Footlocking technique...

Blinky

Blinky

Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Rather than continuing to derail Nick D's thread I figured we should have one devoted to opinions on footlocking technique and practice.
This is NOT a thread for debating whether footlocking is good, bad or indifferent. If you don't like footlocking you can save yourself some time by simply ignoring it.

I don't really consider myself qualified to do this but at the moment no one is doing it so here goes. Anybody who footlocks regularly can help by adding their ideas and opinions. Feel free to contradict what I'm saying, I'm no expert.

I wish Mark Chisholm would chime in here, I doubt anybody could explain it better and he's already gone thousands and thousands of feet more than I'll ever go in my whole life.

I'm picking up where we left off in Nick's thread asking about gear. We were talking about getting your feet locked onto the rope. I'm starting, naturally, with the second part, getting your weight over your feet. To summarize, it's not how tightly you pinch the rope but how you bend it around your foot and get it to tighten... it's like a knot... kinda.

If you're using ascenders, take a rappel device in case it works really well and you go higher than you planned. The tether on the ascenders I use for working is about 33" from top of the frames to bottom of the tie-in biner. It lets me stop anytime without losing ground.

BTW, I usually have my right foot on top of my left, it's definitely harder for me to go the other way.

Somewhere on here I tried to explain (as I understand it) the other part of footlocking, the part about getting your weight OVER your feet.

When you crunch up, it pitches you back away from the rope and you're mostly on your arms, you don't want to be like that any longer than you have to because it's exhausting.

You need to straighten your back and lean (balance) forward BEFORE you push up, otherwise you'll just be pulling with your arms and it will blow you out really fast. That's where learning to sit on your locked on feet helps, it teaches you to get over them and off your arms while your legs are still bent. It's kind of a timing thing once you get going but first you have to build the habit of staying over your feet.

This is Rob B. at the Southern TCC in 2008, look at his posture and how close he keeps the rope to his chest...

SCTCC__2008_38.jpg


SCTCC__2008_39.jpg


Your legs have to do most of the work. If your arms are tiring fast, you're not using your legs enough.

Another thing, let the rope drop off your feet during the crunch and sweep into a new lock every time. Pointing toes down helps that part. You'll miss a rope sometimes and it will suck, but after some slow practice you'll be able to grab a new lock pretty much every time. It's not intuitive to drop the rope but it helps you get up high with your feet during the crunch.

I think a lot of the talk about footlocking being so hard has to do with using a prusik competition style. It IS harder that way because you can't easily rest and if you let down onto the knot it's hard to get it loosened back up.

Footlocking is like using a throwline, you have to believe you can do it and see it in your mind, it's not hard... it's EASY. Believe that.

...and don't forget how cool you'll look doing it.
 
I'm not sure it was a total derail, he did ask about footlocking - anyway good move to start a new thread.

Good stuff Blinky. I can see that this would be a really good way to enter a tree if one can get the hang of it (no pun intended).

With the short trial climb I did moments ago, it seems to me that if you get the feet to lock correctly and consistently, the rest will be pretty easy.

It also seems that the feet under the butt is critical as it is in so many climbing methods - notice where Rob's feet are both pics. I'll have my video up sometime today; it isn't going to be pretty, but I'm sure it will be entertaining.
 
To add when dropping a lock to go into a new one, always keep the rope in the inside of the knees and outside of the boot that is used on the bottom of the lock. A lot easier knowing where your foot is at all time then a swinging rope and helps to insure not missing a lock.

I personally feel the speed at which you footlock really makes the difference on how hard it is on your body. Compare it to body building with power cleans. One smooth, explosive move is a lot easier to repeat and keep doing then if you where to break each step down and go about it like that. Muscles will become more fatigued the longer you hold any one position. Just keep the cyle going and your arms shouldn't become any more tired then your legs, and with it comes a rythme that gives each person the speed.
 
Just got back in from another try - I can't keep the rope from slipping. I tried several different things but when I press down on my legs, I can almost lift my body - but not quite. With a little help with my arms, I can go up the rope, but it is tiring. My arms don't fatigue - I just get tired and winded quickly.

I've got to figure out what I need to do with my feet to 'lock' the rope. I'm tempted to use Pantins and get the feel of the motion, etc. then go back to footlocking. I'm a little frustrated.
 
Something to add to Blinky's mental thing: Since Charlotte, footlocking has gotten progressively easier for me, because fl was the one event that freaked me out because I knew I couldn't complete it. But I did it and hit that 49.5ft bell. And I think the confidence I've gained from that has helped tremendously. The other half of it is I'm doing it every day I can, and doing pull ups every day. That has helped a lot.

Now, I have a question to ask. Watching a lot of other people footlock, I realize that when they stand on their feet and advance, their pushing both hands up the rope at the same time. Where as I tend to advance with my right hand and my left is just there for balance or whatever, about chest level. Then both arms come up and I go into my crunch. Is there a trick to advancing both arms up at once, or is it just something that comes with repetition?
 
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Just got back in from another try - I can't keep the rope from slipping.... I'm a little frustrated.

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Flat bottom boots with a large heel can be hard to learn to lock with. If you have a pair of hiking boots with a wedge sole try those.
Blinky gave great advice and instructions. It is a skill that some pick up easily but some cannot.
Don't beat yourself up. I'm very impressed that you are even trying this.

Dave
 
practice taking a lock and letting go completely with your arms. then do like squats on the rope without grabbing the rope or holding it with your hands as little as possible. stick out your chest, get your posture right so all your energy is directed upward and none is lost side to side movement. I have a length of rope in my garage that is only long enough to take one lock and then I reach for the beam. I take my hands completely off the rope as I lunge for the beam.
 
Well done Chip!!!! Ranger, I too have just been doing it a limited time,( maybe 20 times?, could have been a lot more, but I severely sprained my knee, so I was a no-footlocker for a month) but I have done 50 feet in around 28 seconds so far.

I used to do the 2 handed thing too, I found by leaning back a bit and keeping my back straight, it is easy to advance both hands under the prussik
 
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I wish Mark Chisholm would chime in here, I doubt anybody could explain it better and he's already gone thousands and thousands of feet more than I'll ever go in my whole life.


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Are we really allowed to climb trees in those fancy little slippers that he puts on to set records??????/??

No I don't thing so. Just one like to see Mark set his times in real work boots like we all should do.

Your the one that put the hores on the post.

Want to back lash, I think comps are bull, time verse money is the real test. How do we work that into the work climb? real work vers joke bell ring.
 
Dave makes a good point. Try it in sneakers Ron, no gap... and remember, it's the bend, not the pinch. Using your hands to compensate will decrease the security of the lock. It's probably some little simple thing. I wish I could be there to show you, I bet you'd get it quick. Are you feet 90 degrees to each other or more parallel?
 
I'll try the sneakers. I think I'm close. The test I've been using is to try to lift myself only with my legs and the footlock. So far, I can't but as I said, I'm close because with just a little help with my arms I go up.

My feet are 90°; I'm just wondering if there's something I'm not quite getting right on the rope wrap.

I have to go to school today for a while, and help Bruce Smith (On Rope) take down a pesky tree in his yard tomorrow so it'll probably be Sunday or Monday before I can try again.

I appreciate all the tips.
 
Wow, I was practicing earlier. It is hard! And if I get good, I am sure I will be in shape! I didn't have my line set high. And kept trying. By the last couple times, I did get a couple of good thrust in, followed by a slip.

Started feeling a little better with it, but a long way off still. It would be nice to practice with someone though.

One good question that I have. What techniques do you use for getting down. (your preswick is hard to reach) I set a line in front of me (not being far from the trunk) and used my Rig to descend. But would like to know what else works, and esp when in the wide open. I know if you are working, then you should just end up in the tree.
 
I use a figure 8 to get down. Just hang from your prussic, install the figure 8, take a lock and reach up to bring the prussic down, then control your decent with the figure 8.

And it definitely gets you in shape. Since I've gotten semi-good at footlocking, I've been able to do pull ups, something I couldn't do before and my core strength has been increasing. This summer, when I finally have some free time I'm going to be footlocking 20' or so every day, starting with 5 times and day and working my way up. My neighbor who is in to fitness says just going up and down every day will help my form and breathing. Hopefully combined with a diet and regular work I can shed a few pounds.
 
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I appreciate all the tips.

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Ron, just checking, are you doing this on a doubled rope or single? It's way easier to footlock a doubled rope. This has been mentioned before but an excellent way to learn how to get a good lock on a rope is to footlock the tail climbing DdRT. Once you have your lock consistent DdRT then try locking on doubled rope. It will seem easy compared to locking the tail DdRT.
-moss
 
I guess this is a personal preference thing, but footlocking single line is easier I think, depending on how you do it. You only have to lift half the weight of the rope, and you only have to worry about catching one part of the line, instead of two. Plus, you don't have to isolate your tip if you're tying off on the ground.
 
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I guess this is a personal preference thing, but footlocking single line is easier I think, depending on how you do it. You only have to lift half the weight of the rope, and you only have to worry about catching one part of the line, instead of two. Plus, you don't have to isolate your tip if you're tying off on the ground.

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i agree
 
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I guess this is a personal preference thing, but footlocking single line is easier I think, depending on how you do it. You only have to lift half the weight of the rope, and you only have to worry about catching one part of the line, instead of two.

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I really have to jump in on this one. It is NOT a personal preference thing. Its a science thing. Its physics. It's also about having the right gear for the job.

Friction is at the heart of it all. Well, that and gravity. Friction is either your friend or your enemy. In footlocking it is both at once.

In footlocking the rope, that is, feet-on-rope, friction is your friend. In advancing a prussik or ascender, friction is the enemy. Since the two items are done simultaneously, that's where you get friction being both friend and enemy at the same time. The key is to maximize the friendship and minimize the enemyship.

Footlocking a twin line beneath you offers TWICE as much rope and therefore twice as much friction. The lines pretty much stay together, so the issue of having to catch two lines as opposed to one is hardly a point. An advantage of having twice the friction at your feet is, let's just say, from the standpoint of physics, it's double the advantage over an SRT line. This is not about personal preference, this applies to the laws of the natural world around us.
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You only have to lift half the weight of the rope,

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I have to ask, Where are you lifting any rope? You're lifting your feet, clamping the rope(s) with your feet and propelling yourself vertically. With a twin rope you don't have to be as 'precise' as with a single line. You can be rather sloppy with a paired line and still get a slip-free footlock. Why? Because you have the advantage of double the friction in DbRT over the single line of DdRT and SRT.

Don't get me wrong, I love SRT, long-time and current user. However, in having dual ascenders, you have the choice of SRT or DbRT on any climb. I swap back and forth between the two, whichever serves a greater advantage depending on the particular tree. Most of the time I'll go doubled. Treework is hard enough as it is. I'll take an advantage wherever I can get it.
 
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It's way easier to footlock a doubled rope. This has been mentioned before but an excellent way to learn how to get a good lock on a rope is to footlock the tail climbing DdRT. Once you have your lock consistent DdRT then try locking on doubled rope. It will seem easy compared to locking the tail DdRT.
-moss

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Moss is right on with this. In your standard DdRT (traditional or split-tail) you have a number of things going against you, which is why so many climbers have one heck of a time doing it. Footlocking the tail gives only one line, so you have to be rather precise in how it routes over your feet. Second, DdRT is a 2:1 system, so you can do a perfect footlock, but as soon as you advance the hitch, you go back down half the distance you just gained. Third, the friction of your friction hitch, on the way up, is your enemy. If you weight the hitch in between strides, the 'grip' on the rope (friction) must be overcome. That means either shoving the sucker up against the resistance, or releasing it to lessen the resistance, then you advance it, then weight it again and repeat. Or you can not weight the hitch between strides but that means gripping the rope with your hands while lifting your feet and locking, kind of a static pull-up, but this is a more physically intensive manner and you still only gain half (at best) the vertical travel of your footlock. I say half <u>at best</u> because there is some slop in your split tail, saddle bridge and saddle itself (heard this termed 'sitback'). Then there's rope stretch which isn't so much a loss, but it doesn't really help anything. All little losses add up to the whole, each and every lock.

Twin line DbRT and single SRT experience these areas of losses, but gain the efficiency in being 1:1 methods. I find using one of the 1:1 rope techniques, minimizing saddle loss, rope stretch and using an ascender overcomes much of the 'little losses' inherent in the overall system. Twin line ascent gives half the rope stretch over single line ascent, and double the friction on you feet.

This is where Moss is coming from in suggesting "Once you have your lock consistent DdRT then try locking on doubled (twin or paired) rope. It will seem easy compared to locking the tail DdRT."


If you are using a dual ascender you can literally do every footlock, either way. For side-by-side, in the moment comparison, try this. You have two lines coming down through the the dual ascender, two lines for your feet to grip. Footlock both, you are 1:1 DbRT. Footlock only one of the two, you are now 2:1 DdRT as one side (the footlock side) is in motion and the other side stays anchored and in place by that side of the ascender. You will feel a very distinct difference in performance and you will fully understand why guys have so much trouble footlocking in 2:1. It's analagous to walking up a steep sand hill where for every two steps you take, you slide back one.
 
Which brings up the question, have you ever used dual ascenders and actually tried this?

I have. Thousands upon thousands of times, both twin line and SRT. I can't say I like one better than the other, I love them both and climb them both, but I'm very clear on the differences.

Single line give you half the grip on rope by your hand (11 mm is 11 mm in SRT, but is ~22 mm twin) and the surface area of rope that can be gripped by your feet in SRT is also half of that of twin line and therefore requires double the friction on the single line to prevent your feet from sliding back down. Also (not to derail the thread) SRT requires twice the friction pressure on rope by your belay device as compared to a piece that accommodates the two lines.


This isn't an issue of "I think" or "I feel". This is physics and can be quantitatively measured.

I may be mis-stating that there is half the friction using the twin-line technique over SRT. There is the same amount of friction as with SRT (your mass vs. gravity), the friction is just split equally to each side.
 
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