Descending a spar ddrt

[Jehinten]

70 trees @ 45m (150’), I assumed they would be topped around 100’ each, ergo the 7000 ft figure. F that!

Pull up yo god damn own rigging line, Set it, and rap down on a fig 8 (with prussik backup if you want to be proper)

I gotcha on the length. I was considering one tree at a time where you were looking at the scope of the job.

There's 100 ways of making this easy or hard it'll be up the the OP to decide how to go about it. And not all companies will let you descend on a rigging line.

Not that my above scenario is how he has to do it, but if he went that route they could always leave a 20-30 lb stub when they set up their pull line for the rigging rope (throwline, paracord...) tie the stub and make your cut and use that 30 lbs to pull/assist that rope up to the top. Or instead of the stub use the climbing saw, your done with it up there at that point anyways.

Tie it off at the top instead of a basal to reduce the amount of rope, rappel, remove the climbing system.

 

[fall_risk]

Set it, and rap down on a fig 8 (with prussik backup if you want to be proper)

That was my first thought too, although it's definitely not best practice. My current employer won't allow it. The reason I didn't suggest it is that I'd be pretty nervous trying to pull over a 80'+, 100"+ dbh tree with a half inch line, or even 5/8ths. 5/8ths will work OK in a rescue 8, but anything bigger is probably a bad idea.

As far as pulling up the pull line, if it's me, I'm bringing a sling will a pinto or something, and a skinny little 7 or 8mm hand line, and best believe the groundhogs are using that to pull my 3/4" or 7/8" pull line up that tree, along with my 461/576, especially if I am climbing up and not raptoring. Don't lift with your knees, lift with your ground guys. The climber pulling that gear that far is begging for a shoulder injury. Professionals can't afford stupid injuries, and this is not pulling you top-handle 40'

For me, that hand line then becomes my SRT canopy anchor pull down, but at the distances and volume these guys are talking about, I'd probably use a figure eight or even a rappel rack to descend. My runner, bone, akimbo, zigzag, and split tails are for working, not wearing to nothing just to take the down elevator.


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[Scheffa]

Appreciate all the responses and suggestions guys.

I own the company so the splicing if ropes is no worries, so long as I’m comfortable doing them.

Unable to get lifelines longer than 200ft, reason being is we are required by the utility to use spliced termination and none of the suppliers here were able to splice me longer ropes prior to us starting the job Monday.

The route I’m planning on going is to make up a couple different length friction savers, notch these in the back of the soar and descend after setting the bull rope.

May descend on the bull line using a figure 8 and keeping pole belt around spar as a back up.

I will have 4 climbers and 4 ground guys on the job, 2 climbing at a time, 2 spotting.
2 blokes running the spider lift and 2 running the excavator and chipper to process material

 

[pctree]

Can you just have the climber set the pull line and then set a loop in line below the bowline and attach a steel biner and descend off that

 

[CanadianStan]

Can you just have the climber set the pull line and then set a loop in line below the bowline and attach a steel biner and descend off that

or maybe a cheaper option than steel biners ($30/each) would be to bunny ear alpine butterfly 1-2 aluminum rings? Trying to think outside the box here.
You're still relying on the rigging rope as your main support line and apparently that's not acceptable in the circumstances

That was my first thought too, although it's definitely not best practice. My current employer won't allow it. The reason I didn't suggest it is that I'd be pretty nervous trying to pull over a 80'+, 100"+ dbh tree with a half inch line, or even 5/8ths. 5/8ths will work OK in a rescue 8, but anything bigger is probably a bad idea.

As far as pulling up the pull line, if it's me, I'm bringing a sling will a pinto or something, and a skinny little 7 or 8mm hand line, and best believe the groundhogs are using that to pull my 3/4" or 7/8" pull line up that tree, along with my 461/576, especially if I am climbing up and not raptoring. Don't lift with your knees, lift with your ground guys. The climber pulling that gear that far is begging for a shoulder injury. Professionals can't afford stupid injuries, and this is not pulling you top-handle 40'

For me, that hand line then becomes my SRT canopy anchor pull down, but at the distances and volume these guys are talking about, I'd probably use a figure eight or even a rappel rack to descend. My runner, bone, akimbo, zigzag, and split tails are for working, not wearing to nothing just to take the down elevator.


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If you're correctly notching, and wedging, trees that are relatively straight there shouldn't be an issue with half inch line ... Even 2 half-inch lines doubled up could work as well.

Also as long as you have a lanyard around the trunk you technically wouldn't be relying on the Fig8 as *primary* life support

 

[rico]

Why are we making just a big deal out of setting some pull lines and bombing out of a tree?

 

[Barc Buster]

Why are we making just a big deal out of setting some pull lines and bombing out of a tree?

Was kind of wondering the same thing.

 

[Scheffa]

Why are we making just a big deal out of setting some pull lines and bombing out of a tree?

Wouldn’t say it was making a big, more so discussing different ways of achieving a task safely and efficiently whilst following strict guidelines set out by the utilities.

Some people in this forum enjoy sharing ideas and thoughts about different techniques without turning it into a dick measuring shit slinging debacle full of obscenities, at least that’s why I come here anyway

 

[Tyler Durden]

Wouldn’t say it was making a big, more so discussing different ways of achieving a task safely and efficiently whilst following strict guidelines set out by the utilities.

Some people in this forum enjoy sharing ideas and thoughts about different techniques without turning it into a dick measuring shit slinging debacle full of obscenities, at least that’s why I come here anyway

When doing utility contracts, I turn it in to a sort of game. How much fun can i have whilst still playing by the rules.


Bonus points for style and creativity.

I love being picked to do that tree that everybody else turns down in these situations.

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[ClimbMIT]

I used to cut a groove in the top of a spar to descend, haven't for years even though I'm still here to type about it. Isn't that viewed as responsible for killing numerous climbers?

I would like to know more about this groove killing climbers? I remove many 100-120’ Loblolly Pines that have no branches until about 80’. Lots of land clearance guys here need the taller pines topped and dropped on a 50-120’ lot. I have been using a bore cut about 2-3” from my last cut and set my adjustable friction saver over the notch. Descend with flipline most of the way then gotta have a little fun on the last 30’ - 40’ [emoji12]


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[Tyler Durden]

I have climbed beetle kill Pines in California with no bark that held an adjustable friction saver with no issues on the way down. As long as you're leaving roughly two fists width between your rings that should be enough Force pinching the system together to keep it on the spar

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[ClimbMIT]

I have climbed beetle kill Pines in California with no bark that held an adjustable friction saver with no issues on the way down. As long as you're leaving roughly two fists width between your rings that should be enough Force pinching the system together to keep it on the spar

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I had one take me for a ride until it caught on my pull rope once. I think the ring with Prusik had a slight twist in it. Once I began to descend it caused the ring to slide...so I thought. Two fist between rings?


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[Tyler Durden]

I had one take me for a ride until it caught on my pull rope once. I think the ring with Prusik had a slight twist in it. Once I began to descend it caused the ring to slide...so I thought. Two fist between rings?


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If you leave a gap between your two rings roughly the length of your two Fists put together end-to-end there should be enough compression on the friction saver that it will pinch The Spar without any issues. The beetle kill trees We Are Climbing in California didn't have any bark half the time and would be covered in what amounted to mud. I never had my friction saver slip as long as you leave a good gap between the Rings

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[ClimbMIT]

If you leave a gap between your two rings roughly the length of your two Fists put together end-to-end there should be enough compression on the friction saver that it will pinch The Spar without any issues. The beetle kill trees We Are Climbing in California didn't have any bark half the time and would be covered in what amounted to mud. I never had my friction saver slip as long as you leave a good gap between the Rings

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That’s has to be a little disconcerting with no bark! I believe mine was pinching the spar but started to roll once I put my weight on it. I was tired and didn’t take enough time to reset my Prusik which was full of sap. Could have been a bad situation! Thanks for the tip Tyler


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[rico]

Wouldn’t say it was making a big, more so discussing different ways of achieving a task safely and efficiently whilst following strict guidelines set out by the utilities.

Some people in this forum enjoy sharing ideas and thoughts about different techniques without turning it into a dick measuring shit slinging debacle full of obscenities, at least that’s why I come here anyway

Just keeping it real Scheffa. We are after all talking about one of the simplest procedures we see as tree men. K.I.S.S seems appropriate here, and this scenario certainly does not warrant reinventing the wheel, pulling our peckers out, or obscenity filled shit talking.

Your OP tells us you have just finish brushing the tree out, which implies that the climber should already have a proper tie in. No?
Pull up and set a tagline, bomb down on your retrievable friction saver, and retrieve your climbing line. Done. Simple, fast, extremely effective, and ultra safe.

Watch a few Dave Coleman vids. Just beautiful! That fella is a Mountain Ash, Euc killing machine, and one serious mofo! DdRT on a Lockjack with the ART Rope Guide seems to work rather well for him. I work with Blue Gum Eucs a few times a year and can say that a properly set friction saver works beautifully in these slippery, thin barked trees.

No trusting your life to homemade disposable slings, that may or may not be disposed of. No chance of smashing a carabiner that you are gonna use as life support on the next tree. No descending on a possibly compromised, beat to shit pull line. No trusting your life to the old "notch on the top of the spar" technique. How many of those 70 lines are gonna get hung up while trying to set them from the ground? A few I reckon.

 

[Tyler Durden]

The worst part about climbing the beetle kill Pines was having to peel the sheets of bark off that hadn't Fallen yet. A lot of times I would carry a hatchet or an axe just to break through that thick Ponderosa bark so I could get my spurs into some solid wood. I made the mistake of not debarking a zombie tree one day and rode a whole cylinder of bark down about 10 ft until it caught on a stub.

And no problem on the tip we are all here to make sure everybody gets home safe.

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[ClimbMIT]

The worst part about climbing the beetle kill Pines was having to peel the sheets of bark off that hadn't Fallen yet. A lot of times I would carry a hatchet or an axe just to break through that thick Ponderosa bark so I could get my spurs into some solid wood. I made the mistake of not debarking a zombie tree one day and rode a whole cylinder of bark down about 10 ft until it caught on a stub.

And no problem on the tip we are all here to make sure everybody gets home safe.

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I have made a similar mistake on old lightning struck Pine. Not fun!


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[rico]

If you leave a gap between your two rings roughly the length of your two Fists put together end-to-end there should be enough compression on the friction saver that it will pinch The Spar without any issues. The beetle kill trees We Are Climbing in California didn't have any bark half the time and would be covered in what amounted to mud. I never had my friction saver slip as long as you leave a good gap between the Rings

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The old mudd barked, beetle kill, blue stained, Ponderosa Pine. Huge 3-4 inch thick pieces of peeling dead bark stuck in your gaffs as your knuckles and chin begin to bleed. Good times!
You kinda miss it, don't ya?

 

[ClimbMIT]

The old mudd barked, beetle kill, blue stained, California Pine. Huge 4 inch thick pieces of peeling dead bark stuck in your gaffs as your knuckles and chin are beginning to bleed. Good times!

That would have to pay well!


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[Tyler Durden]

@rico I actually leave Tuesday for the Pacific Northwest. No Beetle trees but I'll be back in some big conifers. Two weeks of contract climbing for South Sound tree should be a blast

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