Pre installed lines in case of emergency

[fireaxe]

IMO - access line is like having a firetruck parked out front - just in case...

1. Entanglement. Any way you slice it, it is another line that has potential to entangle in the work product. This is a major problem already on most jobs, most days. We work pretty hard to keep the climbing line OUT of the way. Another line, another potential.

2. An unwitnessed situation could have potentially damaged the access line. Another victim.

3. How much additional time will be spent fulfilling this as a requirement. Everybody gets paid by the hour. We are not cheap on safety, but it adds to the cost of a company that follows the rules. MOST do not follow the rules we already have. Like the ability to perform a rescue - that is required training. How many do that training???

I'd bet - if it was ever one of the rules - that the ones that need to be rescued will not be following enough of the rules to have placed the line.

It is all a big HOPEFULLY IT NEVER GETS USED! Not arguing its usefulness in a rescue, but I think it adds to the hazards on the job. See man "decapitated" by chipper - was a rope that got wrapped... Seen a few accident reports like that recently.

 

[treewill]

[ QUOTE ]
I always have spikes along but seldom use them. removals are not arboriculture, but forestry/aerial logging imo, but that is just mo!

2nd line is typical for me cuz i do a lot of reduction pruning on spreading trees. making one standard seems like requiring chaps or chain mail in trees, overkill on the safety concerns.

Aerial rescue seems like another thread, but we have to be honest about the odds of success before building more steps onto every work plan--and every tcc?-- around improving the very small chances of success for that eventuality.

survey was sobering--31+ is the oldest category? Reminds me of the old saying, Don't trust anyone over 30!

[/ QUOTE ]

I love everything about this post. Guy wins, I'm calling it.

I was looking at that age bracket cockeyed too. I'm 29, I guess this means I got 1.5 more years before I get tossed in the all-purpose 'geezer' bin. Harsh.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

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I guess this means I got 1.5 more years before I get tossed in the all-purpose 'geezer' bin. Harsh.

[/ QUOTE ]

No...the Official Geezer Age is 40!

 

[islandarb]

Yikes I am a geezer, WOW. Nuff said.

 

[oceans]

[ QUOTE ]
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This will work well, though if the climber is "injured" while secured by two points of attachment (climbing line & lanyard), one would have to be released before lowering, still requiring access by a rescuer.

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This is one of the few scenarios where the technique of cutting the climber's lanyard with a pruner would be useful.

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Yes, a cutting tool should be on hand in a rescue. I was replying to Barpincher's input about being tied into a floating false crotch. A floater can be set up to remotely lower an injured climber, but if the climber is double tied, remote lowering isn't an option. I still think it's a good to have the option should the climber not be secured with another point of attachment beyond the climbing line itself at the time of injury.

 

[treevet]

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I always have spikes along but seldom use them. removals are not arboriculture, ... that is just mo!


[/ QUOTE ]

I have to disagree with this. Recognizing contagious, diseased and/or infested trees and having them removed for the benefit of other trees is arboriculture in itself. I would agree that someone that just does tree removal is not an "Arborist" by definition.

 

[treevet]

As for the subject matter of always installing a second line for aerial rescue for possible climber injury and incapacitation...this falls under the list after putting on your leg chaps, your arm chaps, steel toes, your finger and thumb helmets and chaps, neck chap, bullet proof vest with motorcycle armour, heavily cushioned pant seat for soft landing with optional parachute...then yes...

let's install that line in every tree and another one just incase that line is not in the best location. On second thought if a big tree, let's install half a dozen rescue lines with wraptors dangling from every one to make a quicker rescue.

 

[TreeCo]

[ QUOTE ]
As for the subject matter of always installing a second line for aerial rescue for possible climber injury and incapacitation...this falls under the list after putting on your leg chaps, your arm chaps, steel toes, your finger and thumb helmets and chaps, neck chap, bullet proof vest with motorcycle armour, heavily cushioned pant seat for soft landing with optional parachute...then yes...

let's install that line in every tree and another one just incase that line is not in the best location. On second thought if a big tree, let's install half a dozen rescue lines with wraptors dangling from every one to make a quicker rescue.

[/ QUOTE ]

.......you're forgeting the tin foil lined helmet!

 

[nuthin_special]

[ QUOTE ]
. MOST do not follow the rules we already have. Like the ability to perform a rescue - that is required training. How many do that training???


[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed.

Although this research and discussion is highly valuable, the people that are suffering most of the casualties where rescue would be needed aren't participating. How many crews out there are operating with one climber and two or three groundies? How many contract climbers are working with a team where there is no rescuer present?

Also, Guy i disagree. Determining when a tree should be removed is a big part of arboriculture. Actually removing it, not so much.

Vince

 

[Jamin_Mayer]

[ QUOTE ]
I guess this means I got 1.5 more years before I get tossed in the all-purpose 'geezer' bin. Harsh.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
No...the Official Geezer Age is 40!

[/ QUOTE ]

Ouch. I'm only 4.5 years away.

 

[robinia]

[ QUOTE ]
As for the subject matter of always installing a second line for aerial rescue for possible climber injury and incapacitation...this falls under the list after putting on your leg chaps, your arm chaps, steel toes, your finger and thumb helmets and chaps, neck chap, bullet proof vest with motorcycle armour, heavily cushioned pant seat for soft landing with optional parachute...then yes...

let's install that line in every tree and another one just incase that line is not in the best location. On second thought if a big tree, let's install half a dozen rescue lines with wraptors dangling from every one to make a quicker rescue.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the $0.02 but I'll keep doing it. Matter of personal choice I suppose.

 

[classictruckman]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
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This will work well, though if the climber is "injured" while secured by two points of attachment (climbing line & lanyard), one would have to be released before lowering, still requiring access by a rescuer.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is one of the few scenarios where the technique of cutting the climber's lanyard with a pruner would be useful.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, a cutting tool should be on hand in a rescue. I was replying to Barpincher's input about being tied into a floating false crotch. A floater can be set up to remotely lower an injured climber, but if the climber is double tied, remote lowering isn't an option. I still think it's a good to have the option should the climber not be secured with another point of attachment beyond the climbing line itself at the time of injury.

[/ QUOTE ]

oceans, I was agreeing with you, let me expand on my comment a bit, there is a technique originally from one of the big tree companies (I'm not going to say which one) where you reach up to the hurt climber with a pole pruner and cut the climbers support system and although the climber just now suffered a fall at least he's on the ground where you can help him.

I've always been baffled by this technique but there's something useful there if the climber could be lowered if not for their 2nd TIP then you could cut it with a pole pruner and lower the climber, however extreme caution would be needed not to cut the main support system.