Rate of pay

C

Cottonwood

Hey guys been reading for a while and just would like some input on what you would pay a person of my qualifications.

Certified arborist
I'll be taking the certified tree worker in December
Commercial pesticide license with the ornamental sub section.
CDL with clean driving record
2 years in tree work
2 years in landscape related areas
CPR/First aid
BS in landscape design

If you could post some idea. It doesn't have to be spot on and include the area for demographics. Also a few reason why would be nice too. Thanks a bunch.
 
As little as possible!
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Seriously though, there are regional and local "norms" that will give you an idea of what people with your experience might earn in that area.

The biggest factors are your qualifications, but the determining factor is what the market will bear.

For example I would love to be able to pay $40/hr to my climbers but there isn't a customer in my area who would be willing to hire my company for the hourly rate I'd have to charge in order to pay that amount.

Lots of people ascribe to the opinion that the "owners" are greedy and won't pay thier people a living wage.

I find that generally laughable.

While there are some owners that are that tight, by and large it is the customer who keeps wages low. Most are simply not willing to buy a product that is priced high enough to provide what they consider a "liveable" wage.

Its the same thing with the lie about "minimum" wages.

Everyone thinks its a good idea but nobody stops to think what that does to prices. Simple mathematics means that either the price of the product goes up to cover the added cost or someone doesn't get hired.

And if that min-wage position doesn't get filled, then productivity goes down, while demand stays the same...prices go up.

Anyhow, back to greedy owners, I also don't know of many (if any) employees that will come into work for weeks on end and not draw a paycheck when things are tight.

I guarantee that just about every business owner out there has done just that and will do so again when necessary. They will also do everything they can to keep work coming in so that they can keep their crews busy and to pay them!

So, rather than asking what someone is willing to pay you, why not "sell" yourself to your future employers by telling them what you bring to the table, what you will bring to the company, and then demonstrate that the wage you are asking for has a good to high return on investment.

Think about it this way, a $500k crane is a lot of money But if the crane can generate a whole lot more than $500k over the life of the crane then it is money well spent.

Paying you $40 per hour as a climber can also be money well spent if you can generate a revenue in enough excess of your wage.

Anyhow, just my $0.02 worth.
 
We just got re-rated at 17% Gross payroll. We were at 22% but no claims, good safety program, certifications they all help. I expected to be rated at 20% but am happy with the lower rate.
 
$12-$14/hr to start, in central FL. That would only be because you have a CDL, assuming you pass the drug test. Maybe a little more if you presented yourself well.
 
Same in Central Texas (Austin, San Antonio), maybe a little lower - $10-$15 per hour. Don't ask me why. These areas still charge urban customers the same rates as Chicago, Mpls, St. Louis, etc.

I'd have to disagree with Rfwoodvt on the structure and reality of company incomes, but only relevent to Texas, his area is probably as he states.

I'd love to have a partner of your experience and I split income after expenses, but I remain small by choice, no plans to increase base or area (getting ready to retire).
 
Depends upon how you work and what you're going to be doing. That would lead to the question what is the employer hiring? What are you interested in investing in them and them in you?

Having a CA cert doesn't mean you practice it. Or spending some time in college. Not to poo all over your birthday cake, having a Ninja or Corvette does not mean I do drive fast or drive well going fast.

How are you going to play on the team? One man band, climbing and humping brush, and maintenance, one rate. If you're going to be a climber only, one rate. Additionally doing PHC or installation? Supervising? Even though only one area of expertise might be practiced at a time, one should be compensated for having all those feathers in their cap.

You in it for the money? What if you bring to the team more horsepower per $$$, so jobs get done in 10% less time, or breaking less things, or other quantifiable benefits. Bring in more profit, say, by doing an extra job a week for your employer might not show up in your hourly rate, but could be on the payroll for a rain day or a little longer in the slow season.
 
Lot's of variables.

I believe, for a qualified and dedicated tree person w/ developed skills and personal incentives to excel, finding the right company will be a process that demands going far more than just looking to fill a vacancy advertised in the want ads that promises a fair-enough compensation.

Cottonwood, has the thought of striking-out and starting something on your own crossed your mind? Starting small and within your capabilities then growing from there? There are no laws dictating we have to commit to someone else's payroll.
 
Sorry for not replying I've been really busy working a lot of hours.

When I'm at work I bust my butt for the entire time. I practice what I've learned and try to teach it to others. When I come home from work I'm usually doing work related stuff. Either be it reading for my next test with are CSTP, EMT basic, Horticulturalist state cert, board master certified arborist, and just about anything I can get my hands on.

I'm almost never late. In the last two years I've been late once and sick once. I have come to work a bit under the weather more than a few times just to keep the jobs going and not to screw over my other co workers.

I do spray work and I climb. I also do just about anything you can think of, except large removals and crane jobs. That will come with time and I'm also not the fastest climber out there but I've been only climbing for a year and a half. I can prune a large 80-90 foot oak and still get where I need to be. I lead crews when needed and make sure all the paper work is done and we are ready to go for the next day.

I use my degree everyday. I just don't get paid for it. I know smaller shrubs and other garden plants that some of the other guys don't and I'm able to talk design with the client when I like what they have done.

I've thought about starting my own business but the thought of having to provide health care and benefits to me and my family isn't a very inviting thought.

I appreciate all your input and am trying to find the company that fits me.
 
How about an SBA loan to kick-start your own venture with then? Free consults are available to answer questions, call them and find out, won't hurt.

There are a myriad of health coverage plans available for small/independent business owners, and being your own boss supercedes the limited benefits offered by your working for someone - you can determine your own bennies and your LLC's payouts and incentives to you.

In the meantime, locate large progressive urban areas of the Northwest, Northeast, or even Midland/Odessa (God forbid) - an oil-richened metro that's awash with cash right now. Concentrate more on the successes of tree companies, especially the worker-owned ones in St. Louis etc. to offer more appropriate compensation packages akin to their areas. Forget Texas/ other cities, period or other "right to work" states - companies prosper but their workers never will.

Take some side-jobs and weekend ones, make flyers and knock on some doors. Spread the word and pass the ammunition, you're young enough to hump all day and hump some more at night, while you can. Post notices and read the other ones at schools, old people recreational facilities, and grocery store and nursery bulletin boards. Going for the Master Arborist cert? You can offer talks and discussions at garden clubs and plant societies - if you're up to snuff. A Master Arbo certified, advertised, will never be short of work.

Domn't look at me for a shining example of independent success, I hate money and stuff but I know from need what it takes to keep a family from going hungry or hurt.
 
That's all we need, Oakwilt: more tiny little tree services springing up, running around, keeping the prices down low and maybe stay in business for about 5 years until they see they aren't making ends meet. In the mean time, they hurt us that are in it for the long haul. Running a truely success business is hard work and I would not advise it to most people.
 
CMA's don't generally "undercut" anyone except those who charge similar rates and don't have the knowledge to justify it. If he's as qualified as he states, or is sincere about obtaining the desired certs, he'd be wasting his skills on a removal crew, see what I'm saying?

If he becomes what he's striving for, he's worth $65,000 a year give or take, in my book. I don't see many help wanted ad's offering that and believe me, I understand why.

Other than the recent forced changes on the liability and coverage issues which will open the flood gates of competition from not just small companies but unqualified pick-up truck ladder owners, there is an economic nightmare going on - we're forced to re-evaluate ourselves and adapt or sink. Encouraging Cottonwood to become his potential and find his niche shouldn't scare us or make us so protectively proprietary that we condemn all newcomners, if so we shouldn't share any tree info on the net - my clientel is small town, I do things others can't or won't and likewise for my competition. If there are less calls I don't entirely blame newbies...I blame the state of the nation and then myself because I have to change things occassionally and times like these make that happen.
 
Former skills that were marketable, just because they are doesn't mean I am the same whore to use them to get it, that's all.

If I loved the money, I'd still be one instead of a treeman, right?

Isn't that way for others, is it?
 
I don't think starting a business right now is in the plan. At least not for a few years till I can get more experience. I would prefer to find the right company for myself and have a good relationship formed forever.

I would like to clarify that the BCMA is on the books and thats one of the reason why I'm always reading and expanding my knowledge.

If I where to open a business I wouldn't look to undercut the quality guys and I would looked to get a good wage for what I put in. I would end up staying away from removals. I'm not much of a fan but they do make money and are fun sometimes. I would prefer to do more maintenance and preservation.

Right now its the hunt for the best company that will fit my needs and the atmosphere that will flourish with me. Money is a small portion of what I need and I was just looking for a reference on being paid fair, which I am in terms of the information offered up here.
 
Good luck Cottonwood. It you were to research companies based on your criteria, identify the connection of what they do and the philosophy they conduct business by, then compose a letter to tell them that. Identify the owner or president and send it to them directly. Never mind whether they have job postings or not. You are interested in them because of the connection NOT because they are advertising a job opening. If there is one great but it needs to fit you.

Most companies want to hire people who fit their culture and share the same ideologies. Show that to the real decision makers and you will have a shot at the job you desire.
 
Good luck is right when you have a wife that loves her job and we the love the area. It narrows it down some but the search is still there. I know it'll work out in the end but its going to take a while to find a solution.
 
I would like to tell you that the most valuable asset is attitude!!! If your a company guy who has the owners back out on the jobs and serves the company ,clients and fellow workers you become indespensible. I would also begin to ask the owner to train you in sales that is where the money is .A hybrid position of crew leader/sales is an Ideal situation.I pay commisions on upsells and walk ups . It is a great way to push a guys wage up!!!!
 
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