30 plus years one handing a saw !

So I wrote a carefully worded and I felt, sufficiently insulting reply to TreeVet. As I was writing, the thread progressed and TV's reason for anger came out. So rather than continue to blow this thread up, I deleted my reply and I'll answer TV directly.
TV, I'm sorry that you think my comment about hacks was directed at you. It wasn't. It wasn't directed at anyone here. My point was that many of the excuses I hear in favor of 1 handing are remarkably similar to the ones I hear from hacks. That doesnt make you a hack, and it doesn't mean I called you one. I have to 1 hand because of production bears a striking resemblance to, I don't have PPE because it's to expensive. I'm sorry, but I think those excuses are below the people on here, as I've found most everyone on TreeBuzz, regardless of my personal feelings toward them, to be thoughtful and professional Arborists. I feel that the people on here are a credit to the industry.
As I said before, I feel that 1 handing has its place. I 1 hand on occasion. I've found it happens less as I try to be more mindful of my work practices. I found that more often than not, I was 1 handing out of laziness and poor work positioning. That doesn't mean that all 1 handing is evil and should be condemned but I think that everyone benefits from being a little more mindful on the job. By all means, continue to 1 hand, but next time you do it, think about why you are and if it's really necessary. Sometimes the answer is yes, sometimes it's no.
Now if you'll excuse me, it's my turn to use the town microwave.
 
wyoclimber said:
So I wrote a carefully worded and I felt, sufficiently insulting reply to TreeVet. As I was writing, the thread progressed and TV's reason for anger came out. So rather than continue to blow this thread up, I deleted my reply and I'll answer TV directly.
TV, I'm sorry that you think my comment about hacks was directed at you. It wasn't. It wasn't directed at anyone here. My point was that many of the excuses I hear in favor of 1 handing are remarkably similar to the ones I hear from hacks. That doesnt make you a hack, and it doesn't mean I called you one. I have to 1 hand because of production bears a striking resemblance to, I don't have PPE because it's to expensive. I'm sorry, but I think those excuses are below the people on here, as I've found most everyone on TreeBuzz, regardless of my personal feelings toward them, to be thoughtful and professional Arborists. I feel that the people on here are a credit to the industry.
As I said before, I feel that 1 handing has its place. I 1 hand on occasion. I've found it happens less as I try to be more mindful of my work practices. I found that more often than not, I was 1 handing out of laziness and poor work positioning. That doesn't mean that all 1 handing is evil and should be condemned but I think that everyone benefits from being a little more mindful on the job. By all means, continue to 1 hand, but next time you do it, think about why you are and if it's really necessary. Sometimes the answer is yes, sometimes it's no.
Now if you'll excuse me, it's my turn to use the town microwave.
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Excellent post.
 
when this dies down i have some other topics to discuss:
whole tree chippers with one op.
SRT bounce test to check PSP's
making cuts with a groundsaw about your shoulders
and how Obama has done as our president

ill brush a tree out by hand sometimes, but ill hold off on eating greasy food until the rope is out!
 
wyoclimber said:
So I wrote a carefully worded and I felt, sufficiently insulting reply to TreeVet. As I was writing, the thread progressed and TV's reason for anger came out. So rather than continue to blow this thread up, I deleted my reply and I'll answer TV directly.
TV, I'm sorry that you think my comment about hacks was directed at you. It wasn't. It wasn't directed at anyone here. My point was that many of the excuses I hear in favor of 1 handing are remarkably similar to the ones I hear from hacks. That doesnt make you a hack, and it doesn't mean I called you one. I have to 1 hand because of production bears a striking resemblance to, I don't have PPE because it's to expensive. I'm sorry, but I think those excuses are below the people on here, as I've found most everyone on TreeBuzz, regardless of my personal feelings toward them, to be thoughtful and professional Arborists. I feel that the people on here are a credit to the industry.
As I said before, I feel that 1 handing has its place. I 1 hand on occasion. I've found it happens less as I try to be more mindful of my work practices. I found that more often than not, I was 1 handing out of laziness and poor work positioning. That doesn't mean that all 1 handing is evil and should be condemned but I think that everyone benefits from being a little more mindful on the job. By all means, continue to 1 hand, but next time you do it, think about why you are and if it's really necessary. Sometimes the answer is yes, sometimes it's no.
Now if you'll excuse me, it's my turn to use the town microwave.
Click to expand...

I really think you are buying out and actually were referring to the posters on this thread, myself included especially, that espouse one handing for production in what you perceive in being a much more dangerous situation (I don't) but I am gonna hopefully make up and apologize for "being way too harsh", a bad trait I have had since I was a kid and wanted to get on with the fight I felt someone else was initiating. Sorry didn't mean that stuff.
 
1adkarborist said:
TV, so the unexpected happened, and you took the shot for it each time. Let me ask this...in those instances you mentioned is there anything that YOU could have done differently?
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No pal, prob woulda happened if I had 2 hands on the saw as every time someone would have come out of nowhere and I had to put my hand where the saw was to grab the limb which would have almost definitely hit someone and not just come close as if so I would have let it drop. All 3 were BIG limbs.

1,2, and 3 DSCF1865.webp DSCF1866.webp DSCF1867.webp
 
There is a huge dif between a massively experienced cutter one handing and a newer guy. Yes I 2 hand where appropriate, but if you pay attention to the kickback quadrant meticulously...is there any chance for it to hit ANYTHING...or even get engaged INSIDE the cut (you can get kickback from inside a cut)....next how is your body orientated (so NOTHING could be hit should the bar fall thru the cut and might otherwise hit you) ....

and especially how is the PLANE of the bar oriented....the bar cannot kick back out of a cut sideways....my help cannot EVER cut with their head over the plane of the bar like they always tend to do...it must always be on either side of the plane of the bar

....obstacles that could engage the kickback quadrant MUST be move or they get jumped on. Actually I have told climbers that work for me..."If you one hand while cutting either on ground or climbing and you cut yourself....don't look to me for fin. assistance....you were already fired when you made the cut and when you cut yourself you were unemployed and stealing use of my saw.
 
Trust me TV, if it had been directed at someone on here, I would not have made any sort of apology. I don't make judgements on the quality of someone's work without personal experience with it. It didn't even occur to me that anyone would think I directed that comment at them specifically, which is why I was taken by surprise with your comment. I too, have always been quick to fight so I wrote a reply which would most definitely have escalated things. I deleted it after seeing your post saying that you felt I had called you a hack because while you misunderstood my intent, I'd have reacted similarly if I thought someone had said the same to me.
 
treevet said:
There is a huge dif between a massively experienced cutter one handing and a newer guy. Yes I 2 hand where appropriate, but if you pay attention to the kickback quadrant meticulously...is there any chance for it to hit ANYTHING...or even get engaged INSIDE the cut (you can get kickback from inside a cut)....next how is your body orientated (so NOTHING could be hit should the bar fall thru the cut and might otherwise hit you) ....

and especially how is the PLANE of the bar oriented....the bar cannot kick back out of a cut sideways....my help cannot EVER cut with their head over the plane of the bar like they always tend to do...it must always be on either side of the plane of the bar

....obstacles that could engage the kickback quadrant MUST be move or they get jumped on. Actually I have told climbers that work for me..."If you one hand while cutting either on ground or climbing and you cut yourself....don't look to me for fin. assistance....you were already fired when you made the cut and when you cut yourself you were unemployed and stealing use of my saw.
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And this is the mindful cutting I was talking about. When we present the 1 handed vs. 2 handed argument in this fashion, we can actually teach new guys the proper way to cut and when 1 handing will end up being appropriate. I don't like the simplified, I 1 hand for production because it doesn't teach a trainee anything except that production is more important than safety. If we want to better our industry, I think it's important to broaden our perspectives when looking at our work practices. No trainee in this world has EVER listened to "Do as I say, not as I do."
 
TV, I'm just trying to look at the topic from every angle, if you had rigged the piece, would you have needed to grab the wood and take the shot? if it was right over someones door, could there have been a better delineation of drop zones and communication with employees and homeowners? I'm just trying to say that usually there is another way of doing things that greatly minimizes the risk to the climber and others.
 
1adkarborist said:
TV, I'm just trying to look at the topic from every angle, if you had rigged the piece, would you have needed to grab the wood and take the shot? if it was right over someones door, could there have been a better delineation of drop zones and communication with employees and homeowners? I'm just trying to say that usually there is another way of doing things that greatly minimizes the risk to the climber and others.
Click to expand...

Hindsight is 20 20 adk. The homeowner WAS told not to come out the front door and being old forgot. The employee WAS told to never get in the expanded drop zone but was new and didn't care as he was oblivious to the consequences...the neighbor was out of my control as his house was far away and I certainly didn't feel the need to "brief" them. You cannot be profitable if you don't take "your shots" when they are there, but you have to be safe, and I am very safe...and my record is flawless...both personal safety and buildings etc. Otherwise I would not be as successful as I am.
 
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