Russia invades Ukraine

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If anyone is tired of the sanitized news media reporting on Ukraine, gritty footage from the ground level can be dug up by searching YouTube and then going to Filters / Sort By / Upload Date. Ukrainian search terms will pull up a lot: "боротьба" (fighting in Ukranian), "танк" (tank), солдати (soldiers), стрільба (shooting), російська армія (Russian army), полонений (captive), etc.
 
Daniel said:
this is from a facebook post, sounds good, but unconfirmed:

Tom Mills
Sorry there is some great points made with the analogies but way more than Russia just being a bully going on here! We as USA/nato have put 5 billion in arms in that country in last 6 months and been running our mouths just like we did when Obama was in office the left has a problem with Russia and want them destroyed because they don’t play along so much more going on here that spousal abuse theories.USA and the left are the bullies and the dam nazi yes actually nazi’s in Ukraine don’t believe me go look it up.
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Bucknut said:
This situation is starting to scare me - and I’m fearless. ;)

Politics aside, I’m wondering if Putin is healthy. Many of you have probably seen this tweet by Marco Rubio, who happens to be the ranking Republican member of the Senate Intelligence Committee:

View attachment 80531

I read this as we have intelligence that Putin is either mentally declining or has some serious (and perhaps terminal) physical ailment. This would explain the hurried, sudden nature of these developments. He may have limited time to achieve what he has always seen as his destiny- the re-unification and restoration of Russia to its former “glory”.

Although it is very early yet, this offensive does not seem to be going as well as he might have hoped. I just don’t see him accepting defeat. So he will likely be desperate. A desperate madman with thermobaric and nuclear weapons.

We have so few good options. No one has the appetite for a ground war against Russia- in Russia. But if he keeps going, what’s to be done? Sanctions will take months or years to be effective. What if he seeks to re-incorporate Kaliningrad? Gotta go through NATO states to do it. Then we are technically obligated to respond.

Many observers have noted the similarities to Hitler’s actions. But Hitler didn’t have nuclear ICBMs. I’m certain WW2 would have ended very differently if he did. Sorry for the rant.
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Coming from Marco Rubio I'm highly skeptical. The political interests on the U.S. conservative right are looking for a way to "gracefully" resolve their former (and in some cases continuing) support of Putin with his current actions in Ukraine. It is from the NRA's mass shootings playbook, "Too many military-style guns in the hands of Americans are not the problem, mental health is". Likewise Putin suddenly becoming mentally unstable provides a nice escape hatch from their leadership and political responsibilities.

Despite attempts to blame Biden for Russia's new war, Putin is very much in charge of the situation regardless of who the American president was or is. This is part of a long-haul Kremlin strategy to regain strategic dominance in Eastern Europe. Trump was docile and fawning at Putin's feet, did nothing to deter his ambitions. The Biden administration's recent "intelligence sharing" strategy was effective at setting Putin off-balance and forced him to look foolish (or mentally unstable depending on how you want your spin to go) when he attempted to rationalize the invasion.

Right-leaning/autocratic leaders worldwide (Bolsonaro, Le Pen etc.) are bending over backwards right now to justify their miscalculations around their professed Putin love. "Mentally unstable" is their best excuse right now.
-AJ
 
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Sticky wicket for the predicted Republican rebound in the upcoming mid-term elections. If there is a successful resolution for Ukraine as a result of the combined efforts of European nations as well as the U.S. and other democratic international powers, it could put a dent in the GOP's plan. They're putting all their eggs in one basket by blaming Putin's actions on Biden. If the ad hoc international coalition is successful Mitch McConnell, Kevin McCarthy et al will be eating dog food after November 2022.
-AJ
 
I am not impressed that the majority of responses around this evolving situation are more concerned about being 'right' than anything else.

Understanding the past and how it shaped any current situation is all well and good, but it has limited ability to address the present.
 
DSMc said:
I am not impressed that the majority of responses around this evolving situation are more concerned about being 'right' than anything else.

Understanding the past and how it shaped any current situation is all well and good, but it has limited ability to address the present.
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Typical human problem, we make the mistake of identifying with our conclusions then defend them into absurdity.
-AJ
 
Welp, Russian nukes are on high alert. A nuclear waist plant was hit with a missile. The northern advance has stalled outside Kyiv (or just holding the line waiting for troops from the east and south, or the airport to be taken). Thermobaric weapons confirmed inside Ukraine (perfect tool for killing people underground). 2/3rds of amassed Russian forces inside of Ukraine.
This is not going to be a quick war, this is not going to be a simple war.
 
moss said:
Sticky wicket for the predicted Republican rebound in the upcoming mid-term elections. If there is a successful resolution for Ukraine as a result of the combined efforts of European nations as well as the U.S. and other democratic international powers, it could put a dent in the GOP's plan. They're putting all their eggs in one basket by blaming Putin's actions on Biden. If the ad hoc international coalition is successful Mitch McConnell, Kevin McCarthy et al will be eating dog food after November 2022.
-AJ
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Yes to all this. That's still better than what they deserve to eat.
 
Respectfully disagree. People will almost always vote their wallets. Inflation at a 40 year high. Gas at an 8 year high, as best I can tell. Up 40% from 2020 alone.

BTW, there is a relevant correlation here. In 2008 oil prices hit about $150 a barrel. Putin took Georgia. In 2014 oil was $100 per barrel. Putin took Crimea. Then we had the fracking revolution which began under Obama (despite his opposition) and continued under Trump. Not a peep from Vlad.

Then on day ONE of his presidency our brain damaged leader decided that energy independence is stupid and cancelled the Keystone XL. Barely a year later and shockingly oil prices have risen sharply. (Some of you that run businesses may have noticed this). Oil is nearing $100 again, and Putin wants Ukraine.

But it’s worse that that. Because the preferred drug of all politicians is power, Biden is trying to have it both ways. He would like to be seen as harsh on Russia, but sympathetic to the American gas buyer. So he claims we are levying the harshest sanctions in history against Putin while at the same time we are still buying oil from Russia. Yeah- we’re actually funding Vlad’s “Special Military Operation”. Pathetic.

We’ve gotten soft in the west. We virtue signal about climate change and preen about the Green New Deal because our peaceful and relatively opulent lifestyle allows us the freedom to worry about such things. We cancel vital pipelines and Germany shutters its nuclear plants in favor of near total reliance on Putin for its energy. What could go wrong? Meantime Putin drills and pumps and fracks away, happy to sell us the energy we pretend we are too good to dirty our hands to get for ourselves. And happy to gain the leverage he needs to gain control over Europe.

Eventually we will all realize that oil is life. Without it advanced civilization dies. No transportation, no electricity, no water. Someday electricity may supplant gas, but today is not that day.

Maybe ask a random sampling of Ukrainians where climate change ranks on their list of concerns.
 
Bucknut said:
Respectfully disagree. People will almost always vote their wallets. Inflation at a 40 year high. Gas at an 8 year high, as best I can tell. Up 40% from 2020 alone.

BTW, there is a relevant correlation here. In 2008 oil prices hit about $150 a barrel. Putin took Georgia. In 2014 oil was $100 per barrel. Putin took Crimea. Then we had the fracking revolution which began under Obama (despite his opposition) and continued under Trump. Not a peep from Vlad.

Then on day ONE of his presidency our brain damaged leader decided that energy independence is stupid and cancelled the Keystone XL. Barely a year later and shockingly oil prices have risen sharply. (Some of you that run businesses may have noticed this). Oil is nearing $100 again, and Putin wants Ukraine.

But it’s worse that that. Because the preferred drug of all politicians is power, Biden is trying to have it both ways. He would like to be seen as harsh on Russia, but sympathetic to the American gas buyer. So he claims we are levying the harshest sanctions in history against Putin while at the same time we are still buying oil from Russia. Yeah- we’re actually funding Vlad’s “Special Military Operation”. Pathetic.

We’ve gotten soft in the west. We virtue signal about climate change and preen about the Green New Deal because our peaceful and relatively opulent lifestyle allows us the freedom to worry about such things. We cancel vital pipelines and Germany shutters its nuclear plants in favor of near total reliance on Putin for its energy. What could go wrong? Meantime Putin drills and pumps and fracks away, happy to sell us the energy we pretend we are too good to dirty our hands to get for ourselves. And happy to gain the leverage he needs to gain control over Europe.

Eventually we will all realize that oil is life. Without it advanced civilization dies. No transportation, no electricity, no water. Someday electricity may supplant gas, but today is not that day.

Maybe ask a random sampling of Ukrainians where climate change ranks on their list of concerns.
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No doubt the wallet is a big factor. Hmm... why then is the GOP leaning so hard on "Biden f'd up?"if everything is going their way?
-AJ
 
moss said:
No doubt the wallet is a big factor. Hmm... why then is the GOP leaning so hard on "Biden f'd up?"if everything is going their way?
-AJ
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My guess is that everything is going their way because Biden f’d up.
 
I don’t know that they are, any more than an opposition party otherwise would be. But if they are, it’s likely for the exact reason the left whines (incessantly) about Trump. Perceived utter incompetence.
 
Bucknut said:
I don’t know that they are, any more than an opposition party otherwise would be. But if they are, it’s likely for the exact reason the left whines (incessantly) about Trump. Perceived utter incompetence.
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Trump's recent admiring statements about Putin are whine-worthy fer sure ;-) I've never understood what planet he's on. He is consistently weird.
-AJ
 
moss said:
Trump's recent admiring statements about Putin are whine-worthy fer sure ;-) I've never understood what planet he's on. He is consistently weird.
-AJ
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I’d agree. Trump simply doesn’t know when to shut up. EVER.

But each team has morons. May be worth noting that ole Mitt was sooooo right back in 2012:

Obama’s zinger didn’t age too well.
 
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