Dead Eye Sling

Muggs said:
I'm not against half hitches in general, I use them everyday. I am against half hitch backups thrown onto the end of otherwise untrustworthy knots. If a knot requires a half hitch backup, then it is, by definition, untrustworthy, otherwise the half hitch wouldn't be thrown onto the end of it. I really don't see why this position should be so controversial. I strive for logical consistency in my reasoning and this is just where my train of thought leads.

Anyway, this really isn't the point of my video. I was just looking for feedback on this particular technique with a dead eye sling.

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I do like that, and I will be showing my crew.
Sorry about the derail; I kinda bristle up about rules of thumb that really have no negative consequences at all for following. (y)
 
@Muggs I had my GM tie it that way last sat. The sling was to short to tie traditionally, so I had him tie the bowline and slip the porty thru. Had he been able to adjust the slack tighter it would have been fine. It was a large silver maple with a somewhat tapered trunk. On the first run the porty slid up the tree a little bit. That was also okay but GM got nervous and linked two slings together to get it cinched tight.
Next time I'm on the ground and my "partner" is climbing I'll try it myself. I like how easy it is to adjust the porty to a different spot on the tree. Although I guess a woopie does the same thing ....
 
96coal449 said:
Nice I really like the quick adjustability for repositioning. It's like a woopie sling in that cense. If you forget the woopie, or if it's on another tree, you have an alternative.
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flyingsquirrel25 said:
I would agree with your theory. And I use this any time my sling is too short to use the cow hitch. Many guys like to use the timber hitch in this spot, and that is just a personal preference, I don't like it at all. Thanks for taking the time to video this and post it.

Merry Christmas to all!!!
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just a matter of semantics, but a cow hitch without the half hitch isnt a cow hitch.

A cow hitch doesnt need a half hitch as a backup. it needs the half hitch to be a cow hitch. without it it is something else, and something that doesnt work. sort of like a bowline if the rabbit doesnt go back down the hole or something.

I sometimes put an extra half hitch on the cowhitch just for the hell of it, but I do that to my bowlines too, or I yosemite them. that would be a backup half hitch, the first one is an integral functioning part of a cow hitch. not a backup.

that said, your bowline seems like a good technique and i'm sure it will come in handy.
 
This method is ok maybe if you had a short sling and you were stuck,
I always come prepared with many slings of different lengths and diameters,
I have been using the tried and tested Cow Hitch for years, it has never let me down.
There is no need to reinvent the wheel.
Looks like a very basic basal anchor system for srt climbing.
If you factored in a prusik, it may be easier to adjust.
Thanks for posting the video, food for thought and discussion.
By the way, what diameter is your dead eye sling.
 
"You have your way, I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, the only way - it does not exist."
- Friedrich Nietzsche

Kevin, I've always thought that the cow hitch and girth hitch are exactly the same thing, except that the girth is formed with a fixed loop or strap, and the cow is tied using the end of a rope. The cow hitch is really just two opposing half hitches. Looking at it this way, the cow hitch and clove hitch are very, very similar, both being just two half hitches. Both can be tied midline or endline. On the clove hitch the h.h's are both going the same way, and on the cow hitch they go in opposing directions. And then any additional h.h's beyond those would be backups.

The semantics of it all are quite interesting, but in all honesty, we can't engage in meaningful conversation without first taking the time to agree on shared definitions of the words we are using. The example that I used in my newest article is a bit more subtle: there are about as many different informal definitions for ‘capitalism’ vs ‘socialism’ vs ‘fascism’ as there are broke college students waiting to vote for the first politician who will promise them “free” tuition. Ever witnessed a crazy, ranting argument on Facebook? Lack of shared definitions for words almost certainly contributed to the misunderstandings.

Anyway, not trying to reinvent the wheel with this technique, its just a different way of using the running bow that we all know and love and I just prefer it so much over the cow hitch that I thought I would share. My entire site is designed for my apprentice to learn the basics but if anyone else can benefit from it then all the better. Always looking for feedback on my site, you can check it out at EducatedClimber.com.

Cheers
 
treebing said:
just a matter of semantics, but a cow hitch without the half hitch isnt a cow hitch.

A cow hitch doesnt need a half hitch as a backup. it needs the half hitch to be a cow hitch. without it it is something else, and something that doesnt work. sort of like a bowline if the rabbit doesnt go back down the hole or something.

I sometimes put an extra half hitch on the cowhitch just for th be hell of it, but I do that to my bowlines too, or I yosemite them. that would be a backup half hitch, the first one is an integral functioning part of a cow hitch. not a backup.

that said, your bowline seems like a good technique and i'm sure it will come in handy.
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Cow hitch is a great anchor hitch but it needs 2 half hitches to lock a hitch. It's not a good knot because it's not a knot at all. If you look at breaking strength tests between a cow hitch and a runner the strength is significantly different. So just watch your swl
 
I've seen the the Cow hitch in numerous knot books being listed as a knot. Without backup it isn't a very secure knot, but it is still a knot all by itself.
 
Brocky said:
I've seen the the Cow hitch in numerous knot books being listed as a knot. Without backup it isn't a very secure knot, but it is still a knot all by itself.
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As I learned it a knot can hold and not roll itself. I hitch can walk without a lock. It's a cow hitch, a clove hitch not a cow knot or clove knot.
You can tell this is a rule because there is an exemption with a timber hitch but that's why you use 5 wraps not 3 to be the equivalent of 2 half hitches not none.
 
All the same a cow hitch is a hitch not a knot but, a cow hitch with 2 half hitches is actually called a Stilton and that is a knot. Right name for the right thing.
 
Muggs said:
"You have your way, I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, the only way - it does not exist."
- Friedrich Nietzsche

Kevin, I've always thought that the cow hitch and girth hitch are exactly the same thing, except that the girth is formed with a fixed loop or strap, and the cow is tied using the end of a rope. The cow hitch is really just two opposing half hitches. Looking at it this way, the cow hitch and clove hitch are very, very similar, both being just two half hitches. Both can be tied midline or endline. On the clove hitch the h.h's are both going the same way, and on the cow hitch they go in opposing directions. And then any additional h.h's beyond those would be backups.

The semantics of it all are quite interesting, but in all honesty, we can't engage in meaningful conversation without first taking the time to agree on shared definitions of the words we are using. The example that I used in my newest article is a bit more subtle: there are about as many different informal definitions for ‘capitalism’ vs ‘socialism’ vs ‘fascism’ as there are broke college students waiting to vote for the first politician who will promise them “free” tuition. Ever witnessed a crazy, ranting argument on Facebook? Lack of shared definitions for words almost certainly contributed to the misunderstandings.

Anyway, not trying to reinvent the wheel with this technique, its just a different way of using the running bow that we all know and love and I just prefer it so much over the cow hitch that I thought I would share. My entire site is designed for my apprentice to learn the basics but if anyone else can benefit from it then all the better. Always looking for feedback on my site, you can check it out at EducatedClimber.com.

Cheers
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Cow hitch, girth hitch, cats paw common name abound and confuse when you cross regions, groups, generations and people
 
Sorry for the confusion Kevin, I didn't mean to say it was a knot, but that it was a hitch by itself without the half hitch backup.
 
JeffGu said:
Clearly, I'm going to need the opinion of a real expert. Now, where do I find a talking cow?
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Rookie, what a ridiculous post where do you find a talking cow. Honestly who asks that. This is how you know you're not very fun.
If you've been to a proper party on the farm someone has had a in depth chat with a cow or whatever animal you find after you jump the fence you weren't supposed to.

Where do I find a talking cow. Really man you don't have one story that starts at my buddy's party.

Lol, I couldn't resist
 
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