ATV's a thing of the past

[tnttree]

ATV\'s a thing of the past

Up here in Minnesota Land of innovation, I know of eight Tree Companies that have moth balled or sold their ATVs in favor of using Mini Skid Loaders. Ive been using minis since 98, their simple, economical, and they work like 3 strong groundseys movin logs and feeding the chipper. I also have the only chipper I know of that carries one of my minis - saving me the cost of a pickup and trailer chasing that crew. How many of you are still using ATVs? How many of you have made the next step to Minis? Check out the attached pictures. /forum/images/graemlins/cool.gif or Tree stories on my Website www.topnotchequipment.com

 

[tophopper]

Re: ATV\'s a thing of the past

top of the mornin to ya Dave!

Ya know Im a big fan of the the mini skids and all they can do, but I wont be giving up my ATV anytime soon. To me each piece of equipment has its value according to each job. I will readily admit my mini sees much more job time than my atv (probably 80 % of the time), however there are certain times when only the atv will work, and on some occasions Ive utilized both pieces on a jobsite. One in particular, removing some diseased oaks from a steep terrained and wooded back yard with a 4" layer of snow-most of the trees were floppers and when dropped all of the tip ends of the tree land outside the wooded area on the turf, but the trunk wood had to be accessed down thru the thick woods. The mini skid could only manuever down into the wooded area, but could could not carry out loads due to the slippery terrain. The atv with log cart in tow would then also be positioned in the wooded area, where the mini skid(with very limited manueverablity) would then lift and load the logs onto the log cart behind the atv, when loaded, the atv would then go tearin' out of the thick woods and logs forwarded to the curb. The process repeated several times until all logs hauled out, then the atv was used to tow out the mini skid, where it too proceeded to the curb to LOAD all of those logs into the truck.
I do strongly agree with much of your statement, in that, they are very simple,econmical, and they ARE like running 3 groundies for movin material, loading, and feeding the chipper. But they do have some limitations.
To me, the mini skid is not a suitable "replacement" for the atv, but rather a very good complimenting piece of equipment, having both gives me the edge on many other companies who do not.
Ill add this too- my back feels much better since Ive started running a mini /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[tnttree]

Re: ATV\'s a thing of the past

Thanks John -- you just like havin that ol ATV for weekend horseplay. Your right we still have an ATV for those steeper terrain jobs or long drags where speed kicks the Minis 3 miles an hour. ATVs are real time savers on Condo jobs where you gotta cover a lot of ground prunin shrubs or small trees. The minni still does all the removals. We won't sell our ATV even though it sits at the shop most of the time.

 

[tophopper]

Re: ATV\'s a thing of the past

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks John -- you just like havin that ol ATV for weekend horseplay.

[/ QUOTE ]


Haha- funny thing is... the mini get played with more on the weekends than the ATV. Atv great for ice fishing though, the thought of an ice auger mounted to the mini has crossed my mind but it would take all day to drive it out there unless I trailered it the whole way.

Got any pics of your new stump grinding attachment, there has been discusion here before about the existing models out there and the problems with them.

Post a pic if you have one, id love to see it!!

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Re: ATV\'s a thing of the past

I think that in a head to head trial I could move more wood in a shorter time with my setup than a mini. BUT...if the work includes lifting/loading the mini would win. The ground speed with a load and for sure when empty, of the quad will give it an edge. I had work-arounds that made up for the lack of lifting. It did take a bit more time. Since I had the quad I stayed with it.

After owning a quad for years, I only drove it for play on two weekends. I don't like noise toise, er noys toys.

There are a couple of really clever forklift attachments for quads. If someone had a quad and didn't want to spend the money for another specialized piece of equipment, these would make the quad even more valuable.

Look at the Norwood Multimate: http://www.norwoodindustries.com/multimate.htm

The Skidmate is one of the most clever log arches: http://www.norwoodindustries.com/skidmate.htm

These guys make a bucket/grapple:

http://www.westendorfmfg.com/

 

[Teti]

Re: ATV\'s a thing of the past

When we did the tree top casino for Viva la Bam we used our atv's for just about everything.From skidding the logs to the sight and hauling gear.We even esed the atv winches to set the logs.The only problem was it turned the sight into a huge mudpit 1 to 2 feet deep. They brought in a skid steer to clear the mud so they could film.

 

[tnttree]

Re: ATV\'s won\'t run a stumper, rake is ready

Still working out the bugs on the stumper, I'll publish it once it can Match or exceed the eficiancy of the ray junior. All the stumpers on the market are using Hydraulic motors to run the grinding wheel theres simply not enough Hydraulic Horsepower to grind Stumps -- Reports on the Toro one sucks, Terra powers is cute and compact when I tested it, it was simply to slow. The only stump attachment that is using a separate engine to power the cutting wheel is a kanga. I have not located one in the states, I did get a quote on one from our affiliate Thomas dealer in Austrailia $12,500us no wonder no ones got one around here. I plan to use a 31HP Generac engine spinning a 20" X 3/4" Disc with greenteeth designed by Kevin Green. I hope I can produce them for Market for around 8large we'll see.
Plan is to unveil at TCIA in Columbus.

Hey check out my this 6' wide rake/broom recievered into my Grapple, its awsome.

Dave the tree guy

 

[frans]

Re: ATV\'s won\'t run a stumper, rake is ready

Hey Dave,
Is there any way to hype up the hyd. and achieve a much greater hyd. flow?
Frans

 

[tnttree]

Re: ATV\'s and arches vs mini loaders

In a race the Quad will win every time, Jim Steele and I built Log & Brush archs back in the mid 90's. I even built a Hwy towable Arch that carrys the Atv to the Job site. The archs are great married to an ATV for long distant hauls. The thing that I didn't like about archs is backing them up to the piles (excess traffic on the damn lawn), chokering the load, and trailering them to the jobsite.
I wish I could get more tree jobs that didn'nt involve lifting and loading and even in a large backyard removal The mini will be long down the road to the next job before the ATV catchs up.

You know Jimmy Steele was one of the first guys that I know of to use a quad in treework way years before you and I bought one, Remember the Suzuki King Quad? the only machine with 4 Wheel suspension and a super low 4 wheel posi-traction. They were awesome draggers.
Jim's also one of the first guys I know of to run a miniloader, and you know he sold his Quad long ago.

Tom you gotta try one of these new Mini's there unbelievable, drive right in, grab brush or logs, Cruize out at a brisk walk and feed your chipper or load your trailer. Not to mention versatility in attachments that auger planting holes, carry 500# BB's, rake the yard in 6' swaths, split wood, Hydraulicly winch loads up ravines, and hopefully a practical small stumper.

I beleive as more and more arborists try these things there goin get real popular.

I wont sell my Atv it still has its applications, just alot fewer now that I have 3 mini's in my tool box.

I sold a grapple to a Bob at Coastal Tree in Conneticut, he just got his 1st mini - he says he can't stop smil'in, feels like I'm cheat'in. his caption with the picture he sent was "thing has balls!"

Minis are the cheapest groundsman you'll ever hire. /forum/images/graemlins/applaudit.gif

 

[tnttree]

Re: ATV\'s won\'t run a stumper, rake is ready

Bigger engines? Man I ain't no engineer so that question gos beyond my expertise. A lot of these engineers buildin attachments are not tree guys. I'm workin with an engineer on my stumper so it'll stay together for the long haul. You know the guys brilliant but he doesn't have a clue on how a person grinds a stump.
I couldn't find any decent tree attachments when I started running Minis, so I built my own and let my crews test them there the best critics, you know what they love its the grapple. Engineers and sales guys should go out and do tree work
B4 they recommend or try to build somthing.
Check out cool pic of thomas & hyd stumper, ck out the stump -- Ive got about 10 minutes into a 10 inch elm stump /forum/images/graemlins/9lame.gif painfully slow But it looks cool!

Just grit your teeth and go buy a mini you won't be sorry, I guarantee that it'll pay its way.

Dave, just another tree guy

 

[Mangoes]

Re: ATV\'s won\'t run a stumper, rake is ready

Iwas thinking today (remarkable I know) a second engine would add bulk so smaller would be better. Would you be able to set up a high speed cutter head, powered by a chainsaw (where have we seen this?)(088)and subsiquently manipulated by hydraulics?

 

[tnttree]

Re: ATV\'s won\'t run a stumper, rake is ready

I was one of the bone heads that bought a Husky (chainsaw) Stump grinder years ago, lots of speed no mass or power though ground kinda was like runnin a sander on a stump. well not really that bad but pretty bad. Not sure but I think any time you convert Engine HP to Hydraulic HP you lose HP everytime. Thats why I am explorin Direct drive it is bulky though, but you know what it grinds stumps.

 

[tnttree]

Re: Log Arch carries ATV

Tom what you think of this Arch, It carrys the ATV, once you get the jobsite its large enough to choke big piles of brush or big logs and cart it out. Call me lazy . . . I'd still rather use my Mini.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Re: Log Arch carries ATV

I remember seeing it going down the road one day. I'm sure it would work. My preference would be to have one that isn't any wider than the quad. I had a small trailer [Steele has it now] that would take the quad to the jobs. then I had Jim's old collapsible arch. Cheap and easy.

There's no doubt that the minis are the way to go if a person were looking for one machine for treework. Seeing Jim wheel his around is like watching a ballet. But, if someone has a quad for play it can be setup to do treework. That way a person would have a two-fer. Much cheaper too. Like a lot of decisions it comes down to value. Sometime spending more money is the best value. Others spending a dollar more is a waste.

The logs in the pic are basswood. I don't know how much they weighed. The arch comes apart at the red arrows. There is a 2" receiver tube at the yellow arrow. The arch would slip into a trailer hitch reciever for transport.

 

[frans]

Re: Log Arch carries ATV

[ QUOTE ]
Like a lot of decisions it comes down to value. Sometime spending more money is the best value. Others spending a dollar more is a waste.

[/ QUOTE ]

I really like your wise words, Tom. Words to live by.

Now where was that Harbor Freight store? /forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Frans

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Re: Log Arch carries ATV

That's a chuckle, HF

There are some products that are environmentally criminal. The Earth would be better off if the minerals would have been left in the ground. Most of the HF stuff fits this bill. There are a very few things that are worth picking up at HF. Low price and low value for the most part.

 

[Mangoes]

Re: ATV\'s won\'t run a stumper, rake is ready

I've heard those hushy unit weren't very good. I was more refering to the Alpine Magnum unit, not that I know if it is any better. Better? Anyone?

 

[tnttree]

Re: Log Arch carries ATV

You still have Jimmys collapsable? -- that guys pretty ingenuis (butchered spelling I'm sure). My Atv carrier was awful tongue heavy and wide but it worked for a while.

 

[tnttree]

Re: ATV\'s won\'t run a stumper, rake is ready

Havn't seen it

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Re: ATV\'s won\'t run a stumper, rake is ready

The company that I used to work for had a portable stump grinder called a "Jorge" that was powered by an 088 Stihl. The cutting teeth looked like huge, carbide tipped, chainsaw teeth. The units are brutally heavy but they can get to jobs that are inaccessible. Certainly not as quick as a wheeled unit though.

Steele's arch went into scrap recycling when I moved. I could only move so much stuff. No one I talked to could use it.