In the latest episode of “Idiots with chainsaws”

[rico]

And there is nothing wrong with having differences in opinions... There's a lot of ways to skin a cat. Let's talk about it and let everyone take from it as they see fit.

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No offense intended Daniel, but you might want to do a little better job of practicing what your preachin'

 

[Daniel]

On the interweb..I think it was on arboristsite. Not a fan of that site, but they had a good graphic of a modified Coos. I generally do the triangular version because I find it much easier to perform, and get good result with it.

how is it any different in effect that a plunged back cut and back strap release? Is it easier to cut from the hooks? I don't see much advantage...

and I don't see how the triangle cut is helping much either.. maybe if the triangle was pointing towards the lay, but not like that.. I have never used it and I don;t know anyone that has, so I can't say for sure, but by the time you get anywhere near finishing the back cut you end up with nearly all the holding wood straight across the hinge.

 

[Daniel]

No offense intended Daniel, but you might want to do a little better job of practicing what your preachin'

how so?

 

[evo]

Both styles are much easier to cut when standing in spurs and your bar is shorter than the diameter. More so when the alternative is a bore cut with a long bar.
The idea is the same as a bore cut in reverse, remove as much non critical wood as possible.

 

[Daniel]

Both styles are much easier to cut when standing in spurs and your bar is shorter than the diameter. More so when the alternative is a bore cut with a long bar.
The idea is the same as a bore cut in reverse, remove as much non critical wood as possible.

that makes sense... I can bore as easily from the bucket as from the ground, so not much of an issue here. I do remember using a small saw to start a pilot plunge cut from the hooks, then switching out to a bigger bar.

 

[islandarb]

Your understanding is lacking... It's a pretty simple cut, unconventional, but simple. On a coos bay there is holding wood, but no actual hinge. "Dutchman on one or both sides of the hinge"... That's bad terminology at best...


That is not a coos bay... you must be thinking of another cut. Given that you don't seem to understand what a coos bay is, and I do: maybe... just maybe... when I say that I used a modified coos bay on that tree, you could take my word for it... Instead you spout complete nonsense... While I AM used to dealing with a bunch of dumbasses (there you go Sean) on these forums, you are typically not one of them.



If you are implying that the reason a coos bay works is becasue the speed of the final cut allows the faller to blow through the final cut before the tree can BC, you don't have a clue. That common mispercption is completely false... The guys over at the treehouse, who like to pat each other on the back for being the best fallers to ever walk the planet, got that one wrong too. They were none too happy when I pointed out they didn't know what they were talking about either.

ANd this video demonstrates just that.. it took 55 seconds from the time I stopped cutting until the the trunk split. When I stopped cutting that tree was ready to go.. would have taken no more than 5 seconds of cutting to trip the holding wood, without the BC. Might have have only taken one or two seconds more. So why did this one take 55 seconds to split? The way this cut performs is not about speed..

For those of you that aren't familair with the species, the white ash is by far the species most prone to BC in the mid-atlantic region. You can see that this one was a monster... but it's harder to tell from the video just how much lean she had. I would call that an extreme front leaner. If this was any other species, it would not have BCed: it would have taken the tree to the lay, before it BCed.

There are a lot of BCs on youtube. I have never seen another one that took more than a few seconds to split. Find one if you can. I'd bet my house that you can't find one that took 55 seconds.

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Lordy you are a true SPECIAL EDITION. Did you fall on your head as a kid?

 

[islandarb]

Thats why its called a modified Coos..A standard shallow undercut and proceed as directed. And yes, you do have directional control with this cut.

Obviously you have never chunked down 20-30 foot redwood mill logs on a hard leaner. Then you would understand just how linear the grain on redwood is, how prone it is to splitting vertically, and just how far they can split. I believe thats why they were historically used for shakes/shingles and split rails.

Again, not a cut I employ very often, but in the tool box when the need arises.

View attachment 91982

Love this. Tropical trees are not prone to barberchair....but nice to learn this.

 

[Shadowscape]

Might want want to retract your comments made towards me, aye? Who is the clueless one?

Won't happen. That would damage his fragile ego that he needs to stoke by making YouTube videos and telling everyone how great he is. If he could only look at himself from outside his warped bubble....

 

[islandarb]

Won't happen. That would damage his fragile ego that he needs to stoke by making YouTube videos and telling everyone how great he is. If he could only look at himself from outside his warped bubble....

I think one of his biggest problems is he has never got on an airplane. But ignorance is bliss I hear.

 

[rico]

how is it any different in effect that a plunged back cut and back strap release? Is it easier to cut from the hooks? I don't see much advantage...

and I don't see how the triangle cut is helping much either.. maybe if the triangle was pointing towards the lay, but not like that.. I have never used it and I don;t know anyone that has, so I can't say for sure, but by the time you get anywhere near finishing the back cut you end up with nearly all the holding wood straight across the hinge.

I run long bars and hate the mere thought of doing bore cuts while aloft. The triangular version negates the need to short bar or plunge.

 

[Stumpsprouts]

"This is way over your heads.... Even you @rico... you think you need a notch for a modified coos bay... when a kerf undercut works just fine and is far easier to cut."

"How far can you turn them with a coos bay?.... and does that mean you're plunging in to set a "proper" hinge, and then just using a coos bay on the back half of the back cut?"

Doesn't the question cancel out the statement? Is the supreme expert asking the lesser man for advise?

This just gets better and better the more he spews his bullshit. I really fuck that one up. But it was intentional to save time, and I will explain it that way to make people think I am a felling god, and a teacher of the arb world to all those lesser people. Brother. the crap this guy vomits out. I can tell you I wouldn't want him working with me on a job. Likely get someone killed.

For entertainment purposes only?


This coos bay looks interesting, is it basically preferred over a bore cut just in the circumstances where the diameter is a bit small to bore?

 

[Friedrich]

For entertainment purposes only?


This coos bay looks interesting, is it basically preferred over a bore cut just in the circumstances where the diameter is a bit small to bore?

where no directional control is required and where the lean is too severe for bore-cutting because the holding-strap will rip. i use the coos-bay alot in combination with rigging for instance when swinging around large braches that are mid or tip-tied.

 

[evo]

For entertainment purposes only?


This coos bay looks interesting, is it basically preferred over a bore cut just in the circumstances where the diameter is a bit small to bore?

I use it all the time on large limbs that I want to land flat with my 150, think Doug firs. Or I just buck them off like bucking a log basically the same cut. Face optional

 

[Daniel]

Might want want to retract your comments made towards me, aye? Who is the clueless one?

My understanding of a Coosbay is simply cutting the back cut in a semi circular manner leaving the holding wood to one side till last.

When you explain what that means...

 

[southsoundtree]

I use it all the time on large limbs that I want to land flat with my 150, think Doug firs. Or I just buck them off like bucking a log basically the same cut. Face optional

I do this bucking cut, cutting in one plane, on all four 'sides', leaving a square of wood in the middle, with limbs and some small logs that lean, letting them slide off rather than tip off the spar. For example, rather than face 6' logs that will be milled for fence boards. I measure 6' and a little trim, or 8' and a little trim for doug-fir 2x's.

 

[evo]

When you explain what that means...

I’d did in the following paragraph quite clearly.

 

[Daniel]

I do this bucking cut, cutting in one plane, on all four 'sides', leaving a square of wood in the middle, with limbs and some small logs that lean, letting them slide off rather than tip off the spar. For example, rather than face 6' logs that will be milled for fence boards. I measure 6' and a little trim, or 8' and a little trim for doug-fir 2x's.

I tried the exact same thing on a big oak top with a heavy front lean... last cut of the day. This guy wanted to rent the bucket truck, but it was on a fairly steep hill and it was going to rain hard that night. No way to move that bucket on the hill when it was wet, and I sure wasn't going to let him try to manuever it with bad traction. So I told him I would just blow the tops out of the trees myslef today, and charge him the same as renting the bucket. The only problem was it was dark and cops showed up after the first tree tree was topped out and tried to shut us down. I told the cop I only needed one more cut to blow the top out of the second tree and I could make it quickly. By memory, it was about 30-40' up and around 2' diameter. His saw, must have been a 500i right after they came out. It was ripping... Cut just as you described above and blew that top in seconds... I couldn;t see much, and didn't want to shorten up the sides so much as to risk getting the bar pinched. that was a fun cut. I wonder what they guy thought when he came back to clean up and saw the broken cut.

 

[Daniel]

I’d did in the following paragraph quite clearly.

I read that post a bunch of times and it wasn't clear to me.

I know I’m late to the game. My understanding of a Coosbay is simply cutting the back cut in a semi circular manner leaving the holding wood to one side till last.
Modifications can include a Dutchman on one side of the hinge, or both sides (remember this is for head leaners going with the lean more or less). Or leaving a strap of holding wood so the curf cross section is looks like a T. Another is leaving a triangle, of holding wood that can be blasted through. One can also cut out the center gutting the hinge as show in the old stihl manuals.
The goal is to leave the least amount of holding wood to cut though BEFORE the tree has a chance to barber chair.
Cutting with a short bar, waiting standing around with a camera until the tree barber chairs IS not a coosbay, if it were the sawyer would be sure to gut enough out there wouldn’t be slow creaking nor need to nibble.

A coos bay leaves a strip of holding wood in the middle of the stem, pointing in line with the lean. What does that have to do with "leaving the holding wood to one side til last"? And I still don't understand what "a Dutchman on one side of the hinge, or both sides" means. If that means what I suspect it might, you're talking about a kerf cut on both sides of the strip of holding wood. A kerf cut isn't a Dutchman.. and the holding wood isn't a hinge. And leaving a Dutchamn on one side is not a coos bay. Either way, that's about as clear as mud.

 

[rico]

how so?

Just that you can come down pretty hard of folks who have other ideas or don’t agree with you methods. And yes I realize that I can be guilty of doing the same.

 

[Shadowscape]

Guilty!