Looking to hear experiences of others...

CutHighnLetFly

CutHighnLetFly

Been here a while
Location
Cape Cod, MA
I have been offered a job opportunity and I am looking to hear other people's experience with similar situation. Ill give any details i feel are relevant.
Im 26 with around 5-6 years experience in production arboriculture. I've worked for a medium size landscape company when i was in the first year/year and a half. I left there to move to a powerhouse tree company. bucket trucks, 15"-18" chippers, log truck, utility work, big trees removals and pruning.
i love climbing and the exposure to a wide array of situations that present themselves working for such an established company in my area.
recently, the landscape company i worked for (run by a guy who s love is tree work, spent his years, before owning this landscape company, doing tree work) offered me a job. The position is as an arborist, i would be clear of doing any sort of landscape stuff, other than ornamental pruning, which i never get to do anymore and miss doing. things like pruning Rhody's and ornamental trees and doing 3 year renovations on overgrown foundation shrubs.
part of this position would be to create a tree division. the company has a 12" bandit in pretty good shape, a rigging block some tree blue and husky 1/2" dub braid, mini skids, and cab over trucks. and obviously some chain saws. what it lacks is any sort of efficient set up using said equipment for tree jobs, as well as a culture of safety. I imagine trying to change the attitude about safety as it pertains to tree work will be pretty tough.
I am intrigued by the challenge and change of pace, as well as the opportunity to do more plant care, as what i do now is big(relatively speaking)/technical/hard access removals. i would be leaving out a KEY detail if i didn't mention the pay increase. its not substantial, but I've reached a bit of a cap where i am at (for now) and this job offer is for a little more money. probably more than i could get anywhere else if i were to leave my current employer, because the company owner knows me and my abilities/reliability and my love for the industry.
what i am leaving is an excellent field arborist position running a crew with a rear mount and box truck. its a progressive company with a sweet new shop, tool incentives (i have so much gear already...), and just does plain badass tree work. i won't be exposed to the same level of tree work to start, and i know ill miss it. but the pace they try to keep my crew at is draining, and I'm not sure how long I'm trying to work at that level at a place where I'm not sure if there is a higher position for me to strive for. they are the power house they are because they have all the right pieces in the right places already.

so who's made a similar move and who's passed up a similar opportunity while in a similar one? anyone? if anyone has any experience similar to this, id love to hear how things played out for you, might help clear things up for me. thanks guys.
 
Man that's tough. Chase the dream or be safe. Have to think about off season work with a new company that's growing. Can you put food on the table when there's no work? What about benefits? Do you get them now? Health Insursnce? Tough call. I tend to play it a little safe myself unless I am absolutely passionate about it, then I just say what the hell.
 
Steve they can keep me on year round, the last year I worked for them they did. Sometimes tree work, sometimes shop BS. They have been around for awhile. Benefits are included. I've been plowing for them this winter. The company I work for didn't have plow positions open. We do storm call for the power company, but if there's snow but no storm and we aren't on call, I'm sitting around not making $$. Right now, the company in at is keeping me on by helping out a crew on a removal circuit for the power company.

Apples to oranges. They both fruit with seeds, ya just don't know where the seeds are with one!
 
That is tough. Is it just you or is there a wife and kids to also worry about taking care of? Sometimes the grass is not always greener and as Steve can probably agree with, a safety minded company is worth a few bucks for your well being in the long run. Now if the new guy is doubling your salary and paying you 52 weeks no matter what, then....
 
monkeylove said:
That is tough. Is it just you or is there a wife and kids to also worry about taking care of? Sometimes the grass is not always greener and as Steve can probably agree with, a safety minded company is worth a few bucks for your well being in the long run. Now if the new guy is doubling your salary and paying you 52 weeks no matter what, then....
Click to expand...
Wife two kids and the house. Steady work and the new guy would love someone to introduce safe work practices. Hes aware his idea of safe work practices doesn't meet my definition
 
If it were me, I would make a plan for how I want the new job to look in a year, and in five years. Set a list of goals for increasing this company's profitability, as well as your own, and how you hope to achieve them. Lay out this plan for the owner and see if it jibes with what he is looking for. Also lay out how you are going to change the safety culture. Because that will be a hurdle, and you will probably have to lead the charge. So to speak. You just posted a dressing this as I typed, so you know.
Sounds like a good opportunity to me.
 
First, I'm not even a pro arb, for the sake of full disclosure. Plus, I have not been in either of the situations that you have described, as far as wanting to hear from people with similar experience is concerned.

The question I have is, how do you feel about your old boss's ability to sell enough tree work to keep you busy? Or is he going to expect you to become the sales guy for this new tree division you're talking about? Do you think your new boss will be willing to fairly freely buy you the gear that you think you will need to do the jobs?

My own guts tell me that the fact that he's a former tree guy himself, and misses it, bodes well for the future. At 26 years old, which was a long time ago for me, I felt that I was at my physical peak, as strong as I would ever get in my life. If the company you are currently working for is managing to wear out the ass of a 26 year old stud like yourself, to the point that you are already questioning your ability to continue at this breakneck pace, it seems to me like the writing is on the wall. The position you hold at your current company is essentially that of a professional athlete. Does the company you currently work for have any kind of a big benefits package in addition to your hourly wage, that adds value on top of your wage, such as medical benefits, pension funds, or annuity funds? Would that extra stuff, if it exists, be lost with a move to your new employer, resulting in an actual decrease in pay when all is said and done? Or is the new company matching your entire package, plus paying you slightly higher wages?

I know what I'm about to say could screw your life up by causing you to make a choice that does not work out in the end. Having said that, if I were 26, and had no wife and children depending on me, I think I would be willing to risk more in order to have a shot at a position that might allow for a stable transition into a role you can fulfill as you get older.

Another big question I have is whether you feel as though you have any kind of natural ability to organize a growing company, to in effect end up as a field general, capable of tracking multiple crews and providing what they need to do their jobs, and to keep it all organized? This is something you'd have time to grow into, but some folks just seem to be well organized by their nature.

So, as I said, if I had no wife, no kids, was 26 years old, had relatively low expenses, etc., I think I would take the chance on a new venture that gave me room to grow and transition into a longer term role.

I hope my opinion does not mess you up.

Tim
 
If the job you have now is wearing you out. You will eventually be worn out. Plan accordingly. Discuss this with your present employer to see if you are part of their long term plan.
Thinking long term is good. Who will best match your long term needs/goals.

If you make the shift, stipulate control of safety protocols on all tree jobs.
 
You guys are solid thanks for the input.
I have to say that with my current job, part of why the pace is what is it has to do with that I work fast hard and dont always take the 2 breaks our employee manual says we get. And Im competitve, i wanted to be the best here and wanted to move up fast. I feel like I invited it but not sure how to slow down. They say I'm part of the long term plan, but I think what that means is they need real good crew leaders and occasional sales help when the sales calls are close to my house.
Almost a lateral move as far as pay and bemnies, just a little pay raise to start.
 
Take your breaks, even if it's just up in the tree, on days when it's nice enough out. Maybe have a way to get the ground crew to send up some granola bars and bananas, or something. Enjoy the scenery at the top of the canopy for 10 or 15 minutes at a time. At age 26, it is amazing how much your body can recover from fatigue in such a short period of time. It might make the whole day seem a lot more pleasant.

Tim
 
Just from personal experience, if you're the main climber, you're relied upon to do a majority of the dangerous/difficult/draining work, both physically and mentally. If you're being asked to take on that much responsibility, train a crew of groundies, manage site safety and essentially create a reputation for this company, I'd be looking for a little more than a little raise...maybe even a stake in the forestry division of his company.

I'd say you have great options in front of you. It's sound like you like this landscaper guy and he's offering a good opportunity to get in and grow his company. On the other hand what future job prospects does your current employer offer. If you're paid well and enjoy your current gig I'd float the idea of adding another climber onto your crew to share the load. I've contracted exclusively with other climbers for the last 6 years or so and it's amazing how much more work you can get done as a crew when everyone is fresh and on the same page. Work doesn't wear you down as bad when you get a break from production climbing to do production grounding. Take care of your climber and they'll take care of you.
 
You're at the right age to build something out of nothing. Ask your old boss to meet you someplace for dinner on your day off, and ask him if he's thought about what is going to happen in 20 years. You'll more than likely still be around, will he? Is it a sole proprietorship? Opportunities to become a partner? Will his kids inherit the company, and immediately sell it and wave goodbye? Lots of stuff to consider. I'm the wrong guy to ask... no faith in anyone looking out for me, unless I'm involved to the point where the only way to get rid of me is to pay me to leave... I'd be all over the move just because it sounds like you could build your own future, instead of tagging along with somebody else's ideas about the future.
 
Stay where you are at. Leaving a good thing to try and develop a business for somebody else will frustrate you. Unless this guy is willing to make you a partner you will have to put out way too much effort. As skilled climbers we are the key to a successful business. I have been in this business for 24 years and have been through that same situation.
 
If you're good and handle the transition with consideration, the present company will be happy to take you back if need be. Ask for an incentive with the landscaper. You are basically being asked to build his tree care department. If you do it well, you should get paid for it, some type of bonus. Or at least ask him to allow you to use the company equipment to do side jobs on weekends. Sit down with the owner and make a business plan. Where do you want to see the company in 1,5,10 years. What type of equipment will you need along the way. Who's going to sell, marketing plan, when to buy a stump grinder etc...

Doing big nasty removals all day every day is like dog years... hard on the body.. Fun to be so productive, but at what price?
 
Part of my thinking behind this change is that I am trying to start finding what I want to do next now, as opposed to being physically aged and then trying to start figuring out what direction k this industry I want to go in.
If I make this move, I will be learning a lot on how to "do more with less". I still think I would like to own a business one day, so learning to work effectively with a lesser set up is a big lesson to learn.
Also, I currently have some excellent coworkers. In this job change I'm going to learn how to be a true crew leader and how to train people.
Worse case scenario, new job doesnt workout, I realize owning a small tree biz ain't for me, and at 28 i change the direction of which Im heading in this field. Cant learn from wondering how something might have been, nor by settling for what is known and "easy".

Thanks to everyone for their input, I took it all to heart. I will blame treebuzz if im unhappy with my decision.
 
Thanks for sharing CutHigh. I'm in similar/different situation; I imagine 90% of all Arborists struggle with similar dilemma's... How to preserve the body while maintaining or increasing the income/sometimes production...

I've 7 yrs on you age wise, though you have twice my arb experience. For a large part of last summer I was leading 1, 2 guys on jobs sent on by the boss. I'm a full-time arb, though only a part-time climber - sometimes weeks without climbing, sometimes days of it in a row - it's random. Days are exhausting - hard to have a life outside of the job when you're so tired after. I know I can't do this forever. I know this job has it's 'best before' date. I am sort of 'lucky' in a way though that I currently don't have any 'dependants'; if I were to change jobs - no one would be affected but me. It's good to hear that I'm not alone in this dilemma - we're all struggling with similar ones...
 
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