate off of the pages of our forum...

One listen to Billie Holiday singing “Strange Fruit” should do the trick explaining why placing a “symbolic noose” in a workplace or anywhere is beyond obnoxious.
-AJ

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Like The Little Prince Ii try to keep the volcanos cleaned up.

 

[Lumberjack]

A long time ago I was looking at some "yard junk" for sale in Owl's Head, ME, my father-in-law who spent a lifetime on the water, offshore on trawlers etc. was with me. He pointed out a large sheave on a curved steel pipe/piece and with great reservation told me what it's called. Used to redirect a winch line to pull lobster traps. The name of it is a reference to hanging black men by the neck. It is yet another casually and mostly unconsciously used term that carries so much difficult history.

Great thread, agree that it's a problem in general, not specific to tree work. Doesn't mean that tree workers can't smarten up about it and take the lead in our work environment and in public forums wiping out the B.S. around sexism and racism.
-AJ

This had me scratching my head... did a little pondering and research learning a bit along the way.

A derrick?

If so, it is named after an executioner in Middlesex from the late 1500s to early 1600s named Thomas Derrick. He died around 1608 after executing an estimated 3000 people.

Given the British weren’t very active in the African slave trade at that point, I imagine the overwhelming majority of the folks hung were Angelo Saxons and their similarly complected counterparts.

The only person I know he hung is Robert Devereux, the 2nd Earl of Essex, in 1601. Ironically Robert is who pardoned Thomas’s rape conviction on the condition he became the executioner.

 

[moss]

This had me scratching my head... did a little pondering and research learning a bit along the way.

A derrick?

If so, it is named after an executioner in Middlesex from the late 1500s to early 1600s named Thomas Derrick. He died around 1608 after executing an estimated 3000 people.

Given the British weren’t very active in the African slave trade at that point, I imagine the overwhelming majority of the folks hung were Angelo Saxons and their similarly complected counterparts.

The only person I know he hung is Robert Devereux, the 2nd Earl of Essex, in 1601. Ironically Robert is who pardoned Thomas’s rape conviction on the condition he became the executioner.

Interesting. Sorry to be vague, it’s an obvious/direct negative racial reference to lynching, kind of don’t want to repeat it, further perpetuates it if I do.

It’s been the default term in the New England lobstering world for many decades.
-AJ

 

[Neill]

In light of a recent thread on these forums about a female tree worker in an Echo ad, I'm wondering how others experience arborculture/treelife in general in light of sexism and homophobia?

My tree business is a solo operation, so my in person contact with others in the field is limited, but online on various sites like this one I get the sense that there is a powerful undercurrent of masculinist sexism, homophobia, and heteronormativity in the field. Other perspectives?

My first tree mentor was a woman. She was one of my favorite people to work for and I owe here a lot since she took the time to educate and teach me. She was great- thanks rose. Last I saw her she had made strides in her position and was doing very well.

I worked with another female arborist for about 5 months- two or so years ago. She wasn’t very accomplished and was honestly not great in the trade. I hope she has gotten the experience to back up her knowledge. Maybe she is better now?

my last job had one of the hardest working woman I’ve ever met. Would outpace 8 out of 9 people on our crew in most tasks.

my current boss is a woman and so far it’s going very well. Only a few days in at a new gig but I’m optimistic and have good feelings about it.

thanks for the platform to relay my experience.
It’s interesting to read these threads and see how common bonds (arboriculture) do not equal agreement on all things. Some of my best working relationships have been with people that I do not share beliefs with politically, religiously, or whatever other thing guides your life. Yet we managed to become friends and working together was a pleasure.

im new to this forum and have really appreciated the outlet to share and learn. Thank you

 

[Fivepoints]

I have been in this game a long time and have never worked with a female arborist...That was until I began training a young female climber a couple months ago... Simply put, I have never enjoyed working with an aspiring climber more than this young woman. They should all be this gifted, attentive, and hardworking..

View attachment 76266

That's really cool.

As hard as it is to find good tree workers, I think it's incredibly dumb that most tree services won't hire women. I hired a female tree worker. She worked for me for a bit over 2 years. Probably would still be here if her whole family didn't move out of state. She also learned to rope climb while working here. She tried spikes but didnt like it at all.

We worked today with another local tree service helping them out with our crane. One of the owners is lady. She works right with the crew daily. Not a climber per say but interested and has ridden the crane properly tied in. She started my 572xp for me today at one point.

Another friend of mine's daughter works with us when we help them with crane work. She's not at all interested in climbing but is a very good mini skid operator. She has been running one since being a teenager and is mid 20s. She can run ropes and feeds the chipper quite frequently.

 

[born2climb]

Here's the kind of hate filled ignorant bulshit that other arb forums allow to go unchecked-

View attachment 76273

I for one applaud the mods for doing their very best to keep this kind of ignorance and hate off of the pages of our forum...

Getting a bit lathered in your spandex, are you? Where’s the “hate” in that? Simple observation, seems to me. As to the mods keeping it off the pages of this forum, you’re the one who posted it here (while thanking the mods for not allowing what YOU copy/pasted). Methinks you are a bit too sensitive. Perhaps some soft R&B playing in the background will calm your wokeness.

 

[rico]

Where’s the “hate” in that? Simple observation, seems to me. As to the mods keeping it off the pages of this forum, you’re the one who posted it here (while thanking the mods for not allowing what YOU copy/pasted). Methinks you are a bit too sensitive. Perhaps some soft R&B playing in the background will calm your wokeness.

Yep, no history of terrorism and hate behind the noose here in Merica.

Heres an idea. You could read a little American history while your polishing up your confederate flag, and listening to "I Wish I was In Dixie"

Might cure whats ailing ya bro? I doubt it, but who fucking knows?

 

[rico]

Not only a woke idiot...he knows how to cuss too!

You done with your attempted insults sweet pea? If so, I would love to hear your explanation as to why the noose is NOT a symbol of hate here in the land of the free and the home of the brave..

 

[born2climb]

I’d love to hear you explain how the noose IS a symbol of hate...if you can do so without your gutter language. Sure. Someone somewhere hung a black guy. And somewhere someone killed a white guy. Just because you got on the racism bandwagon doesn’t mean everyone hopped on board. Shutting down a construction site for a week while the FBI “investigates” a few ropes dangling about the place reeks of stupid. What if they’d left a few chitlin buckets? A few watermelons? Some Cuban cigars? Good grief.

 

[treegongfu]

It smells like Juicy Smoolay.

 

[SeanRuel]

It's willfully ignorant to miss the power of a noose as a symbol. It's a not even veiled allusion to a time when black folks were lynched with impunity by white people. To pretend otherwise is delusional

 

[Tom Dunlap]

I’d love to hear you explain how the noose IS a symbol of hate...if you can do so without your gutter language. Sure. Someone somewhere hung a black guy. And somewhere someone killed a white guy. Just because you got on the racism bandwagon doesn’t mean everyone hopped on board. Shutting down a construction site for a week while the FBI “investigates” a few ropes dangling about the place reeks of stupid. What if they’d left a few chitlin buckets? A few watermelons? Some Cuban cigars? Good grief.

No need for anyone to do your homework for you. The National Museum for Peace and Justice and the Legacy Museum are right there in Montgomery, AL. Both are free too. Check when they're open though.

The Legacy Sites

A museum, memorial, and monument in Montgomery, Alabama.

museumandmemorial.eji.org

In 2/20 I spent a day at the two facilities. These are must-see museums.

@born2climb for you to say what you have in your last few posts shows how ignorant you are. You haven't posted on Treebuzz since 2015 and you come in here with this awful message.

After you've visited both museums come back and let us know the answers to your awful questions are. Until then, keep them to yourself.

 

[rico]

I’d love to hear you explain how it IS a symbol of hate...if you can do so without your gutter language. Sure. Someone somewhere hung a black guy. More whites have been hung than blacks, I’d wager. Just because you got on the racism bandwagon doesn’t mean everyone hopped on board. Shutting down a construction site for a week while the FBI “investigates” a few ropes dangling about the place reeks of stupid. What if they’d left a few chitlin buckets? A few watermelons? Some Cuban cigars? Good grief.

There are over 4700 documented lynchings in Merica, and over 3/4's of the victims were black. A vast majority of them took place in the south from the end of reconstruction up to the 1950's..Black men where hung for such atrocities as wearing military uniforms, owning successful businesses which competed with white businesses, or accidentally bumping into white woman on the streets.

Hell, your lovely home state of Alabama has 326 documented cases of black lynchings. A statistic which will no doubt stir a real sense of pride in your cracker ass.

We won't talk about the dismembering of the black victims before, during, and after their lynichings, the public displays of their dead black bodies, or the postcards that good god fearing white folks made to memorialize these festive occasions...Terrorism, plain and simple...



Here's a photo of the 14 year old boy( Emmett Till ) who's killing sparked the civil rights movement. Unrecognizable after they were done with him...



Tag, your it Bama.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

On 4/15/20 four black men were lynched in Duluth, MN. This was not just a Southern thing.

Duluth lynchings - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Fivepoints]

On 4/15/20 four black men were lynched in Duluth, MN. This was not just a Southern thing.

Duluth lynchings - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Bad to happen anywhere and to anyone. Quite a few white folks were lynched in Alabama as well. No one seems to remember that. It was a problem for both blacks and whites.

I'm from North Alabama. I grew up here. I've seen quite a bit of racism, unfortunately. I've seen the Klan some as well. Pulaski Tn is just a short drive over the state line from me. It's the birthplace of the Klan. I remember cross burnings occasionally happening growing up. I've personally witnessed police officers being racist and abusive several times.

It's gotten much better around here in the last 20 years. A lot of the old racist signs are gone. Several cities used to have signs eluding to don't be here after dark if you are black. It has a ways to go in some places but its at least moving in the right direction. No one should have to put up with being harassed or discriminated against for their skin.

 

[colb]

Bad to happen anywhere and to anyone. Quite a few white folks were lynched in Alabama as well. No one seems to remember that. It was a problem for both blacks and whites.

I'm from North Alabama. I grew up here. I've seen quite a bit of racism, unfortunately. I've seen the Klan some as well. Pulaski Tn is just a short drive over the state line from me. It's the birthplace of the Klan. I remember cross burnings occasionally happening growing up. I've personally witnessed police officers being racist and abusive several times.

It's gotten much better around here in the last 20 years. A lot of the old racist signs are gone. Several cities used to have signs eluding to don't be here after dark if you are black. It has a ways to go in some places but its at least moving in the right direction. No one should have to put up with being harassed or discriminated against for their skin.

I feel like the term "less worse" is more appropriate than "much better"... There is a societal miasma around the semantics of how we talk about oppression of minority groups, yet they're important. We help each other get out of the fog.

 

[born2climb]

So I’m “censored”, but Rico can drop all the F-bombs he wants? Fine. Nice tight ship you’re running here.

Perhaps YOU are the racist here, Rico. We see what we want in our own associations. I have never participated, supported or condoned murder, by any method. Had their same victims been beaten with hammers, would the hammer represent hatred and racism to you? If they’d been electrocuted, would you live without electricity to show your contempt? In my opinion, you’re missing the forest for the trees.

Just like the media getting hung up on what type firearms is used in a shooting. Murder is murder, regardless of weapon used, and it’s illegal. You are way too hung up on the letter of the law and not the spirit of the law.