Custom Friction Saver Ideas

thanks for the heads up norm. I am curious now if there has been any testing on that(ring vs carabiner). Now that I think about it, the folks at ART are clever enough to think of that. So, there must be a reason for the ring instead of a carabiner.
 
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Is it cross loading Norm,would a steel biner make a difference.

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Carabiners are designed to be loaded along the major axis (spine). Using it in a rope guide, as the choking link, it is being pulled from the side, not longitudinally. Why not use a 'pear shaped screw link'?
I, personally, would not allow a rope guide, with a carabiner as the choking link, to be used in a competition or in my workforce. I would need to see documentation, from the manufacturer, with pictures showing how the carabiner is being loaded, before I would allow it.
 
Norm but from your explanation a Carabiner being used with an Friction Saver would be fine, because its not choked off against the spar. Correct?
 
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Using it in a rope guide, as the choking link, it is being pulled from the side, not longitudinally.

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I disagree. Unless it is sideloaded on a spar this isn't even physically possible. It is true there is some pressure from the prussic or friction device on the side of the caribiner but this pressure is no different than would be the case in a conventional ring-ring friction saver where there is pressure from the climbing line pressing the small ring against a carabiner in place of the big ring. Would you dissallow this as well? The principal loading is still along the caribiners primary axis.
 
Yeah, using a carabiner as a choking link is always a bit of a controversial choice. I've certainly done it plenty of times, but always with a beefy steel biner and on a large diameter stem so as to minimize side loading on the biner.

Overall, with something you're going to use everyday I go with Norm. Choking with a biner will prematurely wear the hardware and is also begging to have the gate mangled, if you're unlucky maybe opened unexpectedly. Pretty sure if you save the nifty diagrams from the petzl gear you get that they have a diagram specifically telling you not to pressure the side of a loaded biner.
 
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Norm but from your explanation a Carabiner being used with an Friction Saver would be fine, because its not choked off against the spar. Correct?

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Yeah, I have 2 fixed length FS's with aluminum captive eye krabs. They are definitely not going to be side loaded.
 
Not to get everyone off topic but I just finished making my homemade rope guide. It seems that a lot of people are against them and sound like they’re saying “Oh suck it up and buy the ART,” but I’d much rather make my own and spend less. I was able to make mine for about $120 and some quality splicing time!  It sets up the same way an ART would on your tie in point and retrieves the same as well. Haven’t gotten to climb on it yet but it looks like it’ll work just fine, until then, see what everyone thinks!
 

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You're getting folks back ON topic. Don't listen to the nay-sayers. Looks great and you probably made exactly what you wanted not what someone else thought was the best configuration. Nice work.
 
Is that the CMI shackle pulley? If so I have some issues with it. Be careful as to how your rope is running. If you are off it and weight it just right it will run over the side and onto the sharp edge.
 
Yes, it is the CMI shackle pulley. Yeah I noticed it did that when I was just playing with it on the ground. We'll see how it is when I climb on it, if it doenst work, then back to the drawing board!
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Well I ended up doing some mod work to mine and it worked out pretty well. I found a couple of really thin washers to put between them or had thought about adhering them somehow to the pully but luckily I got two that fit and give it just enough of a lip to fix the problem.
 
I don't have it in front of me but I started with a 10' piece of stable braid, did the eye splice, cut 2' off and then did a back splice. I would guess its around 6-7' long. I will measure it when I get to work tomorrow.
 
Got to finally climb on the homemade rope guide today. Did two 25-30' climbs, wanted to start low and slow with it. It worked great, rope never came off the pulley and retrieved well out of the Ash. I didnt bother trying to retrieve it from the ground out of the Zelkova but otherwise was really good. Couple tweaks I have to make here n there but so far pleased, see how it does on bigger climbs!
 
Here is my new custom rope guide. I sliced up my first one and using scraps I had laying around, spliced up this new one. I changed it around and spliced the pulley on the main non adjustable part, and put the ring on the adjustable knot. A new idea I picked up from Rick D up at ButcherFest. Playing around with it, I think it will work a lot better. Plus, from the looks of things, it would only take two parts of throw line to retrieve it from the ground, just like a regular friction saver.
 

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