Go to canopy anchor?

[DLF]

I highly recommend replacing the alpine butterfly with the span loop as your midline knot. It's got the little bowline handle you just pry up for reliably untying every time. Even use it for rigging. fasg and secure and never fight it to untie.

Thanks! I did not know about that knot.

 

[Phil]

I highly recommend replacing the alpine butterfly with the span loop as your midline knot.

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Yes exactly, even quicker with a spliced eye, clip accessory cord to the splice. I used to keep a 75 ft 6mm retrieval line in a little linemug bag

@Muggs I've really wanted to give this anchor a fair shake but never pull my soft 8 out of my gear bag. You've convinced me to put it on my harness so I no longer have excuses lol. I have a couple questions about retrieval though.

Do you use a retrieval ball or knot on the tail of your line? I would imagine you have to.

Does the soft 8 just bomb out of the tree once the end of the line makes it to the small ring? Assuming you have a ball on the line, it would just free fall with the tail of the rope right?

 

[Muggs]

Well it depends on the situation. With no redirects, it will just slide down the rope on it's own, right back to you. Usually does the same with a single redirect. If more than 1 redirect then I use a retrieval ball with throwline, or just rip the rope out and let the soft 8 fly. It might drop into a crotch on the way down and get stuck, but it usually just falls to the ground.

If planning on taking redirects, make sure to set up the soft 8 so the first redirect is away from the small ring. If it's towards then it can get jammed up bad.

Effectiveness of the soft 8 (in terms of managing friction to keep retrieval nice and easy) is based on the ratio of the tie-in diameter to the length of the soft 8. If the soft 8 is too long relative to the tie-in, it will try to flip partway over and can get jammed. If the soft 8 is too short relative to the tie-in, then the rope will have too much friction on the branch and will be very difficult to retrieve. That's why I use a homemade one, because I found the manufactured one from Wesspur was too long most of the time for the tie-ins that I normally use. I normally tie-in on branches 3-4" in diameter, so I made one that works for that size.

 

[Phil]

Well it depends on the situation. With no redirects, it will just slide down the rope on it's own, right back to you. Usually does the same with a single redirect. If more than 1 redirect then I use a retrieval ball with throwline, or just rip the rope out and let the soft 8 fly. It might drop into a crotch on the way down and get stuck, but it usually just falls to the ground.

If planning on taking redirects, make sure to set up the soft 8 so the first redirect is away from the small ring. If it's towards then it can get jammed up bad.

Effectiveness of the soft 8 (in terms of managing friction to keep retrieval nice and easy) is based on the ratio of the tie-in diameter to the length of the soft 8. If the soft 8 is too long relative to the tie-in, it will try to flip partway over and can get jammed. If the soft 8 is too short relative to the tie-in, then the rope will have too much friction on the branch and will be very difficult to retrieve. That's why I use a homemade one, because I found the manufactured one from Wesspur was too long most of the time for the tie-ins that I normally use. I normally tie-in on branches 3-4" in diameter, so I made one that works for that size.

This is great insight. Thanks for taking the time to spell that out. Makes sense.

 

[southsoundtree]

Well it depends on the situation. With no redirects, it will just slide down the rope on it's own, right back to you. Usually does the same with a single redirect. If more than 1 redirect then I use a retrieval ball with throwline, or just rip the rope out and let the soft 8 fly. It might drop into a crotch on the way down and get stuck, but it usually just falls to the ground.

If planning on taking redirects, make sure to set up the soft 8 so the first redirect is away from the small ring. If it's towards then it can get jammed up bad.

Effectiveness of the soft 8 (in terms of managing friction to keep retrieval nice and easy) is based on the ratio of the tie-in diameter to the length of the soft 8. If the soft 8 is too long relative to the tie-in, it will try to flip partway over and can get jammed. If the soft 8 is too short relative to the tie-in, then the rope will have too much friction on the branch and will be very difficult to retrieve. That's why I use a homemade one, because I found the manufactured one from Wesspur was too long most of the time for the tie-ins that I normally use. I normally tie-in on branches 3-4" in diameter, so I made one that works for that size.

@Muggs Can you take a picture and rough measurement?

I having experimented yet. I typically base-tie.

Seems like a situation like tied hitch cord ends, maybe not so sleek, but infinitely adjustable.

 

[Muggs]

Here's my homemade soft 8, and side by side with the one that Wesspur sells.


I think about it exactly like a natural crotch tie-in in DdRT. Around 3" or so diameter is a sweet spot for a solid tie-in with minimal friction. So my soft 8 is perfect for that.

You want the rope to just sit on the top 180 degrees of the branch. This will be easy to pull out, even with redirects. It acts a lot like a basal anchor when set up this way.

If the tie-in is too big relative to the soft 8, then the rope is sitting on 270 degrees or more of bark, and takes a bend at both rings. This will be a lot more friction, harder to pull out. This picture below is not ideal to show this, but imagine the tie-in was several inches bigger still, the rope would take a big bend on either side of the rings which would be a lot of friction to pull. (Again, imagine the friction on a natural crotch tie-in for DdRT of say 8-10" or more, not fun to climb on).

Now if the soft 8 is too long for the tie-in, then it wants to rotate up and around the crotch, which can cause problems with jamming up. An adjustable soft 8 would be nice but it's such a small little thing, would be difficult to make.

This all might sound a bit complicated but it's really not. I just think about it exactly like tying in with DdRT on a natural crotch, that 3 inch or so branch is exactly what I'm looking for, and when matched with a nice short soft 8, it really does behave more like a basal anchor, as far as retrieval is concerned. The soft 8 just floats there underneath the tie-in and when you pull on the other end, the rope is just running through crotches exactly like a basal anchor.

 

[DLF]

@Muggs - Thanks for the pix & details! Here's something I just put together to try out. An adjustable friction saver, making the minimum ring-ring spacing as tight as I could, so it can be a multi purpose device:
- Soft-8 canopy anchor that can be adjusted for different branch sizes.
- Traditional adjustable friction saver when I may have many redirects or if I want to switch to MRS once in the canopy.

 

[pcpTR33]

Muggs demo tree really should be the tree of knowledge at this point. Going to give the soft 8 a go this week.