New RopeRunner?!?

Honestly the Apex just has no slickpin. So easy on and off. I do not adjust it. I adjust hitches. For different ropes. I still use my other 2 wrenches. But they have worn in slickpins.
 
.... and back to the RR Vertec, picked up mine yesterday. First impressions are positive. If you liked the way the RRP worked for getting on and off the rope, you should love the new Vertec. Huge improvement, and I had no trouble at all operating the slick pins on the Pro. The buttons on the Vertec are just faster and easier while at the same time leaving the outer surface of the Vertec smoother and therefore less prone to snags than its brother.

Having the upper bollard adjustable without tools is another big improvement, as is the change of shape from a round bollard to contoured cam. A contoured cam 'should' give a greater range of feel when adjusted through its different profiles. Just how much is still something I will need more time on.

Adjusting the upper cam is a bit of a fiddly process as it requires spinning a small, spring loaded cam that releases the primary rope cam for calibrated movement. Still, very glad it has been incorporated, as quick, tool less friction adjustability is needed on a mechanical every bit as much as it is on hitch based systems.

The lower bollard that replaces a pulley, appears to have more holding capacity under load while losing a very small amount of smoothness when tailing out slack. Personally I think it's an improvement and like the smaller and tighter configuration.

Take my rambling comments for what they are, merely first impressions. True analysis can only be done over time and in the tree. That my take a while for me as things are turning cold and snowy here.
 
OK, I forgot to comment on a few other interesting changes. The spring on the bird is considerably different. It is fully connected throughout its entire range of motion, meaning it doesn't free float after going over center. Maybe not a big thing in and of itself, but it does hold it still when off the rope instead of flopping all around. It also means that they are using a completely different type of spring. When you press down on the bird, it has a very smooth and linear feel compared to the Pro that gets progressively stronger as it is depressed.

Also, all the openings that are not for rope insertion have been closed off make it easier to get rope orientation correct.

The birds beak is no longer open thus reducing potential for snags on ropes and smaller carabiners.
 
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DSMc said:
OK, I forgot to comment on a few other interesting changes. The spring on the bird is considerably different. It is fully connected throughout its entire range of motion, meaning it doesn't free float after going over center. Maybe not a big thing in and of itself, but it does hold it still when off the rope instead of flopping all around. It also means that they are using a completely different type of spring. When you press down on the bird, it has a very smooth and linear feel compared to the Pro that gets progressively stronger as it is depressed.

Also, all the openings that are not for rope insertion have been closed off make easier to get rope orientation correct.

The birds beak is no longer open thus reducing potential snags on ropes and smaller carabiners.
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That does sound pretty nice. looking forward to your long term review
 
I love the Notch rope wrench. So simple, so easy. If you have trouble with being a light climber the notch wrench is the only one that opens up wide enough to be a light climber on stiffer rope. On other adjustable wrenches, I could hardly find any meaningful difference in the adjustments.

The original ISC wrench was designed when the ropes were more supple like yale PI 11.7. The newer constructions seem to be rounder and stiffer causing too much drag at higher angles. The Notch wrench can really tackle those ropes well in my experience.

The new FTC freexion is also amazing HIGHLY recomend it for the fluidity of descent. I have been mostly on the freexion lately when wrenching because it's design is so awesome. I mostly use a wrench as a secondary system and it is perfect for that. Very compact without the stiff tether. So smooth on descent.


The vertec has a bollard instead of a pulley because it can work on a higher variety of ropes and climber weights. A little added friction on ascent. It also has a better spring design. That was the main reason for a new runner. Should require less maintenance. I was running my vertec on 10mm HTP yesterday which simply can not be done with a pro. (The Vertec is not rated for 10mm so you didn't hear it from me).

As for the metal that notch uses, it is the same standardized metal found in the USA. 304 stainless, corrosion resistance is important. 7075 aluminum. The aluminum is forged instead of milled.
That is the reason for the price difference between an isc wrench and a notch wrench. $160 vs $80. The ISC are milled individually and the notch invested in tooling to make many for less.

The hex key that comes with the pro should NOT be used. That was a bad idea. Clearly.

All threads that I have ever encountered are capable of stripping. My old neighbor taught me a trick that I was grateful to learn. If you spin the bolt backwards first, when the threads line up right, you will feel a click, then it's safe to turn the other way to tighten. you all probably knew that, but that trick has saved me a lot of heartache.
 
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treebing said:
The hex key that comes with the pro should NOT be used. That was a bad idea. Clearly.

All threads that I have ever encountered are capable of stripping. My old neighbor taught me a trick that I was grateful to learn. If you spin the bolt backwards first, when the threads line up right, you will feel a click, then it's safe to turn the other way to tighten. you all probably knew that, but that trick has saved me a lot of heartache.
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Kevin, it wasn't the threads that stripped on my RRP bollard anyway, but the hex insert on the screw itself (my pic above) - both sides! Bart, in post 47 above, discusses the different shapes of screw heads - in my mind, even with the replacement bollard/ 2 screws I bought from TreeStuff, the round head of the screw could probably be much more, well, "roundy" giving a deeper machined hex section to give grip on with a well machined solid hex key. But I also think better steel for the screws woulda been a good design upgrade. The threads are fine, even with the blue goop they come with (threadlocker). All this is probably academic anyway now the new model RR is out.
And thanks for the comments about FTC - been pondering the design of yet another new shiny thingy . . .

Addenda: Ya know, just had another thought - maybe it's something to do with the original threadlocker used on the original shipped bollard adjustment screws. On mine, these screws were never removed fully but were tightened and untightened a couple of times while I tried my new RRP out on different ropes. Maybe that stuff set up or stiffened more on the threads than a new screw resistance would be if a new bollard and screws were used. But in normal use, I'd expect the adjustment screws to be loosened and tightened several times as mine were before stripping. Or maybe it's the single malt again. Cheers.
 
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treebing said:
I love the Notch rope wrench. So simple, so easy. If you have trouble with being a light climber the notch wrench is the only one that opens up wide enough to be a light climber on stiffer rope. On other adjustable wrenches, I could hardly find any meaningful difference in the adjustments.
Click to expand...

As a light climber I wholeheartedly agree with your thoughts on the Notch Wrench. It’s the bees knees
 
I caught flak in high school physics for referring to a low rate, pre-loaded spring like you use as a constant force spring (violated Hookes law) but in practical intention and application, they're constant force springs. Tape measure springs (remember those mechanical retractors?) technically are purely constant force per revolution if formed on a constant diameter because they generate rotational force from unbending at the tangent. Take that, Teach, for putting me in my place in front of the whole class!

trivia derail over

Kevin, you're cool with the floppy tether?
 
I started climbing start of 2019, and have never climbed with a floppy tether, but I am curious. Anything specific I should know? Warnings?
 
Anyone know what, if any difference is there between the CE stamped and non-stamped versions of the Apex? They are the same price, so why aren't they all stamped for simplicity's sake?
 
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