First day on the rope runner

Try messing with the type of hitch cord and rope you use. I have a zk2 that runs perfect on cherry bomb and 10 mil armor prus with a 5 wrap 1 turn XT but the same cordage and knot won't even hold my wieght on blue moon and locks up on tachyon. And I have noticed that a quick bump on the hitch to get the wrench to set can be crucial to keep a properly functioning hitch. Also Kevin did have some amazing advice on using the back bone of the runner for fine adjustment I found that sweet spot and it's soooooooo nice.
 
TimBr said:
[snip]
I may take to the practice of manually "cocking" my Rope Wrench to its "fully loaded" profile prior to putting any of my weight at all onto my hitch. It occurs to me that the short period of time where the Rope Wrench is normally engaging through its connection with the stiff tether, is also allowing the friction hitch to bite down onto the rope at the same time. If the biting of the hitch onto the rope only slightly outruns the "setting" of the Rope Wrench, the hitch will start out at the top of a descent tighter than it should be. While it feels ok at the start, it naturally gets tighter the further one descends.
[snip]
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I'm on the mk-1 too and setting the wrench as you describe works great and solves the problems you describe. (y)

Still need a dailed in rope and hitch cord (type, length and diameter) combo:frenetico:
 
WaitakKauri said:
I'm on the mk-1 too and setting the wrench as you describe works great and solves the problems you describe. (y)

Still need a dailed in rope and hitch cord (type, length and diameter) combo:frenetico:
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Thanks so much for this response, WaitakKauri. It's really nice to know that someone else had the same issue that I do, and that my thoughts on how to work around the problem actually worked out for someone else.

It may still be a little while before I get a chance to climb and try it, but your input has me really excited about the next time I do.

I believe that I have a good hitch cord, rope and knot combination, but the proof will be when I try cocking the wrench next time I climb and really see what happens.

The next question is, why is it necessary? It seems like there are plenty of folks using the Rope Wrench to whom this tightening of the hitch does not happen. Maybe they just have a small technique they use during the process of "engaging" the Rope Wrench that allows the Wrench to fully engage before the hitch. I'm talking here about the way they manipulate the hitch itself, without touching the body of the Rope Wrench.

It's nice to know that manually cocking the Rope Wrench will work, but having to do so seems to defeat the purpose of the stiff tether.

Thanks again so much for your input on this, WaitakKauri, it is much appreciated.

Tim
 
You can try twisting to hitch a little the opposite way you wrap it around the line thus loosening the bight on the line and engaging the wrench. I usually bump the top of the hitch real fast to fully engage the wrench before I put my full wieght on it.
 
Nasshotgun said:
You can try twisting to hitch a little the opposite way you wrap it around the line thus loosening the bight on the line and engaging the wrench. I usually bump the top of the hitch real fast to fully engage the wrench before I put my full wieght on it.
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Really great advice, Nasshotgun! Thanks so much for this. You tried to tell me about "bumping the hitch" in your previous post, but I failed to listen closely enough. Thanks for your patience with me, and your willingness to repeat your good advice a second time.

Thanks also for the suggestion to untwist the hitch a little bit prior to loading up the Rope Wrench. I'll definately give that a try. I really appreciate your help on this.

I'm going to have to go back and read this thread from the beginning, as it seems I may have hijacked it a bit. Apologies for the derail, and thanks to everyone for all of the help.

Tim
 
macswan said:
View attachment 31298 I just set this up, haven't used it yet, I have high hopes.

Anybody tried tending this way yet?
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Much belated comment on this post, as I'm currently re-reading the whole thread in order to try to pick up on some of the subtleties that I might have missed the first time I read through this.

Macswan, this was a great idea and beautiful execution. Having it pulling evenly from the center looks like the way to go, to me.

Thanks for posting this.

Tim
 
Hey Tim what's your rope hitch knot combo? Maybe you said before and I missed it.
Biggest thing I might suggest is that the zk1 is longer, has farther to travel to engage, and is overall much less streamlined than zk2. Keep your eye on tree bay, folks are selling them cheap and it's a drastic upgrade from zk1
 
mikbro81 said:
Thanks for asking. I do love it. Unfortunately, I don't get to spend much time on it because it's not company approved. Hopefully it will be some day. For now I can only work srt on side jobs and rec climbs when I have the time.
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This is another one of those posts that contained a subtle statement that I failed to pick up on the first time that I read it.

Are you saying that not only are you not permitted to climb using the Rope Runner, but that any form of SRT whatsoever is forbidden by your employer?

No Rope Wrench, no Hitch Hiker, no Bulldog Bone and therefore no ability to be lowered to the ground in an emergency?

If true, and you feel strongly about wanting to climb using SRT, I would try to bend their ears about the safety factor of being able to be lowered in an emergency. Find out what their objections are to permitting the use of SRT, and then come back with a demonstration of why SRT is safer and more productive, and also easier on the body long term.

While you're waiting for them to make a change, look around for other outfits that will allow it, just to have a backup plan in case they're really stubborn about it.

Sometimes, it's just a power thing, the decision making process that is. If an idea does not originate at the top, it can't be any good. We tell you, you don't tell us.

And that is fine; it's their money. Only when they start losing all of their best help to a competitor might they start to care.

That's just my perspective on things. A lot of times it's just easier in life to move to an organization that comports with how you want things to be, than it is to change the way the organization that you already belong to operates.

Tim
 
JontreeHI said:
Hey Tim what's your rope hitch knot combo? Maybe you said before and I missed it.
Biggest thing I might suggest is that the zk1 is longer, has farther to travel to engage, and is overall much less streamlined than zk2. Keep your eye on tree bay, folks are selling them cheap and it's a drastic upgrade from zk1
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Hey, JontreeHI! Thanks so much for this post! Your point about the length of the Rope Wrench ZK-1 versus the Rope Wrench ZK-2 is an interesting and subtle observation. Thanks for the suggestion about looking on Tree Bay. I've never used the ZK-2, and for the most part I like the refinements that it offers. The couple of things about it that I did not care for just in doing the research on it prior to purchase was the lack of an adjustable sized opening for the rope to pass through, and the fact that the side walls of the ZK-2 had openings in them. I just imagined twigs jamming themselves in there every chance they got. Probably neither of those items is really very important in practice, however.

I must say though that I truly love the appearance of my Rope Wrench ZK-1. The stainless steel with the Singing Tree logo etched into it is truly a work of art. Your idea that the shorter throw of the Rope Wrench ZK-2 causes it to possibly engage more quickly than the ZK-1 is really interesting to me and has merit on its face. I will keep an open mind.

As to my rope, hitch cord and knot combination, I'd just like to say a word about performance first. I have had it happen that using the exact same rope, hitch cord and knot combination would perform much differently on one day than it did on a different occasion with no weather variables. I put the difference down to operator factor, and not the combo itself.

On my Rope Wrench I consistantly use a greenish looking Mamut rope that is 70 meters in length. I no longer remember what the name of the rope is, but it is a mountaineering rope, very dynamic, I think rated as a "dry" rope, meaning it resists moisture and dries out more quickly than standard ropes. Not that this matters to tree climbers who are not supposed to be falling, but the rope was rated to take in excess of 10 falls before it is required to be retired. This info just speaks to the strength and durability of the rope, I think. I love the 70 meter length; it allows me to use a pretty high tie-in point and still reach the ground with the other leg.

I use a Knut hitch with four wraps. The friction cord I use currently, after glazing some 10mm Beeline, is that soft yellowish stuff, which I think is called Sterling RIT, around 9mm diameter, if I recall correctly. I'll check these facts later; my handheld's battery is dying on me and I need to transmit this post and then recharge it, before it dies on me.

Thanks for your interest and your help. Much appreciated.

Tim
 
macswan said:
it was a spare tether attachment I got from Kevin, I think they were making them. I guess any sort of thin washer would fit the bill really.
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So I found these thin metal plates with holes in them at Lowes. Did some simple drilling and cutting and tried to mimmick that piece on the opposite side. Thanks Mac for posting that picture. Works very well and is super easy to set up.

What is the formable play doe stuff you guys are putting on the runner for comfort? I know its in here somewhere but couldn't find it. Thanks.

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That's the ticket mike. I'm still hunting for a ready made piece, no tools. Would be much improved to tend from the center I think. At first when my runner was shiny and new I really wanted the sugru, but now that it's broken in and smoother I'm not wanting it so much. My hands are used to it, or it takes less force to break it, or both
 
JontreeHI said:
That's the ticket mike. I'm still hunting for a ready made piece, no tools. Would be much improved to tend from the center I think. At first when my runner was shiny and new I really wanted the sugru, but now that it's broken in and smoother I'm not wanting it so much. My hands are used to it, or it takes less force to break it, or both
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Are you calling me a wuss Jon? : ) My little wussy hands!!!

I really like that tending spot, however, I have found that the bolt right behind those points is even better when weighted with a foot ascender. It is almost zero friction from that point. The runner doesn't collapse at all and just glides up the rope. Haven't come up with a good way of creating a tending point there yet. Probably won't either :aburrido:

Runner is a race car though, you guys are right.
 
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macswan said:
http://www.amazon.com/Sugru-SMLT8-Hardware-Sealer-8-Pack/dp/B008URBC9I

This shit most likely, think you can get it at lowes now too.
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Target stores, too. A cool thing I had happen at Target recently is that I went looking for the Sugru, couldn't figure out where to start looking, and so asked an employee for assistance; one of the stock people. They whipped out a small handheld computer that told them the exact location where I needed to look for it. Naturally they were out of stock on the most popular variety, the package with different colors, but I was able to buy it in black. I'm not sure if they sell the larger packages; might just be the ones that are three or four to a pack.

I still haven't used any of mine yet; it's sitting in my freezer, although I did give one pack away to a friend.

Tim

P.S. I think almost all of the Target store stock personnel carry those handheld computers, which can make it easy to find anything you're looking for if you can just manage to flag one of them down.
 
monkeylove said:
Or Tim you could just tell us where it was in your Target store. I think they are all laid out about the same way.
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It was near the left rear part of the store, in one of those smaller rows near the household supply bits and pieces. I think the tool section is in an aisle right nearby. One or two rows in from the main isle that runs the length of the rear of the store.

Tim


* Update: I remembered after I posted the above details that I had written down the aisle number on the Sugru package in case I ever wanted to go back for more when I finish up with the first package. I just had to dig it out of the freezer to get the information.

In the Target store that I go to it was found in aisle F-43. I hope this helps.
 
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