What came of the TCIA and OSHA meeting recently?

agree with your statements completely. the readers digest version- cranes and climbers equipment are all load-rated by the related industries. trees are not. our simple solution to the locking/non-locking gate situation is we require climbers to tie in with their climbing line to a master ring which is placed above the ball thru the becket. climber then has control of his positioning in relation to the ball. if your moving someone through the canopy, must be done in a controlled, deliberate manner. also the climber can use his lanyard clipped thru the hook as a secondary tie-off if he is so inclined. not lecturing, you guys know this already. no room is this craft for unattentive, cowboy crane ops.
 
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OR... what about if the climber is not skilled enough to get around in the tree to climb it safely?

climbing way out on thin little limbs to set the chokers can be hazardous to the climber; especially ones that don't have excellent skills or maybe not a nice high tie in point.

Cranes make things safer, no doubt.


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From most other true red blooded climber's perspectives that climber shouldn't be in any kind of tree anyway, but that's not ground zero in this instance with OSHA and a professional arborist/employer. An establishment like OSHA just wants employers providing safe work out there for employees, and that is true ground zero.

If the OSHA inspector cites the employer for allowing the climber to attach to the ball and all, that's a cowboy OSHA inspector incorrectly representing his organization. They are not to be showing up to call things too safe for climbers to be attached to the ball. They are there to ask the employer about his judgement call for allowing the climber to attach to the ball. That's when the employer will explain what that reasoning is.

I'd be willing to bet that when the employers cited for crane riding like a poster on this thread said, but the citations were dismissed, those dismissals were because the employers have to be out there providing a safe work place not unsafe or less safe. It was the OSHA inspectors that seriously did not have an adequate understanding of what was taking place in a tree service situation except for the fact the climbers were attached to the cranes. That's going to happen from time to time no matter what the organization is. It's not the OSHA regs at fault. It's the OSHA rep not quite on the same page with this kind of employer.

Those who know what to do will handle it, and they'll be okay for providing a safe place for employment.
 
My reasons for crane access being safer:

Allows climber to fully inspect tree before entering it

Reduces fatigue throughout the day creating a safer afternoon

Reduces repetitive actions causing injury over the long term to the climber
Including moving pieces a long way from where they would be in many rigging scenarios meaning no lifting,dragging etc..


Tree sections being removed can usually be larger requiring less cuts with a saw=less opportunities to be cut

Uses a rated structure to rig pieces

These are just a few.


By no means am I saying not having a crane is unsafe. But if a company has one the tree shouldn't have to be deemed unsafe to use it to lift a climber
 
IMO. That story also makes me think that radio communication should be used too. The climber would have been able to yell, "STOP!" And it wouldn't have happened also.

I use radio communications for every job because of a few potentially dangerous situations where I could have been hurt or killed. And when it came down to it... It was due to a real time communication mistake.

But, that can be a conversation for a different thread. Unless, anyone else would like to run with that.
smirk.gif
 
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Seems like you've made a good case here Mark. Let's put it before the committee!

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Im already in the process. Any other thoughts others have i will bring up or include also.
 
You make good case Allmark but you might need to clarify your below statement:

"My reasons for crane access being safer:

Allows climber to fully inspect tree before entering it"

I assume you are picking up the climber very close to the trunk of the tree, every time, and you are slowly lifting the climber through the tree (whilist the climber is visually assessing) to the top,before starting the dismantle.

Either that, or you are picking the climber up from a clear position outside the tree canopy and dropping the climber in from the top. Not sure how effective this method would be in assessing the tree before starting work, but going on most crane vids I've seen, this is how its done.

Basically, what i am asking is,how do you put a climber in the tree?

This is a question to all crane opps doing tree work and arborists using cranes for access.

Thanks
 
I have done it both ways where cable comes down through the trees and you're able to inspect it as you get winched up or now with my new crane I am inspecting the tree as I go up from the outside Although with foliage on the tree you're not always able to see everything but you can see more than you can from the ground Although you may think Winching next to the tree you can do a better inspection often times you cannot see a hornets nest at the end of the limbs So there are benefits to each type of inspection And limitations
 
You're right jomoco the wording should probably be changed from fully inspect to additionally inspect or something like that
 
Which is the safest, climbing, bucket, or crane? Depends on the training and apptitude of the operators. They're all safe, they're all dangerous just like that bannana peel in the parking lot.

Personal shopping safety regs

12.34 The pedestrian should step to the side away from vehicular traffic.
 
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Which is the safest, climbing, bucket, or crane? Depends on the training and apptitude of the operators. They're all safe, they're all dangerous just like that bannana peel in the parking lot.

Personal shopping safety regs

12.34 The pedestrian should step to the side away from vehicular traffic.

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I believe they can all be safe. My main point is if you have a crane you should not be restricted to using it for access only when it is deemed there are no other safe alternatives.

The tree coould be safe to climb but not have an ideal TIP. we have all been there and done the job. If I already had my crane there I could create the perfect TIP. Safer? maybey not but definately easier.
 
I wrote that following some dental work. I was mad at the world.

That cranes only be used in especially difficult situations is a new one on me and ridiculus. They call it progress and it can't be stopped. Like the mechanizaton of the logging industry. Safer, easier, faster. I don't see the bucket, climber or crane disappearing from tree work. Anything's possible like a ban on riding the ball but it has certainly been used enough that when done properly it's proven safe and efficient.
 
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