Working on SRT system

Hi Blue

There are quite a few progressive climbers in the UK now & even more just over the water in mainland Europe. If you keep your ear to the ground you'll find the right people to connect with right on your doorstep. There are plenty of comps during next year, dates will be forthcoming soon I believe, and you'll see a variety of techniques, styles & equipment. If you as keen as you seem then don't miss out.

Good luck
Nod
 
dump the blake's but in favour of what?i know and trust this knot.it works perfectly for my method of climbing but what do i else do you sugest?
 
Here is a selection of modern hitches and how they relate to one form. Moving to chords as tails for the friction hitch and these closed french coil hitches is kinda high performance, slow walking tuning stuff of patience and extra care.
 

Attachments

  • 7345-Some Advanced Friction Hitches.webp
    7345-Some Advanced Friction Hitches.webp
    111.1 KB · Views: 127
And this shows probably the favorite, the VT; and why my view of how it might werk. Definite upgrades from Blake's IMLHO. Though not sure if they all belong in SRT discussion...
 

Attachments

  • 7346-VT Thoughts.webp
    7346-VT Thoughts.webp
    185 KB · Views: 118
i posted the Knut pic wrong, in all my editing! The directions where write, but the picture was of something else i was werking on and didn't jive!

Sorry!
-KC
 

Attachments

  • 7354-Knut Correction.webp
    7354-Knut Correction.webp
    35.3 KB · Views: 109
Does anyone have any pics of their srt ascent set up? Any advice on ways to tie off w/ out the use of a gri-gri? Right now I have a petzl handled ascender up top, connected to my belt w/ a length of lanyard, pantin at the foot and am debating on what to use at the waste? Any suggestions? Is this a good set up?
 
Farns...:)

Putting a hitch above the ascender isn't a great idea, OK, but not great. The purpose of a back up is to catch you if something happens to your primary anchor.

I like to have the attachments seperated. In the odd chance that something interferes with the primary I want to have the secondary apart so that the interference doesn't effect both anchors. Also, there's the possibility that a hitch above the ascender wouldn't grab onto the rope. Since the hitch needs to be set loose enough to not bind it could take some falling distance to grab.

I've read several papers on backing up rapels. The current practice is to attach a backup well below the descender. The favorite is to use a loop of accessory cord and tie a French prusik. Clip a biner to a leg loop to keep it off to one side. This could be adapted to an ascending system too. The key is to have the backup tied short enough to not snag the upper. Add a biner or swivle snap below and it is self tending. Oh, and cheap too.

Tom
 
What do you mean by "Failed"? Allowed to slip and then grab or slip to failure?

If you Google things like rapel backup to see the research done. I read one report that was done in the mid-60s and the same results have been replicated in trials around the world.

Splitting the two ascenders makes for a much safer system. I can't see any reason not to tweak things to make it the best that it can be. Besides, adding the prusik backup to the waist is a tidier setup.

Tom
 
Slip to failure.
You want to put a prusik below a mechanical ascender?
smhair2.gif
 
I use my VT hitch below my handled ascender when ascending SRT. I feel it is a lot safer than having the hitch up above the ascender out of my reach. The only way my VT could fail is to push down on it. If I quit pushing down on the hitch, it grabs. If I touch the side of the hitch, it grabs. The only way I could force my hitch to fail would be to force the ascender open and useless, then pull it down on top of my hitch and keep pulling until I hit the ground. If I were to do ANYTHING other than pull down on the top of the hitch, it will grab.

A hitch up above the handled ascender is about useless since it will be the first thing to get a twig jammed in it. It will also be out of reach most of the time so I would be unable to dress it.

With my hitch at my belt and my handled ascender on a 30" strap; above that, my ascents are quick and safe. Once at the top I can remove one ascender and clip in the standing end of my lifeline and go straight to work. My hitch is already tied and I don't have tons of gear to deal with. One handled ascender and one 30" strap.

Kevin- just how would YOU do it and why?
 
The hitch above.
Brian;
Your explanation of a stick getting caught in the hitch works the same with a mechanical ascender.
If your hands are on the ascender and it fails it could come down on the hitch and cause it to fail.
 
Good point. In a panic situation, if the handled ascender were to fail and slide down onto the hitch you may not let go until it is too late, maybe we should be using both? Above & Below, would that be to redundant? The point of accessing the hitch if it is above the ascender, is a good one, it required expendending quite a bit of energy to work w/ that hitch.
 
I do not see how an ascender failure could cause a failure of the friction hitch backup. At the absolute worst case scenario I think it might bump the hitch and drop you a couple inches at the most. But as soon as you do ANYTHING other than pull down on the hitch, you stop. If you let go, you stop. If you hold on to the ascender and do anything but push it down on your hitch, you stop. If you grab the side of your hitch (my instinctive reaction if I sense myself starting to slip), you stop.

Rather than sit there and tell us how our systems are bound to fail, why not go out in the backyard and set a rope and try to make it fail? I did and could not force my setup to fail. The worst I got was a 2"-3" drop by locking my ascender open and forcing it down on my hitch. The action that occured from the release of the hitch made it impossible to keep pushing on the hitch with the ascender.

I rate my experience over your armchair quarterbacking, sorry. You claim my setup will fail, but what happens in the next second? My system cannot fail for more than a very brief blip. I am more comfortable with that than your suggestion. Oh yeah, you don't HAVE a suggestion.
 
Thanks, was just wondering if anyone had a suggestion, I wasn't trying to give one, it's good to know that someone has spent the time to test this out. It will surely save me the time of having to do it myself. I've seen experienced professionals do it both ways, didn't know what the reasons were for the differences.
 
Rocky Squirrel, I have better things to do than argue with you.
If you can't carry on a decent conversation with me then don't bother asking me questions.
I'm not talking about playing in a tree, this is an unexpected occurance that will happen in a split second and the reality is you'll be eating dirt faster than you can blink.
You are welcome to what ever method you choose, it's your neck not mine you self appointed unemployed expert.
grin.gif
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

New threads New posts

Back
Top Bottom