You break/cut you buy?

[frashdog]

Was inspecting a paving job daily last fall and spent more time watching the crew than actually inspecting their work. 8 to 10 men on the crew, all working together, and no communication at all. No yelling, no finger pointing, no waving, even though it was a complex job with lots of driveway aprons, drainage runoffs and elevation changes. Everyone just knew what to do and when to do it. Guys were regularly hopping from 1 machine to the next, switching tools and tasks as the job required. It was some of the most beautiful work ballet I've ever witnessed - absolutely mesmerizing. The paving company owner showed up with the usual look of "Oh crap, the inspector weenie is here." I put him at ease pretty quickly with my heart felt compliments about his crew and questions about how he achieved such teamwork. Not surprisingly, he was a very calm, very confident person. Didn't seem like the yelling kind, but I'm sure if he ever did, people would pay attention. He said when he hires, it's better to hire a hard working team player with no paving experience and teach them than get some hot-shot paver with year's of experience and a swollen sense of self importance.
I've heard the same said about our business: If you're hiring a salesman, hire a true salesman (someone who could sell ice to an Eskimo) and teach him the tree knowledge he needs. Don't hire a good tree guy and try teaching him to sell. Some people are born salesmen and most of the rest of us aren't.

the most "qualified" folks in my experience have been the biggest let downs. I'll take a young farm kid who knows nothing about tree work anyway over the been there done that 40 year old.
The sign of a good supervisor is the ability to be the delegator! I like to say activity coordinator. My father served in the air force and retired as a colonel in a position of squadron commander. He has been a dean at a college now for years. He has alway made his job look easy in a calm way, almost like he has nothing to do. The people who work for him know clearly what there jobs are thus he rarely has anything to get excited about.

 

[Jeff]

I just love to watch a good team at work, even better to work along side

I'm fortunate enough to regularly get a certain crane operator that seems to be on the same wave-length as myself. I think some if it is mutual respect. I'm in awe of his skills as a smoooooth operator, and he (claims) to be in awe of my climbing skills (he obviously hasn't worked with any of the Buzz crowd). Anyway, after a cluster of removals the other week that went as smoothly as anyone could dream, I commented to him "You know, when you're part of a Great team, it's almost more like fun than work!"
Now, if only I could say the same for the groundies the boss hires. Getting back to the OP of this thread, hollered down at a groundie the other week "Hey! My climb line is under that log you're cutting!" "Yeah, I know!" And then he cut it. Anybody want 45' of Velocity Hot with a spliced eye? I'll keep the other 105' of it...

 

[treehumper]

Now in your case Jeff that's a definite pay to replace it. The guy just thumbed his nose at you for all intent.

 

[wyoclimber]

Now in your case Jeff that's a definite pay to replace it. The guy just thumbed his nose at you for all intent.

Agreed. If your co-worker won't replace it, your boss should.

 

[KYAPLE]

This thread has changed the way I look at broken stuff and down time. Full of great ideas and awesome support. Just wanted to say thanks to all, always appreciated
Kieran

 

[ontheropes]

This thread has changed the way I look at broken stuff and down time. Full of great ideas and awesome support. Just wanted to say thanks to all, always appreciated
Kieran

AGREED!!! X2, seems I too will be looking at and going about things in a different approach. One never knows it all and never stops learning. The day that happens I think you'd just turn into a know it all like the rest and most anything you say would fall on def ears. As long as we're better today than yesterday we're moving in the right direction.

 

[frashdog]

AGREED!!! X2, seems I too will be looking at and going about things in a different approach. One never knows it all and never stops learning. The day that happens I think you'd just turn into a know it all like the rest and most anything you say would fall on def ears. As long as we're better today than yesterday we're moving in the right direction.

X3 continuous improvement is the only way! Adapt and thrive. This site is ripe for sharing ideas. I too would like to thank all who have contributed, and those that continue to!

 

[tennarbor]

You could put a positive spin on this by creating a profit share for employees where you deduct damaged equipment and property from the bonus.

 

[treehumper]

You could put a positive spin on this by creating a profit share for employees where you deduct damaged equipment and property from the bonus.

I think I'd modify this to apportion a percentage of the expense to the bonus fund vs. the whole amount. It wouldn't quite be a profit sharing either.

To flesh out this idea further,how would you account for depreciation on damaged/lost equipment? That rope may be near the end of it's life cycle and days away from retirement. Same with a chainsaw. Any ideas?

 

[tennarbor]

I think I'd modify this to apportion a percentage of the expense to the bonus fund vs. the whole amount. It wouldn't quite be a profit sharing either.

To flesh out this idea further,how would you account for depreciation on damaged/lost equipment? That rope may be near the end of it's life cycle and days away from retirement. Same with a chainsaw. Any ideas?

Good question and I am still hashing this part out.
As the owner I would establish value. This would simplify the process. Of course, I would have to be reasonable. It depends also on what kind of equipment you run and how you maintain it. We use 455 ranchers as our main ground saws. They cost about 350 but right now they are about 3 yrs old and I have spent good money keeping taking care of them after the initial purchase and they are in great shape. If you asked me how much they are worth to me now, it wouldnt be 50 bucks. This aspect is much higher when talking about a loader or truck and much lower when talking about a rope.

Like you were saying, it may make more sense to just give a bonus for a damage free week. The whole thing goes away for the crew if they damage property or equipment.

 

[treehumper]

Or at the end of the year take all the aspects of the crew performance into account. What may make sense is to categorize different aspects that they are being measured on. Safety, productivity, customer relations, attendance/lateness, profitability, damage/loss, etc…. Clearly explaining the basis of the bonus allows the employees to better understand how it fits in to the overall picture.

 

[tennarbor]

The advantage to a more frequent reward system is that it keeps it fresh in their minds all year and gives them immediate feedback and reward for their efforts. Every week/month the crew knows that they will be rewarded for both making a profit and taking care of equipment/properties.

 

[tennarbor]

Additionally, I started giving a $50.00/month worked bonus at Christmas. Adding another lump bonus would be harder on cash flow...unless I established a savings account for it. Preference I guess.

 

[Treetopflyer]

I think I'd modify this to apportion a percentage of the expense to the bonus fund vs. the whole amount. It wouldn't quite be a profit sharing either.

To flesh out this idea further,how would you account for depreciation on damaged/lost equipment? That rope may be near the end of it's life cycle and days away from retirement. Same with a chainsaw. Any ideas?

Charge it to the game. Don't hate on the player ,hate the game. I know you've said it t.h. ..training. and account for accidents happening. Its only human right?

 

[frashdog]

Wow...equipment respect bonus added to productivity bonus, subtracted from poor situational awareness penalties.

this equation is getting very interesting.

Love "frequent rewards system". We all need KPI (key performance indicators) remember colored sticker stars next to you name in elementary school?
In the manufacturing world we had time indexes as per movement (or job) 1.0 was on time , 2.0 took twice as long as it should. May have been a bad part or tool, may have been hungover employee. Under a 1.0 and you were crushing it. The art in the tree work world would be the person estimating how long it should take to accomplish a job... That is why you do time studies to prove how long it should take to do certain jobs... Then the employees improve the process by modifying the process with innovations that are clear and apparent, then should be justly rewarded to foster continuous improvement. Then add in the fact that one just gets faster doing something over and over to a point they plateau and can not do it faster until another innovation is added like a better tool. Time was only half the equation, the other was quality...proven through second party inspections, latter turned over to self verification. Ultimately proven by the approval of the customer... Yet another reason to get a gold star on Friday !

 

[KYAPLE]

Well put frashdog! I like it! What if u have an employee that continuously out works everyone else? Is he/she rewarded a little bit more privately? Is the rest of the crew asked to step up? What if they can't?

Kieran

 

[frashdog]

Well put frashdog! I like it! What if u have an employee that continuously out works everyone else? Is he/she rewarded a little bit more privately? Is the rest of the crew asked to step up? What if they can't?

Kieran

Seriously a fine line between "rubbing it in" and setting bars/examples of behavior to strive for. Some guys just don' t care and are not competitive. That's why the team mentality was bestowed upon manufacturing and "team leaders" were appointed based on their willingness to achieve. The seemingly lazy guys would say, "you can have it" but still listened to the team leader. So many people just want to be told what to do and not have to think, I call it "spoon feed workers". Nothing wrong with it, that's how they are wired. As a supervisor we need to identify it though in order to make their actions productive.

Back to what if they can't? Gotta keep the air of fresh meat, soon as a new employee shows up and the slacker's hours start getting reduced...well. Writing is on the wall... Step up or step out.

 

[Kris Anderson]

When i was a leading hand i told every new guy that each time we move the truck i want him to do a walk around and count all the tools , whether it be rakes or saws. If they stayed long enough i would graduate them to the blowpack. They would have to learn the blowpack and maintain it. After i was satisfied then they would move onto a chainsaw. I would give them a few pointers but ultimately i told them that its your tool that you will be using everyday so treat it right and it will take care of you or neglect it and you will see what happens. Ask questions , use youtube, doesn't matter.
Some guys work out and start to appreciate the things that make there job easier some dont and they get moved on.

 

[tennarbor]

Charge it to the game.
Don't hate on the player ,hate the game.

Don't mean to be argumentative here but what we do is hardly a game. The deeper I get into this, the more I realize how few companies give clear expectations to employees and especially how few rewards and positive affirmations are given. These are proven practices. Go to a chic-fil-a some time and devote an hour to studying employee and management interaction. There is a company here called Matlock tire that has an atmosphere that I am committed to harnessing in my company.

More often than not, employees in our line of work are stuck with 'get er done and DONT mess anything up'. Then we complain about turnover rate and lack of commitment...no wonder.

Also, every damaged piece of equipment or property is a near miss. If this is happening too often in our crews, we need to take a hard look at our structure and practices before someone gets hurt.

I know you've said it t.h. ..training. and account for accidents happening. Its only human right?

 

[Treetopflyer]

We have that attitude about gitrdun and don't mess anything up yes and a lot more where that came from. Im not worried about how you do your thing. Manage it like chic fill a. We Never complain about nothing because we don't have a thing to complain about . Some choose this life some are born into it. Either way ..if you don't wanna be here go do something else . My structure suits me for I have one life to live. Do everything I'm my powers to keep crew happy and well and the things that make our livings well too. Put myself in danger before anyone else . When I can see it coming . Who though can know the future? NONE! We can only plan and mitigate risk and train and protect people with certain gear and hope for the best , but when a brand new chipper explodes and shrapnel is flying , hope is all we're left with. I'm sorry if you deal with issues often enough that you have to offer some damage free incentive bullshit program. I guess I'm just blessed.