Fu*%face Von Clownstick

It's reassuring to me to see that he only got about the same number of votes as he did in the last run. He hasn't earned any new voters, but rather the Dems just keep getting worse, and 15 million people let them know that; just couldn't be bothered to vote for someone that lame. I didn't vote for Biden, and this time I voted Oceans, which didn't matter because I live in CA. I stopped voting blue 18 years ago, and it's looking like I will probably never vote for a major party candidate. I do feel like voting should be mandatory. I know there will be plenty of folks that didn't vote, and will complain about trump.
 
Matias said:
I know there will be plenty of folks that didn't vote, and will complain about trump.
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True, the Democrats seriously dropped the ball. But all these Liberals who withheld a vote or voted independent over Gaza, or because Harris was a woman, whatever, well, that was basically a vote for Trump whether they want to admit it or not. I don't think it was important whether we liked Harris or totally agreed with her, the vital thing was to stop Trump and this drift towards facism, and we failed. If we thought things were bad his first administration, that was nothing compared to what is coming. And an awful lot of the idiots that voted for him are going to deeply regret it before this next four years is done. They stand to loose as much as anyone else and they made the mistake of believing he gives a shit about them and the country.
 
Burrapeg said:
True, the Democrats seriously dropped the ball. But all these Liberals who withheld a vote or voted independent over Gaza, or because Harris was a woman, whatever, well, that was basically a vote for Trump whether they want to admit it or not. I don't think it was important whether we liked Harris or totally agreed with her, the vital thing was to stop Trump and this drift towards facism, and we failed. If we thought things were bad his first administration, that was nothing compared to what is coming. And an awful lot of the idiots that voted for him are going to deeply regret it before this next four years is done. They stand to loose as much as anyone else and they made the mistake of believing he gives a shit about them and the country.
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I totally agree with you, but all the third party votes put together wouldn't have won her the election, and you can't make idiots do something when they are too dumb to realize the truth in what you're saying. We need:
A. Fractional representation &
B. Mandatory voting
C. A secure app to vote instantly and remotely

I don't care how much you don't think it matters, you should have to take the 3 minutes to login and fucking vote for somebody.
 
Burrapeg said:
True, the Democrats seriously dropped the ball. But all these Liberals who withheld a vote or voted independent over Gaza, or because Harris was a woman, whatever, well, that was basically a vote for Trump whether they want to admit it or not. I don't think it was important whether we liked Harris or totally agreed with her, the vital thing was to stop Trump and this drift towards facism, and we failed. If we thought things were bad his first administration, that was nothing compared to what is coming. And an awful lot of the idiots that voted for him are going to deeply regret it before this next four years is done. They stand to loose as much as anyone else and they made the mistake of believing he gives a shit about them and the country.
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I see your points but there also is gerrymandering and the electoral college.
I just looked for the stats and essentially just a little over the population of King County voted in the entire state!
I will say I didn’t vote for Trump, but with the electoral college my vote for Harris, abstain, or third party wouldn’t have mattered much.
Shit will get wild, and the vp is scarier yet.
 
Matias said:
Well based on the vote count, you wasted your money, because he didn't get any more votes than last time. As they say, a fool and his money...
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Regardless of the vote count compared to 2020 (btw, there was actually more votes), there was more Trump support in many northern Massachusetts counties vs. 2020, a significant number people commute from southern NH to Mass.
It wasn't much money at all, only time.
I cannot see a reason vote for a third party candidate. I know there is the principal of it, also building of the voting base, to gain momentum in the hopes it will catch on more yearly.

2020 in Nashua, NH, a Trump supporter was just watching the ballots been counted by 4 people, (3 were known democrats, one was a known republican), then shortly after the counting started he was asked to leave the room and if he didn't he would be arrested. He was allowed to be in the hallway, just not the room of counting.
 
Stumpsprouts said:
Don’t give the government any more powers over you.
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Agreed. There's a paradox in big government. People want to give the gov't control over every aspect of our lives when it's their person in power but don't stop consider, what happens when the other party has that power? Trump getting elected isn't a crisis if we hadn't granted the gov't so much control over our lives to begin with.

Santa Claus doesn't live in Washington, a gov't big enough to give you everything you want is powerful enough to take everything you have.
 
Burrapeg said:
True, the Democrats seriously dropped the ball. But all these Liberals who withheld a vote or voted independent over Gaza, or because Harris was a woman, whatever, well, that was basically a vote for Trump whether they want to admit it or not. I don't think it was important whether we liked Harris or totally agreed with her, the vital thing was to stop Trump and this drift towards facism, and we failed. If we thought things were bad his first administration, that was nothing compared to what is coming. And an awful lot of the idiots that voted for him are going to deeply regret it before this next four years is done. They stand to loose as much as anyone else and they made the mistake of believing he gives a shit about them and the country.
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DRIFT TOWARD Fascism? Between the professional, federally weaponized fascism of Obama and Biden, Trump's "fascist" moves are hardly worth noting.

Let me break this down using the classic scholarly definitions of fascist governmental tendencies:

Key Indicators to Analyze:
1. State control of information/media
2. Merger of state and corporate power
3. Use of government agencies against political opponents
4. Suppression of opposition
5. Executive overreach
6. Forceful suppression of criticism

Obama Administration Actions:
- Operation Choke Point targeting legal businesses
- Expansion of surveillance programs
- IRS targeting conservative groups
- Use of Espionage Act against whistleblowers
- Social media coordination for content control

Trump Administration Actions:
- Used federal forces in civil unrest situations (Portland/DC)
- Verbally encouraged peaceful efforts to influence election certification

Biden Administration Actions:
- Direct coordination with tech companies on content (aka Government Censorship of the people)
- Labeling parents at school boards as potential terrorists
- Weaponization of federal agencies against opponents
- Pressuring banks on customer political views
- Executive orders bypassing Congress

Comparative Analysis:
- All three administrations showed concerning overreach
- Obama established many surveillance precedents
- Trump attempted more direct executive control
- Biden expanded government-corporate coordination
- Obama and Biden used federal agencies against opponents
 
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Regarding so many false comments on Trump by otherwise smart members of this forum, here are just a few of the gas lighting lies fed nonstop to the American people by the corrupt dying old school media. Thankfully with so many independent broadcasters podcasts and YouTubers in the news today, old news can't get away with fooling (as many of) the American people anymore. This is an analysis by AI of just a few of the lies told over and over and over and over by what used to be the mainstream media. Now essentially dead. Good riddance to them. I can tolerate biased media if they admit that they are biased. As long as they tell the truth, I can tolerate it. We can disagree on our opinions. But I can't tolerate outright liars.

Obama (2009-2017):
Approximately $11.8-12.2 trillion in today's dollars (adjusted from $9.3 trillion)

Trump (2017-2021):
Approximately $8.7-9 trillion in today's dollars (adjusted from $7.8 trillion)

Russia collusion narrative: While Russian interference in 2016 was confirmed, the specific allegations of direct Trump-Russia conspiracy/coordination were not proven by the Mueller investigation, leading to corrections by several outlets.

Lafayette Square clearing: Initial widespread reporting that protesters were cleared specifically for a photo op was later contradicted by the Interior Department IG report, leading to corrections.

Georgia phone call: Initial reports about Trump telling officials to "find the fraud" used quotes that were later retracted as not verbatim.

Early COVID vaccine development timeline: Claims that Operation Warp Speed had no role were later revised by fact-checkers.

Steele Dossier: Many specific claims that received extensive coverage were later debunked or retracted by outlets that had reported them.

AI Analysis: Focusing on prominent media claims that were later disproven or appear demonstrably incorrect, with confidence ratings:

"Trump will refuse to leave office/stage a coup after losing" (98% confidence this claim was false given peaceful transfer occurred)

"The Hunter Biden laptop story is Russian disinformation" (95% confidence this media narrative was false, as major outlets later authenticated key elements)

"Trump called neo-Nazis 'fine people' in Charlottesville" (90% confidence this was false - full transcript shows he explicitly condemned them)

"Trump told Georgia officials to 'find the fraud'" (90% confidence the specific quote was false - Washington Post issued correction)

"Trump colluded directly with Russia to win 2016" (85% confidence this broad claim was false based on Mueller report conclusions)

"Trump ordered tear gas used on protesters for a church photo" (85% confidence this was false per Interior Department IG report)
"Trump suggested injecting bleach as COVID treatment" (80% confidence this was a mischaracterization - he asked about UV light/disinfectant research)

"Trump called all immigrants 'animals'" (80% confidence this was false - context shows MS-13 gang reference)

"Trump removed MLK bust from Oval Office" (90% confidence false - reporter corrected this within hours)

"Trump campaign changed GOP platform to favor Russia" (85% confidence false - later reporting showed this didn't occur)

Note: These confidence ratings reflect my assessment of the specific media claims being false, not broader political judgments.

I've aimed to be precise and direct while avoiding partisan interpretation. Would you like me to elaborate on any specific example with more detailed sourcing and fact-checking?
 
Daniel said:

after 15 years my GF threatened to break up if I voted for Trump...

I guess that's fair.... I threatened to break up with her if she got vaxxed...
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Speaking of “moral superiority“, could you imagine giving certain groups of citizens (lgbtq+) less protection under that law because you simply disagree with their sexual orientation.

Speaking of “moral superiority“, could you imagine one party taking away a woman’s bodily autonomy and choosing what she can and cannot do with her body?
 
Stumpsprouts said:
Nooooo
No mandatory anything my dude.

Don’t give the government any more powers over you.

If people aren’t compelled to vote, then the salespeople didn’t do their job, it’s not the voters fault there wasn’t anything worth buying.
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So, on this specific issue, mandatory voting, what is the downside? I generally agree with that sentiment, but no mandatory ANYTHING is anarchy, and while that is the highest ideal that we can aim for, I don't think that is a realistic expectation of most humans. Like, no mandatory locking up of murderers and rapists? No mandate about private property? No mandates of any kind would be fucked up, and I would bet my testicles that there are at least a few mandates aka laws that you support.

Mandatory voting doesn't mean you have to pick from one of the top listed options, and if combined with fractional representation, would reduce the power of the big two. I said we need both. If everyone who could vote did so, then neither of the two main parties would have even gotten 40% of the total votes.

I know sooooo many people who complain about the state of things but don't vote. FUCK THAT! If you didn't go out and put your opinion in the box, then shut the fuck up.

Furthermore, I get not liking what the two big parties are selling, but don't tell me that nobody was. Mandatory voting would probably be an enourmous boost to other parties, and make it far more likely that we see things shift in that direction. but if you couple it with fractional representation, ypu would see people run third party campaigns much more seriously, knowing that they don't have to get the top spot to make a difference in how things are actually governed.

And I am genuinely curious what you see as the big downside to just mandatory voting. Not mandatory anything else, just voting. I am struggling to concieve of a downside.
 
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