What's your preference of Rigging Ring slings?

eyehearttrees

Active Member
Just an FYI from several discussions with Harken (the maker of the X Rigging rings/Safebloc) they haven't actually been able to replicate the whole crack fraying the rope thing. I have heard from Treestuff that it's possible but only in discussions comparing the X Rigging rings to the unfinished Notch rings. They usually also mention that the unfinished rings can be made smooth again by a light sanding where any damage to the X Ring is permanent.
X-branded rings are Antal not Harken, no? Quite sure that's the case, unless antal=harken or something..

And that's true Re permanence of damage although as I mentioned I think that >5yrs of people bombing wood down with these rings, w/o a glut of people posting their worn-out rings online, is incredibly telling!

Very curious about the harken/antal thing though as I thought Harken was distinct, I knew antal made the x-rings but was never sure who made the Safebloc (I know xman created it but wasn't sure who was producing them) Really wish these companies would do a "more for less" pricing approach IE that the increased sales from more units could offset lower per-unit profits, having the large rings at $80 price point is nonsensical it's a large aluminum washer lol :p


Having said that when we had Harken make the big ring their way for us (with their logo on it because it looks way cooler) we collectively decided to do the harder, shiny coating on it instead of the matte finish. It feels a lot like the finish on the Safebloc. Was more of a function vs fashion thing. We have not been able to replicate this "cracking" thing on that or the smaller sizes. I'm sure it's possible but you would have to be pretty hard on the gear. Hope that helps.

-Jason
Re finishes you've got things twisted (or I'm misinterpreting you!) again....X rings come in matte finishes and gloss finishes, I've got the 3-ringed sling (1 XL ring, 2 Lrg rings) and the XL ring is gloss the Lrg rings are matte (maybe that's exacerbating the problem of the center ring lifting&squishing when under load!), I've also got a Safebloc and it's most-certainly the same exact matte finish as my Lrg rings are (I would say 'unless they changed it' but I've never seen a pic of the Bloc with the gloss anodization, only with the matte anodized finish)

Re form-versus-function on anodization-type, can I ask what testing you did? This has always intrigued me IE how much more friction would I get from having non-anodized rings, or from using matte anodized instead of gloss anodized? Even if you aren't able to provide #'s it'd be very illuminating to know what differences were observed, in-practice, between matte&gloss anodized coatings! Thanks :D (have personally thought "am glad my Safebloc has the matte coating, the gloss would be too-slick and hurt its friction levels", in fact if I could have my XL ring be matte instead of gloss I would)
 

RyTheTreeGuy

Well-Known Member
You nees to dig through the buzz archives and read the story and history from David Driver. Also check out educated climber podcast with David Driver

 
I'm looking to purchase some rigging ring slings, but with so many options out there I'm not sure where to start. Here's one set up I think makes sense to get: https://www.sherrilltree.com/5ft-x-3-4in-retrievable-triple-sling-w-2-large-1-beast-x-ri
I'm wondering what people's preferences are for the type and length of sling based on your use and experience with the rings?
I think it would depend more on what you're rigging. Do you often do large removals? That beast setup is great. I use it for larger rigging or I'll use a DMM impact block if I'm using a lowering device. I recommend some kind of block if you don't have one. I use the 10 ft large xrigging rings for redirecting throughout the tree and 1 beast ring to redirect into the LD.
 

MapleLeafRopes

New Member
X-branded rings are Antal not Harken, no? Quite sure that's the case, unless antal=harken or something..

And that's true Re permanence of damage although as I mentioned I think that >5yrs of people bombing wood down with these rings, w/o a glut of people posting their worn-out rings online, is incredibly telling!

Very curious about the harken/antal thing though as I thought Harken was distinct, I knew antal made the x-rings but was never sure who made the Safebloc (I know xman created it but wasn't sure who was producing them) Really wish these companies would do a "more for less" pricing approach IE that the increased sales from more units could offset lower per-unit profits, having the large rings at $80 price point is nonsensical it's a large aluminum washer lol :p
So just to get a final answer on this I just called Harken a few minutes ago and they actually stopped making the X-Rigging Rings for them last year (sorry for the confusion there, I had my timing mixed up). Originally Antal was making them, then they moved to Harken, now they've moved "elsewhere", they're not sure where. Harken still does make the Safebloc. Originally they approached Antal but decided on Harken for that item.

Pricewise, I can see your point on the rings, so much so that I did just reduce our pricing on the our Harken ones on our site a bit. Since these rings are so new we're still feeling out the pricing. Right now we're at $62.86 USD/$83.60 CAD which I think is pretty fair. I'm sure we could do some volume pricing or something at some point if the community or you are interested.


Re finishes you've got things twisted (or I'm misinterpreting you!) again....X rings come in matte finishes and gloss finishes, I've got the 3-ringed sling (1 XL ring, 2 Lrg rings) and the XL ring is gloss the Lrg rings are matte (maybe that's exacerbating the problem of the center ring lifting&squishing when under load!), I've also got a Safebloc and it's most-certainly the same exact matte finish as my Lrg rings are (I would say 'unless they changed it' but I've never seen a pic of the Bloc with the gloss anodization, only with the matte anodized finish)

Re form-versus-function on anodization-type, can I ask what testing you did? This has always intrigued me IE how much more friction would I get from having non-anodized rings, or from using matte anodized instead of gloss anodized? Even if you aren't able to provide #'s it'd be very illuminating to know what differences were observed, in-practice, between matte&gloss anodized coatings! Thanks :D (have personally thought "am glad my Safebloc has the matte coating, the gloss would be too-slick and hurt its friction levels", in fact if I could have my XL ring be matte instead of gloss I would)
On the coating, perhaps matte vs glossy isn't the best wording I could have used. In the attached image you can see our harken rings have the same finish as the safebloc. I suppose shiny vs dull might make a bit more sense. Let me see if I can pull the actual wording from Harken on their testing/results. Our testing was more of a real world thing where we gave out a couple of slings to some local customers and essentially asked them to try to break it (without injuring themselves) and we weren't able to get any of those cracks that people saw.

Hope that helps. I'll try to follow up ASAP, just got a bunch of black Friday orders to get out first.

-Jason
 

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808Climber

New Member
I'm attracted to how the triangular shape of the triple thimble pretty much eliminates the possibility of rope on rope friction compared to the Safebloc where the rope runs in a straight line and can rub on itself in certain situations as I've heard and imagined. But the Safebloc has a much higher MBS and WLL. Also can you use a sling through one of the holes to create a floating anchor with the Safebloc like with the TT?
 

Grafted_In

Member
I run a beast/large retrievable, a beast dead eye, and large whoopie. Wouldnt mind trying a double headed dead eye and an ultra.
 

KevinS

Well-Known Member
Everyone has there go to favourite slings no doubt but all of this is not relevant unless we know what you do the most of.

Your scope and general tasks determine your tools. I have 15’ double beast xrr slings of 3/4” tenex but more often I reach for my 3’ lg xrr whoopie. But if I get away with it I’ve got 1” nylon loop slings and biners or pulleys etc. Right tool right job.

I’m a fan of fs style I use a lot even for light duty. Again I have a 3/4” tenex fs with a beast and a lg xrr and I made these. Not the best bend radius but 1/2” link 3/8” ring it does quite a bit.

So I’m curious what is a very common job for you to need ty is rigging?
 

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eyehearttrees

Active Member
You nees to dig through the buzz archives and read the story and history from David Driver. Also check out educated climber podcast with David Driver

I can't recall if I've heard that one yet will def give it a (re?)listen!! (climbing-arborist youtuber also has a podcast FYI if you didn't know, has a great episode w/ Mark Bridges)

Thanks but think I've caught-up on all that, ahem, "fair-dealings" (lol), I read the whole history IE they're getting experimented with (still as Antal-stamped) around 2010 about a year or two after Antal had such success releasing them to the marine world, Dave Driver stood-up and proselytized and got this superior form (versus pulley-based) of rigging popularized, saving an untold but certainly vast sum of $$ (or 'creating value') in the arb-rigging world due to increased efficiency & safety of ring-based systems. He seemed ALL over it, had the "THT" prototype (3 XL's welded together :p ) and was making great test videos showing absurd shock-loading to show how capable they were as primary/exclusive anchoring, then it seems two things occurred and it's tough to figure out if they're related:
#1 - Some A-Holes gave dave shit for all he'd done, most complaints seemed to revolve around the fact he was having them made by Antal and not, say, CNC'ing them in his basement, and
#2 - Sherrill/Notch/Treestuff consortium took-over rights to the line (Dave seems to publicly say he's "satisfied" with how things went but it's kinda hard to 100.0% believe him, I mean if he was pissed it probably wouldn't help him to voice it especially if he plans to continue innovation which he told me via email or PM that he was)

Sherrill-group seems to have bought him out in ~2013 and then just sat on the line, squeezing every penny they can from their absurd over-pricing of these slings, thankfully companies like Elevation Canada are (as-expected) filling the gap, when companies are able to sell aluminum discs for >$50 then anyone w/ a CNC setup is going to be seeing dollar signs and alum rigging-rings will soon reach a proper price-point (right now Elevation Canada does $75, shipped, for a PAIR of their xl/#3's, which are actually 10% wider than XL x-rings) It's insane seeing Sherrill ask nearly $200 for some of these slings when it's like 10-20' of TEC and a couple pieces of absurdly-simple aluminum hardware, really hope another branding (maybe Elevation) can become the 'last player', would hate to see Sherrill end up w/ majority market-share on rings when they've done nothing to advance the line for the better part of a decade, are still price-gouging like crazy especially the Safebloc, would be a shame if they got to gouge when the rings were new *and* still retained last-player position, will def be showing-off my Elevation Canada gear wherever possible ;D

Beast ring ultra sling!
I loved how practical&convenient these seemed but, if I'm not mistaken, they are IMPOSSIBLE to get a tight fit with, right? IE you're beholden to pocket-spacing, you may have to introduce 6" or more of unnecessary free-fall into your rigging-setup, to get that convenience of the Ultra configuration, horrible trade-off IMO, would only use that type of setup for positive-angle rigging but that'd generally negate that configuration's main "claim to fame" ie that you can quickly re-position it while blocking a spar.
 

eyehearttrees

Active Member
To answer thread-title-question though, I think I've finally finished my kit, will be able to grow-into it for a year (IE it's stronger-than-needed for now), was under ~$500:

5 ring slings, 2 of which can be used on logs (ie for speedlines or double-whips), all on 3/4 TEC or 3/4 polydyne
1 Safebloc sling (9', 3/4 TEC whoopie)
bundle of Mercury loops 2' --> 4.5'
4" pulley (NOT block, for use w/ Blue Moon for lifting/mech advantage)

With 5/8 polydyne that^ setup has let me do a ton w/o a Porty, it's amazing how much friction you can generate w/ properly placed rings! Have a longer 1/2 polydyne hank for when my 5/8 isn't long enough, B.Moon for when I need a stiff/static line, and 3/4" 3-strand hank for natural-crotching when necessary(still unused lol)
 

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