Cabling a spreading silver maple

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Cobra isn't meant to be installed taught, and is to be inspected every two to three years to be adjusted so that girdling can be prevented.

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Please read the cobra manual or website before you make incorrect statements. By the way you mean taut I believe.

On page 8 of the current manual included with cobra kits there is discussion of Static breaking/cabling and on page 6, diagram 4 there is a representation of rigid tatic connection.

On the Cobra website inspections are: Crown bracing systems should be checked within the scope of the regular inspection of the trees. According to the Tree Inspection Guidelines, a visual inspection from the ground by qualified staff is sufficient for that purpose. Only if the regular inspection raises doubts about traffic safety or after extreme weather conditions, e.g. hurricanes, more detailed examinations (additional inspections) are required. The intervals of regular inspection depend on the age and condition of a tree and such inspection is performed accordingly every 1 - 3 years .
 
Fair enough, I bite my tongue in that respect. However, I would think a host of problems arises from installing synthetic cabling systems rigidly including girdling, and fibre abrasion. Would you put a tight band around a tree and let it sit there for longer than a year? No it would need adjustment on a yearly basis, and that would mean breaking out the block and tackle, getting the boys on the ground to pull, then readjust and set back into place all at the cost of the homeowner. I would think in splicing this system in this manner would require some extra form of lock stitching as there is that chance of slippage, Every static cordage splice I've seen in our trade requires lock stitching. For permanent bracing why not just install something more permanent such as steel cable, that way the only thing being inspected is if the eye bolts or lags are slipping, which if installed properly most likely won't. This is where I think there is both pros and cons to both systems, and they have their place. Static = Steel (The union is at that point where its not going to fuse and heal, and can be seen opening by wind); Dynamic = Cobra (as in flying squirrels case, where you dont want it to hit that point of no return, but still allow the tree to take on the stresses of the environment to become stronger). I'm more or less just insulted that working my pills off to become a CA is so quickly dragged through the dirt.
 
Video on "Non Shock absorbing installation" (at 10min)
http://www.sherrilltree.com/Professional-Gear/Dynamic-Cabling/Cobra-2-Ton-Plus-441

Jomco, I dont have to hang my head low because I did something wrong. I did this according to standards, with the owner knowing the benifits and the negitives of each cabling system. Yes I offered up both steel and dynamic, when THEY asked me to support their tree. I had the steel hardware sitting in my garage. The steel was conciderably cheaper, the owner did her own research, and decided a couple days later. Thats how important this tree is to them.

Thank you for your def of a Fault. My point in my original post was that each of us look at tree differently. Some of the things you mentioned as a fault I look at as a failure (yes it hasnt fallen yet but it will) ie. included bark "breathing" in the wind.

You are right I would replace my bridge with a slight nick in it, piece of mind. But I guess having 95' of tree hanging over my bedroom where I sleep at night doesnt warrent the same due dilligence. Remember the liabilities that we incure when we walk onto someones property, they asked me to support, I say naah it dont need that ("its snake oil") and it falls in one of the bad storms and hurts someone. That would destroy me in many ways. Piece of mind by the standards is the way I will go every time.
 
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I would think a host of problems arises from installing synthetic cabling systems rigidly including girdling, and fibre abrasion....

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Rather than think why don't you read about Cobra (and boa etc.) at www.cobranet.de and speak to people such as Erk Brudi or his Canadian associates. It is all well and good to think about cabling and listen to ravings on this board but why not go to the source. Speak to your cabling supplier and see if they can put you in touch with "experts".

The simple fact is that Cobra has a track record in Europe and the product meets or exceeds a set of European Standards. This is not witchgraft
 
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Jomco, I dont have to hang my head low because I did something wrong....

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Absolutely correct

Preventative cabling is one of the best things an arborist can do to aid in the conservation of urban trees. I would rank soil improvements as the most important thing and then cables. Pruning and deadwooding is window dressing by comparison.
 
I love the way you guys totally ignore the fact that polypropylene is totally vulnerable to a host of natural elements that steel can withstand.

How these facts can somehow give either you or your clients peace of mind is beyond me.

You're all a bunch of snake oil pushers too dumb to think for yourselves and apply just a smidgen of common sense to this issue.

I repeat, a truly sad state of affairs.

jomoco
 
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I love the way you guys totally ignore the fact that polypropylene is totally vulnerable to a host of natural elements that steel can withstand.
You're all a bunch of snake oil pushers too dumb to think for yourselves and apply just a smidgen of common sense to this issue.
jomoco

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Ignore... No. Use them to the standards set by the manufacture... Yes. Maintain to the standards set by the manufacture... Yes.
The inspection schedule is the same between steel and synthetic according to ANSI.

Steel is effected by environmental factors that synthetics can withstand (dont have to worry about). Rust, Metal fatigue, lags pulling out, shear forces on hardware. Oh and the thimbols can fall out causing cracks in the dead ends. Ive seen many EHS systems fail due to broken dead ends, only heard of one Cobra system that was girdling slightly (it was corrected upon inspection).

Lets agree on something... That we disagree about this.
 
So, you don't believe that fire is a natural element, or that polypropylene starts to degrade at 150 degrees Celsius?

That squirrels and rats are known to chew through synthetics? That both are known to make their nests in trees?

That there are many species of trees with thin fragile barks that can be girdled by applying anywhere near their rated holding capacities?

That not informing your clients of these known facts before selling them on these synthetic cabling systems is ethically acceptable?

That ignoring these facts and continuing to sell these inferior systems to unwary clients is not a classic example of snake oil salesmanship?

BS!

jomoco
 
I'm sitting on the sidelines for the rest of this one, Mrtree I thank you for your courteous response and direction to my last post. Jomoco, your probably a great person to learn the steel portion of cabling from, and that Fig sounds like it would be pretty impressive to see the work you have done, but I see this is a bone that you've been picking at awhile, and any minor support for cobra is immediately dismissed as not being a credible arborist recommendation. Cheers.
 
Truthfully I'm just flabbergasted that so many of my fellow climbing arborists have chosen to ignore the fact that polypropylene is in fact quite flammable.

That fact alone is a disqualifier in my book.

I mean you guys have all burned the ends of your synthetic ropes, or atleast used a hotplate to melt the ends to keep them from unravelling, right?

Any of you that think fire causing a synthetic cable system to fail is highly unlikely would change your tune pretty dang quick had you been in any of the neighborhoods here in the 03 Cedar fire that burned over a thousand homes, including my garage and two sections of my house that I was lucky enough to extinguish before it burnt my whole house down.

Then the 07 fires in Lake Arrowhead and the Big Bear Lake area. None of these fires are figments of my imagination. They were all quite real and the devastation was quite tangible I assure you.

jomoco
 
If a house is burned to the ground..what difference would it make if a tree were cabled or not? Wouldn't the tree be burned so bad that it would be removed anyway?

After seeing what post fire neighborhoods look like over the years I have to say I didn't see many trees that had a hope of living.
 
Well, my firsthand experience during the 03 Cedar Fire makes for an excellent case in point.

The fire came roaring up the hill and starts the wooden eaves of the garage's and house's roof on fire. Luckily for me my garage was detached from the house. Of course I chose to extinguish the two spots on the roof of the house that were burning, and let the garage go up in flames.

Now imagine a synthetically cabled branch say 6 feet over my house failing at the termination wrap point and falling onto either me up there battling the fire, or the house itself's roof, and either injuring me, or adding more fuel to the already buring outer roof eaves.

It's not a question of if, so much as when this will happen, and these mfrs of synthetic cabling systems find themselves in a court of law, along with the company that installed them in the plaintiff's trees, trying to defend their stupidity, and failing.

jomoco
 
Blah, Blah, Blah.

When the doctor said you need to take your pills everyday, he meant it. You appear to be hallucinating now.
 
Somehow I doubt either the fire depts or insurance companies share your delusions about the suitability of flammable cabling systems in trees above bldgs or homes.

jomoco
 
ANybody that would stand on the roof, with a dangerous tree about to collapse on them, while a wildfire roars towards them, is a moron.

I am sure the fire depratment would have something to say about lunatics who refuse to fire-safe their homes then expect firefighters to risk their lives to save them.

I imagine your insurance company is probably tired of paying for electroshock it just does not seem to be working.

wacky jomo
 
Actually I was rather proud of saving my home and possessions inside it.

My neighbors home also started on fire around the roof eaves as well. A teenage neighborhood friend of my sons managed to put that fire out since the owner wasn't home.

So it's your opinion that firefighters saving homes is all fine and dandy, but homeowners and neighbors doing the same are somehow morons?

Not much of a rugged principled individualist are yu?

jomoco
 
Jon, it sounds like an extraordinary incident and act. You are to be commended for your efforts, and they well may inform your thoughts and practice, but to apply this experience to change the practice of all everywhere is a bit of a--pardon the analogy to dynamic systems--STRETCH.

HAHAHAHA! You have a dynamic mind; better lower the therapeutic voltage, or there will be a meltdown. HAHAHAHAHHA!

Where does chipper safety come in?
 
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