Old school/less gear

PUClimber

PUClimber

Location
Indiana
Hello to all. I was curious how many guys out there are still tying into their saddles with bowlines or other knots instead of use a carabiner or other rope snap. I know there is advantages and disadvantages. I know there's a lot of guys that are set in their ways and won't use carabiners or anything really fancy like that. I was curious just how many do actually tie directly into a ring or other fixture on their saddle. Also how many of you guys will forget biners places and have to tie in without using biners. Or even for the fact when you're double crotching or something to that effect. Any input would be great.
 
Those fellas are fuels. I use a snap, and tie in with a bowline when I use my tail.

Just like the Good Lord intended it.
 
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Those fellas are fuels. I use a snap, and tie in with a bowline when I use my tail.

Just like the Good Lord intended it.

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Butch that was the old testament!
 
It has been decades since I tied directly to the saddle without utilizing some sort of connector(Snap or 'biner) except for the odd impromptu rigging to demonstrate a knot or something. Once I caught on to spilt tails(Duh , why didn't I think of that) I began using 2 connectors and enjoying the ease of bypassing limbs etc.
 
I volunteered to chip for a couple guys last week who just tied in; no split tail no biners. 3 strand with wraps on the trunk. I asked the one guy if he wanted to use my Hobbs or any other rigging gear and he looked like I was trying to make him use a Flux Capacitor so I sat back and watched. My wife was helping chip and she asked me why they didn't need as much stuff as I had. I started to get worried but they dropped the stem on the neighbor's tree and took out a big lead. I knew I was safe because my wife wouldn't be fooled into thinking less equipment was better.
Phil
 
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double crotching all the time. Other than that, not really

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What he said.

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Same here. When tying in with the tail, it would seem a waste of time to tie on a fastener. i've never used a bowline for that; just 2 knots, both around both rings.

With the climbing line, a snap is faster than a knot.

It's all about efficiency, and safety.
 
FWIW When I double crotch using the tail (which is often) I usually do so with a 'biner. Every now and then that adds convenience because I can unclip and rotate the second tie-in to the other side of my body or route around a limb for a natural redirect.
 
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When tying in with the tail, it would seem a waste of time to tie on a fastener.

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I would agree if it were to just make one or two cuts, but if doing an entire removal (like Todd), I'd add a carabiner and possibly another micro pulley.
 
Sometimes when i double crotch; it is jsut for stability or travel; and fairly temporary. As long as my regulation lifeline and lanyard are being used correctly; and can fully function to save me; i'll sometimes use my rigging line for the 2nd.

i think this is safer and farther reaching sometimes than using a tail. For one thing there is no hazard for something to get caught in a lower loop and pull on you. Another is that i might not have 4x the distance of me to support to give up in lifeline. then i'd need 2x the distance from me to the ground not to have a hanging loop that something could fall into and place a 'snatch force' on me.

So, i might preset an Upside down"U" for the rig line; to cover 2 locations of rigging and travel to points. Then a 3rd area i'd have a DdRT set up; and get travel to the perimeter of that triangle and points in between. As long as i'm really dependent on my regulation supports; and just making stuff easier with rigging line i think i'm fine.

Other times on small stuff; i might have my regualtion double tie ins to good supports; but at remote distance and angle for comfort and catch. So, i might throw a rigging sling/krab set around a 2" stob and right to my belt. It'd be a 3rd tie in; but the first and most stabilizing catch. In fact so stabilizing; i end up not needing to have the regulation gear catch me. And; by virtue of it's position but not strength the 'illegal' support strength and rigging wear keep me from not needing to be caught by the 'legal wear'.
 
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FWIW When I double crotch using the tail (which is often) I usually do so with a 'biner. Every now and then that adds convenience because I can unclip and rotate the second tie-in to the other side of my body or route around a limb for a natural redirect.

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Here, here! I always use a biner so I can disconnect when needed.
 
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I'd add a carabiner and possibly another micro pulley.

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I keep a micro pulley on my harness for the 'M' method. When double crotching with the tail-end of my line, I use it as a slack tender.
 
I try to get by with as little gear as the situation requires.
Sometimes I tie-in with no 'biner or snap at all, other times, I will take two seperate ropes set-up with a schwabisch and a micro-pulley. Most commonly, I use two rope snaps in a split-tail configuration. I too, tie in with the tail to double crotch frequently. I worry it's becoming a crutch sometimes.

I like having the snap on the ned, but I feel like I am untying and retying that thing about 100 times a day. y'know, to pull the rope through a crotch, pull the rope out of the tree, etc.

while we're at it, bowline with a Yosemite finish for me, thanks.
 
I'm a rock climber at heart so biners are my life. I use a split tail with two Am'D biners on my primary tie-in... I just can't see the point of untying and re-tying every time I want to relocate my TIP. When I double crotch I use a steel rigging biner which is always on my harness mainly for double crotching or adding weight when I need to throw my rope. I tie into it with a clove hitch and a long tail for a bridge.

I don't like to carry lots of stuff but I hate it when I don't have what I need. So when I look at a tree I pick and choose what I put on my harness. That rigging biner and a 1' cord with a biner (thanks for the idea Tom) on it are the only things I always leave on.

while we're at it, if I don't have an eye splice, I use a double fish (or does that make it a scaffold knot?) on my primary tie in biner.
 
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