Cabling

Nice to see we are ONE BIG HAPPY FAMILY.
It's Amon eye, not almond or almon. AKA "Loop nut".
I'm sure any good Arborist supply store can get 3/4" galvanized threaded rod, nuts and washers. A local hardware store may even be able to get it??
 
I have to throw in with the washer/amon eye tight to the tree group. If there is any movement we want it minimized. Putting any load on the rod will weaken it. Any of the rod that is being used is mild steel and pliable. The root diameter, the solid part without threads is really only about 11/16". Bending paperclips lead to breakage.

More rods should be used in codoms. It's good practice to support the weakest part of the tree. Putting rods low does that. If only cables are used the trunk can still wobble around and torque the union.

Tom
 
Thanks for smoothing things out fellas. X- you're right about the whole email/forum thing. It's hard to guess at someones emotions or mind set. Thanks for being grown-ups about it. /forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
No disrespect for Treebuzz but "we" didn't smooth things out. X might be trying to back pedal and that ain't smooth either. You couldn't handle my tone...weak. That was as nice as I could have said that. If you couldn't handle that then you shouldn't say anything at all. You just keep showing how feeble you are the more you talk. Because you don't know me from jack the more you should keep your pie hole shut. I didn't try to get anyway....you just didn't get it then you couldn't take it...your a mess. And keep my number out of your already empty phonebook. You couldn't call me for advice anyway, you couldn't afford it. As you can see I'm not the only one who thought your "rod job" sucked. They just have the ability to say it nicer and more professional so your feelings won't get hurt.

Now, in total respect for Treebuzz, I'm through with you. I'll accept an apology only in writing on this site in this thread and attach a pic of yourself in a tutu giving a kertsy.

your still a PUNK /forum/images/graemlins/wildmonkey.gif

I think I did it without any curses... /forum/images/graemlins/rock.gif

Later
 
All this talk about rods and steel and drilling still gets me down!!!

I think it would be more constructive to talk about alternative and less invasive cabling systems. As arborists (Guardians of the trees) it should be our duty to explore the most tree friendly, and of coarse the safest, systems. I am convinced that a synthetic sling construction is just as safe and strong as a steel system, and on the longterm much better for the tree. Infact if you use a sling construction you would not have the disscusion on when a rod bends or breaks or whatever. A sling has a much bigger carring surfice then a rod or thread.

Instead of slaging each other off, lets get creative!!! the iron age is long gone, this is the 20th century!

Maybe a combination of steel and sling?? whatever, but lets think of something better then drilling!!!!!

Is it not time to break a cycle!?!?

Jelte
 
[ QUOTE ]
I am convinced that a synthetic sling construction is just as safe and strong as a steel system, and on the longterm much better for the tree.
Jelte

[/ QUOTE ]

When you are fixing a tree with simply what looks like a weak crotch, the synthetic systems seem like a better way to go, but if the tree is cracked open, the synthetic support systems are not enough. The goal would be to isoloate the crack from movement and apply presure compressing them so the cambium can reattach and again form a complete sheet over the damaged area.
If only a flexable system is installed, the crack will continue to open and close, not allowing wound closure.
 
Jelte, The A300 has 1 thing to say about synthetic cabling systems; 37.6 states "Synthetic-fiber cabling systems shall be ultraviolet (UV) light resistant."
I think we (USA) don't have enough data on the synthetic systems to write it in a "Standard".
If you would like to enlighten us, please feel free. Or send it right to the ANSI A300 committee to :
A300 Secretary
c/o National Arborist Association(TCIA)
3 Perimeter Rd.- Unit 1
Manchester, NH 03103
USA

OR

email:
naa@natlarb.com

I know the committee is always looking for updated material.
 
/forum/images/graemlins/shocked.gifWow look at the sizes and strengths of that stuff! That largest size is almost 4" diam.!

And they are HIGHLY UV RESISTANT. Nice stuff.
 
SawD,

you wanted a picture of me in a tutu giving a curtsy

This picture isn't quite that, but maybe you'll accept it instead. And unfortunately it isn't me, but one of my past groundmen. Just pretend it's me.

Hope you like it. Hope it comes out clear enough on this site for ya.




If this isn't close enough to the tutu picture you wanted and therefor not accepted by you; then I guess it's really over between us. /forum/images/graemlins/frown.gif Such sad sorrow....
 

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[ QUOTE ]
if we don't explore the alternatives the ANSI will never make it a standard

[/ QUOTE ]

That's a fact! And rightfully so in my opinion. We as the practitioners need to utylize systems and gear and then understand the impact of such. We have the ability to gain first hand knowledge of our actions, if we care enough to take the time.

I am wondering one thing, how does everyone view the long term effects of a sling or rope around a trunk/lead? I've seen plenty of things wrapped on bark, tied around trees, or rubbing on them. The result didn't look any better than some of the bolts and rods I've seen. They all look like wounds. What do you think?
 
[ QUOTE ]
I am wondering one thing, how does everyone view the long term effects of a sling or rope around a trunk/lead?

[/ QUOTE ]
The synthetic systems should not be installed tight enough to cause trunk injury. These systems should be designed so they carry no wieght until unusual loads are encountered. Then, the sleave around the rope and the rubber shock absorber should cushion any loads enough, so it's not injuring the tree. So really, during 99% of the time, the presure at the ends of the system should only be carrying the weight of the rope.
If the tree is cracked and needs support, thats when we need to be using cables, rods and bolts.
 
Mark,

I think the key to replacing old tight cables with synthetic is pruning, wieght reduction. Actually i think this counts for all cabling/ankering work. On my trips to the states and looking at jobs with my father who works in the NY region, i noticed that there was a lot of cabling done without pruning or wieght reduction. Is this a normal practice? How do you guys deal with these situations?
 
For me, it's a case by case concept. I can't generalize, but I can say that more times than not, a hazardous situation calls for lightening the load.

One thing I hate is seeing huge cuts to reduce a hazard. Not just a heading cut, but removing a lead back to the trunk or reducing it by + 50%. Talk about invassive. I would rather drill a couple of small holes than remove all that energy producing ability and stored energy. But, like I said, it's case by case for me.
 
Mike,

thanks for explaining that. And just to come back to your last post about a situation with a leader that is already cracked open, i think you're right to say that a synthetic system is not enough, that there is to much movment for the crack to form new cambium and re-attatch. Maybe a combination of a thread bolt through the forlk and a synthetic anker 3/4 of the way up the leader would be the way to go. But here you are talking about resterastion work and not prevention. The tree would have to be pretty speical (a monument) to take this sort of action.

Would it be worth doing this to every tree with a cracked forlk? or would it not be better to fell it and start with a new tree that has a better chance of a future (a stronger mechanical build)?? Where do you draw the line of patching up and starting again??
 
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