cited by osha

[ QUOTE ]
The inspector that visited us flat out lied about several different things that I was cited for. ...
The inspector peppered me with questions first- then showed my a brochure that included information that made me realise that answers I gave could have incriminated my self with out knowing. I feel that they should have to give Miranda rights because they are like cops and you are legally liable for what they find.

[/ QUOTE ]

A couple of things to bear in mind when dealing with governmental "officers" is to expect them to do whatever they feel is necessary to intimidate you and to put the screws to you. This is the primary method for ensuring that others will readily "comply" with them and their (most usually) incorrect interpretation of the laws/regulations; and for ensuring their continued survival in a position of being able to lord it over their fellow man. Exceptions to that occur but are regrettably all too rare. If you take them to task and "lose" it'll be loudly plastered all over the media but if you "win" nobody hears a thing about it.

Whenever a governmental "officer" asks you a question you must anticipate their desire to use your response against you. Shut up, keep quiet, and don't say anything. If they ask you a question, kindly ask them to submit it to you in writing, and you'll get back to them with the answer at your earliest possible convenience.

Never forget that they work for you and not you for them. Sometimes they need to be reminded of the fact.

Glen
 
In Region VIII, Colorado included, there is a Regional/Local Emphasis Program in effect for a couple of years. When there's a REP in place it means that an inspector HAS to do an inspection if they see a tree company working. There are other industries that are under the REP too.

I've done some poking around the OSHA website to find out about the inspections. In about 40% of the inspections there are no fines. In the cases where there are fines, about 80% of the time the fines are reduced by 50% after the company talks with OSHA. It's rare that all of the fines that are sited on the original inspection are paid at 100%. The amount of the the fines are meant to get the companies, and the industries, attention. Through the grapevine the word gets out pretty quickly.

OSHA has just started another REP in another region. I read about it in TCI magazine but I can't recall which states are effected. If my memory serves me right, it is in the populated NE area. Be ready.
 
I can't help but wonder if all of these OSHA inspections are the result of a tree company owner with his ship in order turning in other tree companies.

Some of us were very enthused about the recent article where a tree company owner went after his competitors using the law.

Still enthused?

OSHA inspections are good, right?

I thought that article sucked.
 
The TCI article was about making sure that all tree companies had proper business licenses and insurance. Following proper workplace procedures is less important to the police.

I wonder how quickly OSHA would respond to a call about unsafe work practices. In the case of treework, they would have to react very quickly since our worksite can change within hours. Much different than offices or buildings. My guess is that anyone wanting to "rat out" a competitor to OSHA wouldn't be successful.

In this case, the inspection resluted from the REP, not a random call.
 
Hey Tom,

How about digital pics of the violating tree company sent in with the complaint to OSHA?

Does it really matter which branch of government the tattle tale tree company owner calls?

It seems to me the author of that article wouldn't hesitate to call OSHA. I need to re-write my business plan. It doesn't include a telephoto lens for my digital.

Did I mention that article sucked?

Back on topic:

I met a couple of guys for OSHA at a chainsaw safety seminar. I signed up for a voluntary inspection. The deal is no fines for any violations given that the company corrects same in 30 days. They want copies and will help you write a safety manual for employees. It was a good deal and an eye opener. The inspectors we got didn't know squat about arboriculture and OSHA and did not know about ANSI Z133. They came out to three different job sites and the biggest violation they could find was our fuel cans for the chainsaws.

I'm glad I signed up. Over all it was a good experience and it really did show the attitude of our company. Not that it would matter to the next inspector but somewhere I hope OHSA has a record of our effort.
 
The simple, obvious things, are all important. Those are what any inspector is going to notice. Something that will cost big money is not having an on-going safety education program. At a seminar the speaker said, "If it's not written down, it doesn't exist" Document any Tailgate Safety meetings or any spot training sessions. Date and what is covered, who attended. The records don't have to be anything fancy but it needs to be documented. Another zinger is not having a process for dealing with safety violations. there needs to be some consequence for breaking a safety rule. It's not good enough to just have rules there needs to be some kind of "time-out".
 
[ QUOTE ]
Another zinger is not having a process for dealing with safety violations. there needs to be some consequence for breaking a safety rule.

[/ QUOTE ]

I always wondered about that. The few places I worked as an employee in the US, people never wore chaps. The business always considered itself covered by having an old pair of chaps stashed away somewhere in the truck.

Aboot the strechAirs - don't know what to tell you X. They ARE made from a self-cleaning fabric out of Switzerland. We'll see what "self cleaning" means...

Yes they are expensive, but it beats climbing in potatoe sacks like the husky or stihl trousers plus, I am a professional and can afford good equipment. I just use mine when I need them. I go to work in jeans and always change on site. I, like you, as an independent contractor hate being told what to wear. Safety equipment is good but it is no substitute for know how - what govt agencies forget.
 

Attachments

  • 25307-artpics.webp
    25307-artpics.webp
    64.4 KB · Views: 40
Stretch pants from Pfanner, I wear them about 10 hours a day at least. I wash it twice a week if needed. i do wash it at least one time a week. When very dirty (from what at youre pants?), like falling in a muddy ditch, i wash it in the evening and its dry in the morning. That sticky pine juice, chainsaw oilspil, gearoil and motoroil is washed out without problem. I will take a pic of mine that is daily used for a year and some months. Its been washed three weeks ago as i am doing a tree survey right now.
 

Attachments

  • 25313-sawpants.webp
    25313-sawpants.webp
    134.2 KB · Views: 63
Tom, you stated some good information, thank you, that was news to me /forum/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[ QUOTE ]
Something that will cost big money is not having an on-going safety education program. At a seminar the speaker said, "If it's not written down, it doesn't exist" Document any Tailgate Safety meetings or any spot training sessions. Date and what is covered, who attended. The records don't have to be anything fancy but it needs to be documented. Another zinger is not having a process for dealing with safety violations. there needs to be some consequence for breaking a safety rule. It's not good enough to just have rules there needs to be some kind of "time-out".

[/ QUOTE ]

R Schra, Wow, that material sounds like some good stuff! I will look into buying these perhaps for a new climber (sounds like a good idea). I don't feel I need to wear them while climbing, yes I know accidents can happen, but cutting myself in the leg with a saw is not a concern of mine. Also, I should try a pair out for ground work, I do hate tripping over the regular chaps.

Tree Co, That voluntary inspection by OSHA sounds really helpful. It was nice of them to do that, actually sounds like they are trying to help. Hmmmmm, they probably use it as a training session themselves, /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif.

Good info here.

Now what about those fines Skew?
 
</font><blockquote><font class="small">Als antwoord op:</font><hr />
R Schra, Wow, that material sounds like some good stuff! I will look into buying these perhaps for a new climber (sounds like a good idea). I don't feel I need to wear them while climbing, yes I know accidents can happen, but cutting myself in the leg with a saw is not a concern of mine. Also, I should try a pair out for ground work, I do hate tripping over the regular chaps.



[/ QUOTE ]

If you like, those Pfanner sawpants are also available without protection against the chainsaw. Same outher material and model. Those are sold for/as climbing pants to, for 'normal' pruning with handsaw. But they cost $, i believe 140€ just as 'simple'pants. I am thinking to buy two for climbing and regular 'outdoor' use. Normal outdoor pants are ripped in a year with me and most brands dont have those long legged pants as i need. And a good pant cost also about 100-150€, so i go for the (grey)Pfanner.

Call me

R
o
n
a
l
d
/forum/images/graemlins/blush.gif
 
X- fines were as follows:1050.00 improper eye pro ( I was wearing a pair of Smith sliders- impact resistantplastic. Iget just as much wood in my eyes with osha glasses). 1500.00 no written hazard assesment available(I'm sure that most of you prepare those daily, right?).1500.00 no chaps(had to make two cuts after lopping top 50' out of bucket-guilty as charged).
The thing about the inspection was that by the inspector being untruthful, I feel as though the whole process is corrupt.
I was however able to negotiate the fines down significantly. Thank-you to Tom D for the informative feedback as well as Peter G at TCIA. Having TCIA as a resource was definately worth the dues.
Had my first work day in my shiny new 5.1 SIP britches- it wasn't all that bad. Although they were quite hot they are definately more wearable than my husky pants.
I suppose I will still look for the ultimate saw pant for adherance to code. ACHTUNG! (heels clack together- sig hiel salute to the the secret labor police)
 
[ QUOTE ]
X- 1500.00 no written hazard assesment available(I'm sure that most of you prepare those daily, right?).

[/ QUOTE ]

What is meant by a written hazard assesment? Is that an assesment of the tree? Or do you mean a written hazard work policy?
 
[ QUOTE ]
Geez, that's a screwing! /forum/images/graemlins/mad.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, did they at least give you a kiss on the back of the neck 1st? /forum/images/graemlins/date.gif

[ QUOTE ]
The thing about the inspection was that by the inspector being untruthful, I feel as though the whole process is corrupt.


[/ QUOTE ]

Ahh, yes, land of the free where you get all of the justice you can afford....

It is nice to dream of warrants and rights but in reality, you are over a barrel as soon as they walk on your site. ('Git ready to sqeal like a pig)

If they want to find something, they will. If the fines are so expensive, that they think you will hire a lawyer and get them lowered or thrown out, they will just lower the fine to the point that it is cheaper for you to just pay instead of investing in fighting for what is right. It is a no win for you either way.

/forum/images/graemlins/boohoo.gif
 
The proposed fines are almost always reduced. Skew should let you know that the final fine was. From our discussions I think they were reduced by 80%, an almost unheard of amount. Typically they are reduced by about 50% after they get your attention.

Back off the storm trooper allegations. OSHA has been in existance since [only] 1970 and our workplaces are safer and many more people are exposed to less hazardous workplaces because of OSHA. Sure, it's hard to understand that when faced with large fines for seemingly small infractions.
 
I shant back off the storm trooper allegations because that's exactly what it was like. Although I fully intend to comply with regs the next time an inspecter threatens to shut down my job for safety glasses or the like they can just go on and get a warrent from a federal judge. We'll see how that goes over with hizzoner.
Yeah Tom my fine was reduced but does that make it right that they can just take my hard earned funds without any recourse?
 
Skew, thanks for posting those original fines.

Work is really busy and I haven't had time to visit the buzz in a while.

Here's a question about glasses: I like to wear my hardhat with the muffs and screen. But when I wear saftey glasses with them, the glasses keep the muffs from getting a good seal on my head and the noise is definitely much louder (and most likely harmful). Plus the muffs pressing the glasses against my head gives me a headache after a while.

I do not want to be stuffing earplugs in and out of my ears all day. I think that would cause problems.

I want to keep my hearing good and my eyes protected for my OWN sake. But that's why I usually pass on the glasses and just use my screen, my eyes have never had a problem with that (17yrs) and my ears are protected well.


What do you others do?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

New threads New posts

Back
Top Bottom