Petzl Williams autolocker gate jams almost closed

[Ron]

I suppose it goes without saying that this was disappointing to put it mildly. A buddy, Lance, and I went climbing last night and when we were back on the ground I noticed the gate of a Petzl Williams carabiner wasn't closed. Figuring it was just in a bit of a bind, I nudged it to close it, but it wasn't about to nudge.

In fact, now that I've had some time to work with it, the sleeve of the gate would rotate enough to allow it to close. I could force it (with my hands) to rotate and close but it's really tight. I put som oil in it but that didn't help much. For sure something is jammed inside the sleeve. Fortunately, this biner was just used to hold the pulley on the ascender in a RADS setup.

But, it's just as possible that this could have been in a life support role. Of course this emphasizes the need to check gear regularly and for me now, auto-lockers especially.

This puts a dent in my perception of the security of auto-lockers. I'm not so sure this could/would happen with a screw lock - you'd check it every time you opened or closed it.

 

[altissimus]

.... I dislike the auto lockers .... for personal safety I run the Petzl Williams manual lockers (yellow barrel)....

 

[cdekkema]

I have had, on rare occasion, the auto lock on the triple action Petzl caribiners not snap shut completely snaggin withing itself open along the key notch of the opening. Luckily I have forced the habit upon myself of double checking everytime I clip in.

 

[Ron]

I should add this: the barrel would not rotate; the gate 'hinge' would not move - locked in position by the gate.

Because the gate was just out of lock, realize I had worked with it before I made the pics, a quick, routine squeeze check may not have revealed the problem. I've also seen a piece of webbing prevent the gate from interlocking.

I guess where I'm going with this is to say that when we check our gear, we need to do it deliberately, thoroughly, consciously, and carefully to be sure it's in the condition we expect it to be in when we trust our lives on it. I've seen how easy it is to do a 'passing' gear check and move on - not gonna do that any more!

I have to admit that I've been 'over'-trusting my auto-lockers - probably a result of that slow drift into complacency.

 

[treedoclang]

I've had the same happen to me before. Also on a Petzl williams. I don't use them anymore because of that, even though I always check to be sure the gate is fully closed on all krabs.

 

[DSMc]

[ QUOTE ]
I guess where I'm going with this is to say that when we check our gear, we need to do it deliberately, thoroughly, consciously, and carefully...

[/ QUOTE ]
True.

I think it is highly likely an inappropriate loading caused that jam. Carabiners are easy to damage when not loaded according to design. Auto-locks gates seem particularly delicate in anything but the locked position.

Dave

 

[cashmoneytreeboy]

Re: Petzl Williams autolocker gate jams almost clo

i will not climb,,, on any thing but a william D ball lock,,

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Ron,

Are the clips a convenient prop or a statement of some kind?! I have to ask, it's part of the duality of being Capricorn

Complacency Cills Climbers

 

[Ron]

[ QUOTE ]
Ron,

Are the clips a convenient prop or a statement of some kind?! I have to ask, it's part of the duality of being Capricorn

Complacency Cills Climbers

[/ QUOTE ]
LOL! I live in the Tennessee - 'magazines' are household items. They even make good props.

I guess what I'm saying is, I was looking for something to orient the biner for the pic and the magazines were readily available and I could reach them without getting up.

I didn't pull them from my carry gun if that's what was worrying you, I was carrying a S&W Titanium cylinder aluminum frame .38 special +p when I made the pics - seriously.

 

[altissimus]

.... just shows your concern for personal safety ....

 

[Blinky]

I really dislike those biners. The notch in the barrel catches on stuff a lot and when I used one on my ascenders it would bash into my knuckles on every footlock... just hate'em.

I'm with CMTB, I like ball lock William D's. I'm sure the little plastic balls will fail at some point but so far they've been the perfect biners for me.

...and I would've corrected Tom about the magazines if you hadn't... looks like a 20 round .223 and a hi-cap 9.

Tom, [ QUOTE ]
Complacency Cills Climbers

[/ QUOTE ]
Always Avoid Alliteration.

 

[BarnHouse]

[/ QUOTE ]
LOL! I live in the Tennessee - 'magazines' are household items. They even make good props.

I guess what I'm saying is, I was looking for something to orient the biner for the pic and the magazines were readily available and I could reach them without getting up.

I didn't pull them from my carry gun if that's what was worrying you, I was carrying a S&W Titanium cylinder aluminum frame .38 special +p when I made the pics - seriously.

[/ QUOTE ]

Man I gotta move to TN! Just being a gun owner in NJ can get you suspicious looks.

-BarnHouse

 

[southsoundtree]

Double action--- not auto locking.

 

[Ron]

[ QUOTE ]
.... just shows your concern for personal safety ....

[/ QUOTE ]
You're exactly right about that!

 

[Ron]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm with CMTB, I like ball lock William D's. I'm sure the little plastic balls will fail at some point but so far they've been the perfect biners for me.

[/ QUOTE ]
I think I have one of each, and I like the ball too. But Bruce at On Rope 1 won't stock the ball versions because he says they don't work well in caves.

But that's alright, I tell him a guy would have to be crazy to climb in a cave anyway. Then I go to Rock Creek Outfitters and get them.

Oh, yeah, you mentioned you don't like the Triacts. Now that one messed up with me (and others), I don't like 'em either. The only bad thing is they don't make an OK in a ball lock.

[ QUOTE ]
...and I would've corrected Tom about the magazines if you hadn't... looks like a 20 round .223 and a hi-cap 9.

[/ QUOTE ]
Kinda hard not to addrese the clip - magazine thing. And you are exactly right - 20 round .223 and a hi-cap 9. The .223 is for my AR(s); the 9mm mag is a 20 rounder for a Beretta PX4 Storm. Good eye man - 'course I already knew that!

 

[Ron]

[ QUOTE ]
...Man I gotta move to TN! Just being a gun owner in NJ can get you suspicious looks.

-BarnHouse

[/ QUOTE ]
Come on man! I'd love to have you! We'll do some climbing and shooting.

 

[TANNER]

On my Petzl William, ball locking biner. Last summer I was ready to quite using it cause it quite locking. I messed with it a few times and managed to get a piece of wood out of it. Still works great. More than any thing though with the Tri-Acts, you can here it when they hit and click. I usually dont look alot, feel and listen.

Have a good one, I am going to work!

 

[banjo]

So you set up your RADS on the ground, ascended, and climbed around for a bit? Did you leave the ground with that biner like that??

 

[banjo]

Oh yeah and.........


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWowvEnIjyw

 

[Ron]

Yeah, but all my guns are defective - they don't twirl and they don't make a clicking/racking sound everytime I raise them like the ones in the movies do.