Hitch hiker/2/x thread

DSMc

Well-Known Member
Location
Montana
"I’m not understanding why the materials would change the forces being applied."

It is because the angles, which by the way took a lot of experimentation in less than single degree increments to get just right, create a wedging force against the rope.

Think of it as in pounding over a tree with wedges, as it is mechanically the same. Hard and smooth surfaces are needed for efficient energy transfer. If one of the components is soft and squishy it doesn't work, just as when the wood is too rotten and just compresses or if you were foolish enough to try pounding in a soft rope in place of the hard wedge.
 
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Brocky

Well-Known Member
Location
Michigan
The only thing the soft shackle, which stretches very little, is bearing against was the bushing, and now the rigging ring that acts like a pulley, both solids, that in turn bears on the rope, which likewise bears against the spline of the HH. The careful designing might have been required for the solid carabiner, but the shackle also travels down the slot and still creates friction.
 

DSMc

Well-Known Member
Location
Montana
Sorry, I for some reason am not making myself clear. Your bushing is inside the HH body and not being controlled by the slots. The only thing riding against the slots is the soft shackle. It will not, it can not transfer the energy to the bushing as well as a hard object.

I also experimented with bushings and needle bearings in the lower slot. My conclusions were that the improvements were insignificant and hard to justify the additional part.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
Location
Michigan
The rigging ring performs so much better than the bushing that its use has been dropped. The shackle is guiding the ring down the slots, pushing it against the rope. The angle insures that any load pushes the carabiner or ring push down more with increased load. The carabiner or shackle do come into contact with the top of the slot at the bottom portion of the slot, but the load is being directed in the opposite direction against the rope and HH.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
Location
Michigan
This came to mind during the discussion with Dave, how to make the original way of tying work better. Initial testing shows it improves the ascending performance. This is a non slip version of the expandable sleeving, just one of many kinds. Simply cutting and sewing to cord might make it look better, heat causes it to expand.
7C3C625E-CE21-488D-8632-710C5E2D7353.jpeg
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
Location
Michigan
I think after further observation that my previous suggestion about stiffening up the legs doesn’t work much better. When the body of the HH is allowed to rotate, the dogbone is closer to the wraps, allowing more slack to loosen the wraps. If it just pushes straight up, there isn’t as much slack being forced into the wraps.
 

DSMc

Well-Known Member
Location
Montana
Assuming that the pictured hitch does not have your full body weight on it, it would not be satisfactory for my use. I normally tie mine way shorter, like maybe 3" shorter.
 

Brocky

Well-Known Member
Location
Michigan
Right, no body weight, the theory didn’t make it that far before being rejected. The type of cord, and maybe the diameter, seems to determine how tight the hitch should be tied. Single braids, and dyneema cores cords can be looser, which allows the body to rotate easier. This is 7mm Coppa 5000 extended as far as possible and still grab reliably each time. I wouldn’t use it that way because there are no advantages for doing so, only illustrating a point.
9CC301A6-D8DF-429B-B658-6DC7699399A8.jpeg
 
Over the last couple weeks I’ve read from the beginning of this thread till the end. Tomorrow or Tuesday my HH2 and Samson Voyager rope should arrive. This will be my first time to try SRT. My experience so far has been using MRT and using a Blake’s Hitch with Arbor plex. When I’m descending, I take my time and don’t go fast. With the slow speeds I still get a bit of glazing from the friction of my Blake’s hitch. When doing long descents I’ve went to throwing my figure 8 on to save putting friction into my Blake’s hitch and shortening life of the rope. So when doing a long descent with a HH2, does the hitch hiker see majority of the heat or is it the friction hitch. I don’t recall seeing it mentioned other than somewhere someone said the HH could be a hand warmer, which pretty well answers my question.

Was also curious, the three different spots that are carrying the load the carbiner, dogbone, and friction hitch. Roughly what percent is each piece carrying?

Thanks guys. Really enjoyed this thread and it makes me feel like I’ve made a good first choice for getting Into SRT.
 

DSMc

Well-Known Member
Location
Montana
Congratulations on getting an HH2. I can't seem to remember the percentages that each of the 3 points carry but don't be too concerned about it. Things wear slow and don't heat up excessively. Take your time getting to know how it works and how to get your hitch optimized and it will become the most worry free device you will ever use. Have fun!
 

Jehinten

Well-Known Member
Location
Evansville
Over the last couple weeks I’ve read from the beginning of this thread till the end. Tomorrow or Tuesday my HH2 and Samson Voyager rope should arrive. This will be my first time to try SRT. My experience so far has been using MRT and using a Blake’s Hitch with Arbor plex. When I’m descending, I take my time and don’t go fast. With the slow speeds I still get a bit of glazing from the friction of my Blake’s hitch. When doing long descents I’ve went to throwing my figure 8 on to save putting friction into my Blake’s hitch and shortening life of the rope. So when doing a long descent with a HH2, does the hitch hiker see majority of the heat or is it the friction hitch. I don’t recall seeing it mentioned other than somewhere someone said the HH could be a hand warmer, which pretty well answers my question.

Was also curious, the three different spots that are carrying the load the carbiner, dogbone, and friction hitch. Roughly what percent is each piece carrying?

Thanks guys. Really enjoyed this thread and it makes me feel like I’ve made a good first choice for getting Into SRT.
If your hitch cord does get a little glazing, which it will, eventually especially if you leave the HH2 on the rope in between climbs (which means the same spots on the cordage are always in contact with the rope each time); then you can remove the hitch cord and roll it across the bark of a tree to give it new life and remove some of the glazing.
 

rope-a-dope

Well-Known Member
Location
Asheville
I dont think anyone has attempted to answer the friction points' percentage of load question because they are too variable. They work together in a chain to get the right kind of friction control that is not too sensitive which is how it works well in every single climbing situation/style. Single srs, doubled, 3:1 redirects and haul back set ups, and flat angle limb walks all work well on a HH because the design applies friction across a chain that ends at your fingers.
 

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