basal anchor safety

[macswan]

I think the two terms are interchangeable.

 

[Flex Abednego]

TimBr,
the

With SRT, there can be and often is a multitude of branches that support the weight of the climber. I think the phrase Primary Suspension Point (PSP), is an attempt to acknowledge this circumstance, and to give special importance or significance to the single highest branch that the rope is supported by.

this sounds right to me!
i like the way you write too, clear with detail and some how like a textbook that isn't boring

 

[oceans]

Hey, Flex!

I'm not certain that the answer I'm about to give is correct or not. It is my best guess based on vague recollection and extracting meaning from context. I started to look for a thread earlier that might give a definitive answer, earlier today, and got sidetracked along the way. My hope is that by answering this question for you that appears to have been missed by others in this thread, it will generate a response from someone who really knows what he's talking about.

Here is my rough guess: I think (PSP) means Primary Suspension Point. What I think is meant by this in the context of Stationary Rope Technique (SRT), which used to be called Single Rope Technique, is the single highest point over which your climbing rope passes.

I'm not exactly sure how this differs from TIP (Tie-In Point). My guess is that it is an attempt to distinguish a difference between what happens in DdRT and SRT. In DdRT, most often people attempt to have their rope pass over a single branch as one's only life support structure, and that that one branch is referred to as the Tie-In Point.

With SRT, there can be and often is a multitude of branches that support the weight of the climber. I think the phrase Primary Suspension Point (PSP), is an attempt to acknowledge this circumstance, and to give special importance or significance to the single highest branch that the rope is supported by.

For all I know, however, it could also mean the very last branch that provides any support in the series, just before the rope falls to the climber with no more branches adding support, regardless of whether or not this last branch is the highest branch or not. This would be the case if the rope went over the top of the canopy, then down, catching a lower limb, with the climber pulling back towards the other side of the canopy.

I'm going to need to learn how the other guys on this forum make their quick, handmade drawings. I suspect they're using Microsoft Paint. I think David Driver made one earlier in this thread; maybe he can enlighten me. Maybe in the future I'll be able to illustrate my point better using that capability. Thanks in advance to anyone on this forum who chooses to chime in with a better answer for Flex.

Tim

There's also the idea of calling a PSP a Primary Support Point. Tie In Point and Suspension Point both evoke a singular canopy anchored scenario, whereas Primary Support Point sounds more like a redirect that is supporting you in a specific location that is away from wherever the line is anchored.

Terminology can go on and on. While I feel it's important to get things ironed out, I also think there are plenty of times when you know what someone "means" even if the lingo isn't perfecto.

 

[treehumper]

I'll throw my .o2 in. I think the primary aspect refers to that point which bears the greatest load between all the points an SRT line may lay. Looking at it this way leads to assessing the load capacity of the point and the angles of the rope passing over a point.

 

[oceans]

I'll throw my .o2 in. I think the primary aspect refers to that point which bears the greatest load between all the points an SRT line may lay. Looking at it this way leads to assessing the load capacity of the point and the angles of the rope passing over a point.

Which will usually be the highest...

 

[treehumper]

Right, unless the rope angle of the lower point is less than 120º while the highest point is at 120º.

 

[Treetopflyer]

Right, unless the rope angle of the lower point is less than 120º while the highest point is at 120º.

I don't know T.H. ..rope angles of deflection forces and beers don't mix well for me .. Heres to just beers and the highest point errr pint wins my vote!

 

[oceans]

Right, unless the rope angle of the lower point is less than 120º while the highest point is at 120º.

Cheers to that!

 

[TimBr]

There's also the idea of calling a PSP a Primary Support Point. Tie In Point and Suspension Point both evoke a singular canopy anchored scenario, whereas Primary Support Point sounds more like a redirect that is supporting you in a specific location that is away from wherever the line is anchored.

Oceans, Thanks for this. It is a different way of imagining things, that had not occurred to me.

I'm still a relatively new climber, who climbs primarily SRT, but I have to admit that I have not really scratched the surface of the power and the glory that is the SRT redirect.

I hate to admit this, but your post points out something that I've only recently managed to wrap my mind around as a climber. It probably seems obvious to others, but the fact that you can basically drag your Primary Support Point with you anywhere you go in the tree, just by wrapping a sling with a delta link around the nearest branch, is game changing.

Thanks again for posting your thoughts.

Tim

 

[TimBr]

Tim,
I love the way you write. No joke. very entertaining,
X

Thanks, David, much appreciated.

Tim

 

[TimBr]

TimBr,
the

this sounds right to me!
i like the way you write too, clear with detail and some how like a textbook that isn't boring

Thanks, Flex! I appreciate the kind words.

Tim

 

[TreeLogic]

I'm going to need to learn how the other guys on this forum make their quick, handmade drawings.

Tim, in a pinch you can always draw a picture with pencil and paper, take a pic of it with your phone, and post the picture. Sort of a hybrid of old school and new school.

 

[oceans]

Oceans, Thanks for this. It is a different way of imagining things, that had not occurred to me.

I'm still a relatively new climber, who climbs primarily SRT, but I have to admit that I have not really scratched the surface of the power and the glory that is the SRT redirect.

I hate to admit this, but your post points out something that I've only recently managed to wrap my mind around as a climber. It probably seems obvious to others, but the fact that you can basically drag your Primary Support Point with you anywhere you go in the tree, just by wrapping a sling with a delta link around the nearest branch, is game changing.

Thanks again for posting your thoughts.

Tim

Yeah, the redirect is a powerful thing. If you read the book 'On Rope', you'll see the sling/carabiner redirect could be called a re-belay. Different climbers in different applications will install the line in the carabiner differently, depending on the goal.

A lead rock climber will simply hang the line in a quick draw as they advance. This would be a dynamic redirect because the rope can slide in the biner. In rope access, you tie an Alpine Butterfly and put the eye into the biner for a fully locked anchor point. This would be a static redirect.

In tree climbing, you can choose static or dynamic redirects, using all sorts of kit. You can also relate natural redirects by simply passing your line over a branch union and moving on from there.

If you can, also check out TCIA's SRT Climber Manual. It goes a bit more in depth with specific concepts unique to SRWP, and how to apply gear effectively.

Cheers!

 

[TimBr]

Oceans, thank you for your entire post. From your book recommendations to your discussion of the various types of redirects.

I'd been meaning to ask the question about the definitions of a static redirect and dynamic redirect. You answered the questions without my needing to ask.

Thanks so much.

Tim