Catalpa preservation: Historic
- Thread starter mdvaden
- Start date
treebing
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Detroit, Mi.
most earth worms are non native invasives in north america. They have been extremely detrimental in the forests around the great lakes. When introduced into a forest environment they can decompose the soil in an extremly fast rate and leave the ground completely destroyed.
I am not saying they are bad for a Catalpa tree in an urban yard. But if you are trying to replicate a North American forest environment, earth worms would not be there.
I am not saying they are bad for a Catalpa tree in an urban yard. But if you are trying to replicate a North American forest environment, earth worms would not be there.
mdvaden
Participating member
- Location
- Beaverton. Oregon
[ QUOTE ]
most earth worms are non native invasives in north america. They have been extremely detrimental in the forests around the great lakes. When introduced into a forest environment they can decompose the soil in an extremly fast rate and leave the ground completely destroyed.
I am not saying they are bad for a Catalpa tree in an urban yard. But if you are trying to replicate a North American forest environment, earth worms would not be there.
[/ QUOTE ]
I saw a show on cable tv within the past few weeks about moles. Very interesting.
Anyhow, using their front feet, they squeeze a worm's innards clean of dirt to eat them. Like squeezing a tube of toothpaste. It's really fast - they squeeze and digest the worms very quickly.
most earth worms are non native invasives in north america. They have been extremely detrimental in the forests around the great lakes. When introduced into a forest environment they can decompose the soil in an extremly fast rate and leave the ground completely destroyed.
I am not saying they are bad for a Catalpa tree in an urban yard. But if you are trying to replicate a North American forest environment, earth worms would not be there.
[/ QUOTE ]
I saw a show on cable tv within the past few weeks about moles. Very interesting.
Anyhow, using their front feet, they squeeze a worm's innards clean of dirt to eat them. Like squeezing a tube of toothpaste. It's really fast - they squeeze and digest the worms very quickly.
- Location
- 35°14\' N 80°50\' W
[ QUOTE ]
most earth worms are non native invasives in north america. They have been extremely detrimental in the forests around the great lakes. When introduced into a forest environment they can decompose the soil in an extremly fast rate and leave the ground completely destroyed.
I am not saying they are bad for a Catalpa tree in an urban yard. But if you are trying to replicate a North American forest environment, earth worms would not be there.
[/ QUOTE ]
Good post Treebing. Question -- What type of environment are we trying to produce? Is the Catalpa native to Jacksonville, OR? or is it naturalized? Is the grass native or not? By creating a natural area soil (based on parent material) will we help the invasive plants and orginisms?
I guess what is important is something each of us need to determine. For me, Education, Education, Education is important not only to our clients and our great Arborist but also to our educators. How one teaches is just as important as what one teaches. What are we trying to teach here?
It is midnight and I’m going to teach my subconscious how to fly.
UL
most earth worms are non native invasives in north america. They have been extremely detrimental in the forests around the great lakes. When introduced into a forest environment they can decompose the soil in an extremly fast rate and leave the ground completely destroyed.
I am not saying they are bad for a Catalpa tree in an urban yard. But if you are trying to replicate a North American forest environment, earth worms would not be there.
[/ QUOTE ]
Good post Treebing. Question -- What type of environment are we trying to produce? Is the Catalpa native to Jacksonville, OR? or is it naturalized? Is the grass native or not? By creating a natural area soil (based on parent material) will we help the invasive plants and orginisms?
I guess what is important is something each of us need to determine. For me, Education, Education, Education is important not only to our clients and our great Arborist but also to our educators. How one teaches is just as important as what one teaches. What are we trying to teach here?
It is midnight and I’m going to teach my subconscious how to fly.
UL
treebing
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Detroit, Mi.
Thats a good point about where does a catalpa originate and what is it like there. I think of it as sort of a western midwest tree, but I dont know. I also dont know very much about earthworms. But I do think that there is a generic idea of what good soil conditions are. this is the garden soil with lots of worms and composty. This maybe is not the ideal situation for every tree? I think of catalpa as a morere savannah like tree in which case it would be adapted to a grassy situation, i think of it maybe as liking ground where there has been a fire. These are all things that would be interesting to delve into for each specific tree rather than shooting for good gardening soil. That is a cool tree. I have a few favorite catalpas around here. Half dead things but remarkable ability to just start another tree and keep going. Its like they can die way back in the lean times but restart again when things get right.
Treebing you are correct that earthworms are not inheriently good for every soil or tree. In argriculture there are some concerns that excessive macropores lead to water movement too deep into soils (away from roots). In natural systems, around the great lakes, we see earth worms invading forests, eating the duff layer and a consequent loss of regeneration of plants, particularly spring ephemerals. We can also see loss of regeneration of certain duff-dependent species of trees. In urban areas Norway Maples can easily become the dominate species.
As for grass, clearly some trees and grass occur together in select natural ecosystems. The classifications that come to mind are prairies, savanas, (oak) parklands and alvars. In each case the types of grasses tending to be dominated by clumbing grasses. Typical lawns are composed of grasses that are creeping and replicate from extensive tillers. These grasses are grown for that reason, they are highly competitive, clumping grasses leave large spaces between clumps.
Grass becomes a further problem in that its culture is generally bad for trees; no duff layer, excessive fertilizers, syntethic pesticides, and shallow watering.
As for grass, clearly some trees and grass occur together in select natural ecosystems. The classifications that come to mind are prairies, savanas, (oak) parklands and alvars. In each case the types of grasses tending to be dominated by clumbing grasses. Typical lawns are composed of grasses that are creeping and replicate from extensive tillers. These grasses are grown for that reason, they are highly competitive, clumping grasses leave large spaces between clumps.
Grass becomes a further problem in that its culture is generally bad for trees; no duff layer, excessive fertilizers, syntethic pesticides, and shallow watering.
From what I have seen with most of the construction sites that have had our company come in clear out a lot, then trim trees they wish to "keep" on top of putting up fencing to keep the large equipment from packing down the dirt or running into the trees don't actually seem to care what they are told. So far all the sites thet we have worked on when we return to improve the view for the windows on the houses we see that all the fencing is taken down dirt is pushed up around all of the "trees we wan't to keep", and the trees have huge wounds from the machinery running into them. I can't understand why they bother asking for the advice to begin with. So we are forced to be climbers anyway when we have to come back and take down the trees they wanted to save that are now dead.
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