Long duration in spikes

[JeffGu]

I've always had trouble finding climbers that weren't downright torturous. The ClimbRight ones were pretty good with the Super Climber Pads or the Big Bucks but when I switched to the CF Gecko climbers, I found the right ones for me. I have one set with pole or euro gaffs (switch them as needed) and I keep the long tree gaffs on the other set. Faster to change climbers than it is to swap the gaffs. I just haven't been able to decide on the short gaffs... both the pole and euro ones work good for different trees, so I wish that I had a third set of the damn things but I don't see that happening. I got a really good deal on the other two sets, and I doubt if I'll get that lucky, again.

I hate the long tree gaffs on thin barked stuff. Feel like I'm at one of @JD3000's parties, wearing spiked high heels and a chicken costume. I like the way the euro gaffs keep your feet right against the tree, but on some stuff, the pole gaffs are easier to move in... because the euro ones like to sink in deep enough to be hard to pull back out. I think your height, weight, and general body geometry affect how comfortable they are. I'm just not lucky enough to find a gaff length/style that works on everything.

Maybe I need to try those crazy looking things the Japanese climbers use!

 

[JD3000]

You're the first to get there and the last to leave. Of course, leaving in an ambulance two days later really takes the wind out of one's sails...

 

[MikoDel]

I'm so glad I stopped in to read these posts. I kind of hate gaffs, and I'm sure that has something to do w/the fact that I've owned Buckingham spikes for about 10 years but I only got a wire flipline last year! Hugging the tree to advance a limp lanyard is surely lame. But back to the topic - yes, 100% agreement w/ "have to build your legs up to it" and "boots make a big difference". I didn't even know there were boots made specifically for spikes. Wow, there may be hope for me yet. It's always PAINFUL for me cause I don't gaff a lot. I hardly ever use them and they always really HURT on the insides of my shins. I have the Buck 3" wrap pads on Buck fixed tree gaffs. Without the wrap pads? Oh good Lord just forget it, TORTURE. I chose to wear my old, very worn Chippewa loggers and that was a mistake. It was a hot day (a few weeks ago, big elm takedown) but I should have worn my winter loggers as they have much more insulation (duh!) and that would have at least dumbed down my right leg pain from the acute "F___ING OUCH JEEZ!!" after about an hour to "Ow that smarts." Didn't like my wire core flipline too much either, but it was the first time I tried it and like everything else I'll probably like it better when I use it more, and am not distracted by pain. I could lose about 20lbs to be @ real fighting weight and that makes a difference too.

 

[rico]

I'm so glad I stopped in to read these posts. I kind of hate gaffs, and I'm sure that has something to do w/the fact that I've owned Buckingham spikes for about 10 years but I only got a wire flipline last year! Hugging the tree to advance a limp lanyard is surely lame. But back to the topic - yes, 100% agreement w/ "have to build your legs up to it" and "boots make a big difference". I didn't even know there were boots made specifically for spikes. Wow, there may be hope for me yet. It's always PAINFUL for me cause I don't gaff a lot. I hardly ever use them and they always really HURT on the insides of my shins. I have the Buck 3" wrap pads on Buck fixed tree gaffs. Without the wrap pads? Oh good Lord just forget it, TORTURE. I chose to wear my old, very worn Chippewa loggers and that was a mistake. It was a hot day (a few weeks ago, big elm takedown) but I should have worn my winter loggers as they have much more insulation (duh!) and that would have at least dumbed down my right leg pain from the acute "F___ING OUCH JEEZ!!" after about an hour to "Ow that smarts." Didn't like my wire core flipline too much either, but it was the first time I tried it and like everything else I'll probably like it better when I use it more, and am not distracted by pain. I could lose about 20lbs to be @ real fighting weight and that makes a difference too.

I see your running Buck permanent tree gaffs. They have a 3 1/2" gaff which is most likely way to long for anything your gonna see in PA. I myself frequently use the same gaff but I live among old-growth Redwoods and Firs where the bark can be over 10" thick. Also get some caddy pads or buck super wraps with the inserts. You will thank me later, and if you don't like them I will buy them from you. As far as flip-lines go you should be able to roll a flip-line up a large tree whether its wire core or not. I myself stopped using wire core a long time ago. I included a short vid of my ugly mug rolling a flipline up a Redwood. Also checkout Eric Schatz Flipline Demo on youtube. A good explanation of an old school technique we should all know.

 

[MikoDel]

I see your running Buck permanent tree gaffs. They have a 3 1/2" gaff which is most likely way to long for anything your gonna see in PA. I myself frequently use the same gaff but I live among old-growth Redwoods and Firs where the bark can be over 10" thick. Also get some caddy pads. You will thank me later, and if you don't like them I will buy them from you. As far as flip-lines go you should be able to roll a flip-line up a large tree whether its wire core or not. I myself stopped using wire core a long time ago. I included a short vid of my ugly mug rolling a flipline up a Redwood. Also checkout Eric Schatz Flipline Demo on youtube. A good explanation of an old school technique.

Thanks for that! You look pretty comfy on those. You are funny with the Cadillac pads. I had spent years blogging on Eric Frei's (sp?) tree forums, and watched his video comparing Gecko's to his old fave gaffs w/Caddy pads. I think I bought the Buckingham super wraps because I wasn't sure if Cadillac pads would fit my Buck spikes. After reading these posts I am going to try out my winter Chippewa logger boots, again with the Buck super wraps, and if the winter loggers and their extra padding still hurt like hell I will prolly go for the Caddy pads.

I have at least one big, dying Ash in the back I don't have to worry about nicking up. I don't really wanna do so much gaff work where my legs toughen up and can take it, but I know I have to do that kind of work sometimes, and no way do I want to be in the kind of pain I felt taking down that elm. I am also back on green shakes in the mornings and doing more skateboarding to shed those last 20 nasty pounds!

few more things -

• 10" thick bark means your gaffs ain't doing that tree no violence, correct? Please tell me you're not going up there to take that beauty DOWN ? Say it isn't so!!!
• I certainly have rolled my homemade 18' positioning lanyard up a tree many times, but I usually don't have anyone on belay and so it's "not as much fun". Of course I lean in to roll it up, but sometimes the gaffs just peel out. Not all the time. Of course I'm tied in from above and there's no real danger other than some minor skin scrapeage, but I have to tend my loose Schwabisch as well until the rope is heavy enough that it will pay thru on its own. I never felt as comfortable on gaffs ascending as I do when I dig in to work in one spot. "comfortable" here is a relative term. And when I watch those videos of the competitions where they "run" up the tree, make a cut and then careen back down - I'm speechless.
• Most tree guys I have seen and competed against in climbing competitions are built like preying mantises. You look like that as well. I'm more like a T-Rex, strong body and legs with short arms!!! Oh yeah and a BIG HEAD! Ha ha, no really I take a 38S jacket and a large helmet! So that's why when people ask me, "Did you ever try rock climbing?" I say no, I'll stick to trees thankyouverymuch! I might have to lean in a little farther than most to sic that rope along.
• Yes the Buckingham fixed gaffs seem to be the ticket for what I do. I knew even before I bought them, not to go crazy with $$$. I knew I would only use them occasionally. I have not had to sharpen them often - they are very sharp and the factory shape and point is preserved. I know I'm the problem, not the equipment.

 

[monkeylove]

@MikoDel if I recall we are just a couple miles from each other. I run Caddy pads on my Kleins. They work fine for me with my Chippewa and my hiking boots. You are more than welcome to try them out.

 

[rico]

Thanks for that! You look pretty comfy on those. You are funny with the Cadillac pads. I had spent years blogging on Eric Frei's (sp?) tree forums, and watched his video comparing Gecko's to his old fave gaffs w/Caddy pads. I think I bought the Buckingham super wraps because I wasn't sure if Cadillac pads would fit my Buck spikes. After reading these posts I am going to try out my winter Chippewa logger boots, again with the Buck super wraps, and if the winter loggers and their extra padding still hurt like hell I will prolly go for the Caddy pads.

I have at least one big, dying Ash in the back I don't have to worry about nicking up. I don't really wanna do so much gaff work where my legs toughen up and can take it, but I know I have to do that kind of work sometimes, and no way do I want to be in the kind of pain I felt taking down that elm. I am also back on green shakes in the mornings and doing more skateboarding to shed those last 20 nasty pounds!

few more things -

• 10" thick bark means your gaffs ain't doing that tree no violence, correct? Please tell me you're not going up there to take that beauty DOWN ? Say it isn't so!!!
• I certainly have rolled my homemade 18' positioning lanyard up a tree many times, but I usually don't have anyone on belay and so it's "not as much fun". Of course I lean in to roll it up, but sometimes the gaffs just peel out. Not all the time. Of course I'm tied in from above and there's no real danger other than some minor skin scrapeage, but I have to tend my loose Schwabisch as well until the rope is heavy enough that it will pay thru on its own. I never felt as comfortable on gaffs ascending as I do when I dig in to work in one spot. "comfortable" here is a relative term. And when I watch those videos of the competitions where they "run" up the tree, make a cut and then careen back down - I'm speechless.
• Most tree guys I have seen and competed against in climbing competitions are built like preying mantises. You look like that as well. I'm more like a T-Rex, strong body and legs with short arms!!! Oh yeah and a BIG HEAD! Ha ha, no really I take a 38S jacket and a large helmet! So that's why when people ask me, "Did you ever try rock climbing?" I say no, I'll stick to trees thankyouverymuch! I might have to lean in a little farther than most to sic that rope along.
• Yes the Buckingham fixed gaffs seem to be the ticket for what I do. I knew even before I bought them, not to go crazy with $$$. I knew I would only use them occasionally. I have not had to sharpen them often - they are very sharp and the factory shape and point is preserved. I know I'm the problem, not the equipment.

Yea when I here a fella complaining about shin pain in spurs I always recommend Caddys because they seem to work well for a large % of climbers.
In the bigger Reds and Firs the tree has no clue your wearing spurs.
Im sorry to inform you but the tree in the video is no longer with us. Its been removed, skidded, and milled!

 

[MikoDel]

Oh well... that's the job sometimes, isn't it?

 

[MikoDel]

@MikoDel if I recall we are just a couple miles from each other. I run Caddy pads on my Kleins. They work fine for me with my Chippewa and my hiking boots. You are more than welcome to try them out.

Hey hey Monk. Sure, always up for making new friends. I'll look for a private msg - we'll make a meet.

 

[ROYCE]

I agree with @southsoundtree you pair the right length gaff with the right tree and you are a step ahead of the program. I will differ with @ROYCE I am not a light boot fan but some of that could be body type and climbing style. I personally wear Nicks lineman boots with double thick leather soles. They are quite heavy and a bear to break in but offer superb support (for me) and comfort all day long which goes along with the superb support. I weigh in at a solid 24o in my draws and stand 6'3" tall so all that factors in. Biggest thing is keep trying til you find the winning combo. Climbing uncomfortable can lead to making poor decisions!

My post was referring to the weight of the spikes. I tend to like a lighter spike and a heavier boot.....than the other way around!!

 

[Magnum783]

My post was referring to the weight of the spikes. I tend to like a lighter spike and a heavier boot.....than the other way around!!

I would agree totally. I have titanium and alloy gaffs. The lighter gaff affords the ability to have more support with the same weight.

 

[MikoDel]

I just did a comparo between the price of Buck Super Wraps ($180) and Opsal "Caddy" pads ($75) on WesSpur. Should have gone for the Caddy pads back when... ! Big Buck Velcro Super Wraps are more than double the cost and, as I can attest, no miracle cure.I guess next purchase related to making my spikes live-able will be those. The fact that they are cast does, I imagine, eliminate the stabbing pain created by the gaff upper nailing my inner calf.
Thanks for your input.