Crossbow for line installation...

[SomethingWitty]

I'm sorry guys but like I said, I wasn't impolite to anyone except the super hateful dude that called me out to begin with.

Did I miss something??


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You were impolite to the dude that called you out to begin with. Or rather, laid out questions about the APTA.
Not the end of the world, i just wanted to point out that you didn't necessarily have to be.
I'll still send you a sticker.

Edit: this derail seems to be thread-crushing. We should get back to crossbows and aptas.

 

[bonner1040]

You were impolite to the dude that called you out to begin with. Or rather, laid out questions about the APTA.
Not the end of the world, i just wanted to point out that you didn't necessarily have to be.
I'll still send you a sticker.

Thomas is a dude with an axe to grind following me around the Internet throwing shade because we won't sell his product..




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[SomethingWitty]

Thomas is a dude with an axe to grind following me around the Internet throwing shade because we won't sell his product..




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So he should be dirty about it, if that really is what is up. I don't know him.




Has anybody experimented with a compound bow for line setting? I have one of those. I'm not really sure I want to buy a crossbow after my bigshot just laid out to rot once I learned to throw.

 

[bonner1040]

Compound bow should work!


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[RopeShield]

Thomas is a dude with an axe to grind following me around the Internet throwing shade because we won't sell his product..




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We sold RopeArmour. Luke and I. A good number of them.
You never gave it an honest chance and refused to listen to reason and science. And continue to lie in both regards.
That is why I question the Apta. You don't like the questions? Don't want to answer? Fine with me.
Doesn't matter what it is, Proknot, RA, RW, Apta or what ever, you don't like something, great, but your responsible to answer truthfully seeing your position with a large retailer.
I just ask questions and look for answers sorry its so bothersome to you.
We're not stupid and really rather not play these games.

 

[SomethingWitty]

We sold RopeArmour. Luke and I. A good number of them.
You never gave it an honest chance and refused to listen to reason and science. And continue to lie in both regards.
That is why I question the Apta. You don't like the questions? Don't want to answer? Fine with me.
Doesn't matter what it is, Proknot, RA, RW, Apta or what ever, you don't like something, great, but your responsible to answer truthfully seeing your position with a large retailer.
I just ask questions and look for answers sorry its so bothersome to you.
We're not stupid and really rather not play these games.

That does sound like an axe to grind.
Still doesn't seem like a public forum is the place to fight/fight back.
Discretion is the better part of valor, and while some dude who made a thing might look like an ass, the guy who we are familiar with still ends up looking bad.

Sorry, The Bob Weber. We broke your thread.

 

[bonner1040]

...

You can't be reasoned with and you spew propaganda and logical fallacy.

I'll let people make their own decisions about the both of us.

I've finally blocked you so in the future if you feel like your words aren't reaching me, you will be correct. You and me, we are done. Best of luck in life.


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[RopeShield]

Walk away from another conversation not going your way. Narcissistic coward

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Enough!

Besides the derail you two need to do your laundry somewhere else

 

[colb]

I just don't see how you could blow up a steel pipe with a friggin bicycle pump???

Good thing the APTA isn't made out of bicycle tire rubber...

 

[erik smith]

I am gonna say it one more time, just get the APTA and a good bicycle pump and be done with it. I live in some of the biggest timber on the planet. Most of my removals are in the 160-230 foot range, and I can easily set an top access line. I have also used the APTA for rec climbs in near 300 foot redwoods in my neck of the woods. I know most of you guys never see trees this large and tall, so the APTA is all you would ever need. It is easy to use, safe, mobile and relatively cheap. Sometimes you younger guys tend to over think this stuff.

 

[D x D]

I am gonna say it one more time, just get the APTA and a good bicycle pump and be done with it. I live in some of the biggest timber on the planet. Most of my removals are in the 160-230 foot range, and I can easily set an top access line. I have also used the APTA for rec climbs in near 300 foot redwoods in my neck of the woods. I know most of you guys never see trees this large and tall, so the APTA is all you would ever need. It is easy to use, safe, mobile and relatively cheap. Sometimes you younger guys tend to over think this stuff.

Agree. I have an APTA and like it a lot. BUT really it can shoot 300 ft? How much pressure is that and what is the weight of the throw bag you use for that height?

I have never tested the limits, but I use the 12oz bag and about 120 lbs. Seems like it goes about 100' with that which is all the tree we have around here for the most part.

BTW: I also own the rope knight too which is my goto throwing "bag". I bought it on sale on a whim one day. Glad I did. Folks that haven't tried it, and think it is "unsafe" are being pretty simple. It you cannot be smarter than your throw bag, best not to throw it.

 

[erik smith]

With a 14oz throwball I hit crotches between 150 and 200 ft daily while working and am using up to 200 psi. I have hit 250ft plus with 250+ psi. I have gone near 300 psi without dying! The key is finding the right throw line for the trees you are working with. Most the folks on this forum are never gonna work with this kind of height, so the APTA is all they would ever need. Get an APTA, hit your crotch and go about your business. Nuff said.

 

[D x D]

Wow. Thanks Erik. What do you use to get 300 psi?

 

[RopeShield]

I need that kind of a power at least monthly.
Shots need to be made to break through under-story trees then upper canopy leaves, twigs and bits and then maintain acceleration up and well past the target so that the line and wt are able to make it to the ground and over come the friction of the line crossing another dozen tree bits and finally in hand where more weight can be added to isolate a tip.

I've read through a couple of Instructables about recharging spray cans that still have contents

In both articles the authors found that the cans are pressurized to less than or around 100 psi. The cans are certified to hold close to 200 psi.

It would be way too easy to find out what the bursting point of the pipe in the APTA are rated to. Seems plenty good when faced with filling from a bike pump

What I am questioning is the added forces generated when used regularly to fire a throw bag.
The pressures created from the bag inside the cylinder. Back pressure etc This is what I need to know and understand before using it.
The manufactures of the elements that are used to make the Apta, did not design or engineer for launching.
Thus my questioning on cycles to failure, destructive testing, limitations of use, any special warnings, all things to consider.
Sorry guys if it all sounds like an axe to grind. Some of you know me and how I can overthink or complicate things.
Its good at times and times bad. Either way my intention is to shine a light.
Thanks all and especially @Tom Dunlap for your patience.

 

[erik smith]

Most of the time I use a bike pump. If I need more than 200psi (not recommended)I go to a compressor. Again it is essential to figure out what throwball and line that works best for you. It really is all about the friction of your line over your crotch. The APTA and a hitch-climber or zigzag setup have added another decade to my life climbing and wrecking large trees. Love em both.

 

[JeffGu]

The APTA can shoot a 12 oz. bag higher than I'm willing to haul my old ass up a rope, so it's a no-brainer. I still hand throw under about 40', because the APTA gets a little unpredictable when the air pressure is too low, and sometimes I actually hit what I'm aiming for at those heights by hand. I know. It usually shocks me, too. I've gotten real good at keeping a straight face and pretending I knew I would hit it on the first shot.

 

[JeffGu]

I can't help but wonder, though... am I the only one who got an APTA and decided to test it on a 30' high crotch? Pump it up to, say, 80 PSI and had it go "DONK!" and drop the bag about 3 feet in front of you? Ok, gotta pack that a little tighter... try 90 PSI... "WHAP!" and it hits the trunk a couple feet low... so, rocket scientist that I am, let's give it about 140 PSI... "BLAM!" and that sucker lands two counties away and the tail end of the throwline, and the bag it was tied to, are about 100 yards away? Ok, clearly there's an art to this thing...

It's got some recoil to it, too. More than I thought it would. Going to make a recoil pad for it, if I can just remember to do it. Little foam rubber and duct tape, nothing fancy.

 

[DSMc]

I have only had a few flubbed shots and that was only with the old ball valve. The newer butterfly valve took care of that.

My APTA gets about a foot of height per psi with a 12oz bag and 1.75 Zing-it. I will almost always set the line with more pressure then I need as an over shoot helps get the bag back down.

 

[misfit]

I can't help but wonder, though... am I the only one who got an APTA and decided to test it on a 30' high crotch? Pump it up to, say, 80 PSI and had it go "DONK!" and drop the bag about 3 feet in front of you? Ok, gotta pack that a little tighter... try 90 PSI... "WHAP!" and it hits the trunk a couple feet low... so, rocket scientist that I am, let's give it about 140 PSI... "BLAM!" and that sucker lands two counties away and the tail end of the throwline, and the bag it was tied to, are about 100 yards away? Ok, clearly there's an art to this thing...

It's got some recoil to it, too. More than I thought it would. Going to make a recoil pad for it, if I can just remember to do it. Little foam rubber and duct tape, nothing fancy.

jeffgu, I laughed at the humor in this post because I had the same experience. When I first got the APTA, I thought I would do some tests with the intent of making a table that showed that x psi would shoot y feet high. Silly me, I was expecting consistent results. Instead, I got results that were all over the place, and that is when I learned that there are more variables that affect the result than just psi. Namely, the speed and consistency with which I flip the valve. I gave it a few days of tests, but finally gave up on it, because I got more consistency with my Big Shot. I'm sure others are much better at it than I, and my hat is off to you whoever you are. But for me, my intent is to try it only if the Big Shot can't handle it.