Canopy anchors v Climbing skills

I'll move on about my climbing technique, but if my description doesn't make sense start this vid at 2:38, it's my basic technique DdRT or SRT. You'll see me kick my left foot out of the half hitch when I start making trunk contact higher up and then continue with one foot on the trunk, the other the foot ascender, arms continue doing the same thing. For the trunk climbing section technique is also the same DdRT or SRT.


I return you to Reg's excellent topic which is more about skills climbing the tree not the ropes.
-AJ
 
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I've climbed with moss a bunch...enough to attest that he's had quite an upright style in both disciplines. Very efficient.

I can see a beauty in structure climbing and slack tending only as the COG (belay device) moves. Getting foot holds between two points (opposing stems for instance) and being able to engage upward motion out of it. Sometimes your peripheries are moving up and preparing for the COG to follow and move into its new space. When the rope path is right, the slack just melts away as you move, other times a free hand takes care of it as the COG moves.

I love 1:1 slack tending! This doesn't always lend to being upright, but it's very much part of the fun for me.
 
moss said:
Yep, the brain and body gravitates to the efficient, remember how awkward your motion was the first time you ascended a rope? The rock climbing tip that's helped my rope ascent motion is the "resting position" hanging off your arms extended when you need to catch a breath. During an ascent I try not to sit back on my harness, when I'm lifting my legs for the next push I'm hanging on my arms and giving them a mini rock climber's rest. It's pretty much the same as secured footlock body motion except the feet are engaged more securely/efficiently on the rope.
-AJ
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moss said:
There's no difference in how I ascend, descend, tend slack, or move in the tree DdRT or SRT. What's different is 1:1 vs. 2:1 motion while moving up the rope and multiple redirects available SRT to increase horizontal range and load sharing on the anchor.

I'm stating the obvious but I don't believe that SRT with the new devices inherently makes a person a more "natural" climber on the tree. However if you're already good on the tree, SRT is going to open things up quite a bit. Gear has never made the climber and it never will. Smart gear use can make a climber more efficient and safer, no guarantees though.

Speaking of which a climber who mentored me when I was starting out taught me something he learned from an old-timer, maybe this is common knowledge, don't know, works well SRT or DdRT ;-)

The arm lanyard. There are four ways to deploy your arm as a lanyard, from strongest to weakest:
1. Arm over branch up to your shoulder, resting on your armpit, very strong, very stable, hands free
2. Crook of your elbow around a spar or branch, what I use most often besides a hand grab, very stable position, hands free
3. Crook of your wrist, a strong hold, leaves your fingers free for a task
4. Hand grab on a branch, most useful, very effective for quick moves but weakest of the four

Disclaimer: this assumes all your arm parts are working pretty well ;-)
-AJ
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I remember you teaching me this when we climbed the white pine in Boston. Thanks.
I'm enjoying the thread as like most discussions it broadens perspective and makes me reach out for more that I can do.
 
DSMc said:
Broken record here, but really? I use SRWP in small trees all the time. It is way easier than DdRT. You can just climb the tree, developing core strength, as Reg suggests and not worry about rope friction.

Also, I was just discussing with someone else that it is a mistake to judge a systems effectiveness or safety by someone who is misusing it.
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Really. It's not as effective in a small thick tree. I believe in using many different techniques. If it works for u, great. What ever works best for ur style is what u should use. But don't be afraid to use different techniques for different jobs. Why do some people think u have to pick sides on the single line vs drt issue?
 
SRT has made a huge difference in my efficiency. I find myself actually looking at the tree and making a plan prior to entry much more than dDrt where the main focus was to isolate a workable tip. I had a very efficient dDrt set up and was able to do relatively effortless ascensions using the anchor bridge system. Like many have said, I climbed the rope but not the tree. Was rarely upright as is the mechanics of body thrusting. I have been nursing my right shoulder for about 4 years now. I can trace the injury back to the day it happened. I had 6 huge bull pines to crown clean. I mean monsters for our area. My tip for several of them was the first limb I could hit with the throw bag. I estimate about 90'. That's pretty much my limit hand throwing. Anyway, after I got to my tip I leap frogged up to my final tip. Then on the way down I had to lower my tip again to the lowest limb just to have enough rope to hit the ground. I was using my 200' line. The repetition of throwing the throwbag over and over at maximum strength and the fact I body thrusted over 600' that day, in august just took its toll. It's gotten better, then worse, then better but has never fully recovered. Its changed my sleep positioning, the way I ride in the car, and how I work. I throw a football side arm now because I'm afraid to finally blow it out all together. Never seems like a good time to go see the ortho Dr. I am convinced, without SRT, I couldn't continue to milk this injury. A 90' ascent doing srt barely gets me breathing hard. At first, I felt like srt was much more difficult. I felt like it required more strength and ability to actually climb using my body. In dDrt I could just yank myself up. I find myself using balance and leverage more. Changing angles of my body to make progress, using the rope less and the structure of the tree more. There's less often a situation where I'd say, there's no way I can get way out there. Now I just have to figure it out and do it by using the tree structure and the nifty bling. I really don't have much to contribute compared to the likes of many of you but I wanted to share my experience with it.
 
Thanks for sharing all of that, Steve. Really great post. 600 feet of hip thrusting in a single day, 90 feet access by hand throwing a throw bag, barely breathing hard when going up 90 feet using SRT techniques. All really interesting data points. You, sir, are a beast.

I don't think I've ever come close to throwing a throw ball 90 feet by hand. The fact that you can ascend 90 feet SRT and barely be breathing hard tells me I need to get seriously back into doing roadwork.

It looks like I have another climbing hero to look up to and try to follow the example of.

I just had the thought that all of you big guns should get together and start producing posters of yourselves climbing. I swear I'd ring my bedroom wall with posters of Reg, August, Kevin, Dave, Andrew and you. I hope you can handle a little hero worship from a big fan.

If you don't mind my asking, by way of gathering up one more data point, how long would you estimate that it currently takes you to ascend up to an elevation of 90 feet using SRT techniques?

Thanks in advance for any answer you choose to give, and I'd love to hear that same question answered by anyone else that cares to do so.

Tim
 
sherwood7 said:
Really. It's not as effective in a small thick tree.... Why do some people think u have to pick sides on the single line vs drt issue?
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I am not the one picking sides here. I hear statements like the above all the time and just like to point out that a system's attributes do not suddenly change by the size of tree we are working on.

Use what you are comfortable with and works best for the tools you possess.
 
I'm no hero. I'm just a piker compared to the likes of the other guys you mentioned. The key is technique and the rite application of gear. I'm not a muscular guy. I do have stamina though and that has proven more productive than big guns. I love to watch the muscle bound guys at a fire. They've got 10 min of work in them and they're done. I can go a lot longer and I'm a 45 year old smoker. Old bull vs young bull adage I get winded just like everyone. Just not as fast. I have climbing high rise stairwells with all my fire gear but slow and steady wins it. Gotta be able to go to work when you get to the 15th floor. Breathing control is key in all forms of work imho. Steady pace.

I have no idea how long it takes me to go 90'. Maybe 2 to 3 min. Idk. I'll have to time myself. If you keep body positioning correct it's all quads. I'm on the road so I'll read and respond more later. As far as the calendar. Reg wins with his locks of hair and nice wool sweaters he wears to climb. Lol.
 
Steve Connally said:
I get winded just like everyone. Just not as fast. I have climbing high rise stairwells with all my fire gear but slow and steady wins it. Gotta be able to go to work when you get to the 15th floor. Breathing control is key in all forms of work imho. Steady pace.
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15 floors with all of your fire gear on, whew! Firefighting is not for sissies, that is for sure! Doing that stuff on a regular basis will surely whip a man into shape. Thanks for this post.

Tim
 
And then there's that whole blazing hot flames, noxious gases, collapsing buildings and exploding cows thing. Wait, that last one might not be an issue. Still, I really don't think that work is anything I would like to be doing. I'm sure it is rewarding work, though, and it is absolutely an admirable thing.
:tanguero:
 
monkeylove said:
My left arm and elbow are partially metal, there is no hanging for me anymore unless it is by muscle. Oh well at least I have a real reason to sit in my harness more, lol.
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I would suggest to add big magnets to your climbing equipment. :D

But having a plate and some screws in my right shoulder, I know, it sadly doesn't work.
 
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