Women in trees, here's your enemy.

macswan said:
I believe that Riggs is very knowledgable cuz a lot of people I respect tell me he is, but i have never witnessed him post anything useful on here. Not saying it hasn't happened, just that I have haven't seen it in my time. So I respond to the things I do see him post, which generally are denigrating to some minority(majority, women) or other. And I don't appreciate. I generally am trying to keep it all in good fun. But sometimes I do get angry, which is also fun, in a different way.
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Mac don't talk smack , you jumped on me every post I ever made and I don't know you . What ever you have to do , own up to it . I tell all young people , that accountability and reliability are the key .Own up to you first jamming on me , because don't worry about who I am or What I've done , do half of it and you'll be ok . Step up , mouth , don't back pedal , you are so full of Sh*t. You have more to learn kid than you know . John Wayne said " don't piss down my back and say it's raining " Keep playing with that landscape trailer tree man named Tom , you'll get far . And as far as woman go , I've seen three woman in my life climb trees for money in the Philadelphia area in my whole life . I've seen many climb rocks , some were awesome . I am not against women , so shut your trap. Think your climbing new school . don't forget the people who laid the foundation for the acceptable way you are climbing today . Punk . Make your names fellas , but back em up ! Arm chair arborist , that's awesome. Jealous ? EZ - Love that guy , shows up like Jesse and Al . Can't wait to see women in trees , only see them at the ITCC and they are from another country , except the 2 or three
 
I Wouldn't have any smack to talk if you talked about trees bub, just like I always said. It's when you start spouting ignorant racist, or just plain mean spirited tripe that I jump on you. I don't know you. I only know what I read from you on this. And it has NEVER been anything but full of shit. Calls em like I sees em. You should post more about trees. I get the impression you are knowledgable. I cast no aspersions on your fitness as a tree worker. I own every post I make. Good, bad, or ugly. I am not back pedaling, merely stating facts.

Nobody thinks you wanna work with women, cuz your post said you didn't want women to apply. That's yours, I didn't put that on you. You own that.
 
Companies that won't even interview women are in direct conflict with women trying to enter our industry. It's an uphill battle for women that want to be professional arborists, and these companies stand in ther way. Women should know who these companies are. What's 'low' is the OP.

Tom
 
tomthetreeman said:
Companies that won't even interview women are in direct conflict with women trying to enter our industry. It's an uphill battle for women that want to be professional arborists, and these companies stand in ther way. Women should know who these companies are. What's 'low' is the OP.

Tom
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Got some photos of your top big take down female climbers, Tom?

Bet you don't.

Got a 'secret' policy, maybe?

Is the ITCC policy of having male and female divisions sexist?
 
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TreeCo said:
Got some photos of your top big take down female climbers, Tom?

Bet you don't.
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Oaky, that's just stupid. So in order to have a place in arboriculture you have to be able to do a HUGE removal? There are women that can do that. I know of some on the west coast as well as here in New England. But what about the ability of a women to do the job differently and accomplish the same outcome. There is far more to arboriculture than just removals.
Here in New England we have very talented female climbers who have had to struggle to get to where they are. I have competed with them in many competitions and can argue that they add a lot of value to the crews they work for. They are huge assets to the crews. Times are changing. I would rather work beside a qualified employee that can accomplish the job not matter their sex, religion, skin color etc. That is what is great about arboriculture. When we all show up everyday we have one thing in common, we all care about trees and enjoy working with them. Why should anyone be excluded from that!
 
ROYCE said:
Oaky, that's just stupid. So in order to have a place in arboriculture you have to be able to do a HUGE removal? There are women that can do that. I know of some on the west coast as well as here in New England. But what about the ability of a women to do the job differently and accomplish the same outcome. There is far more to arboriculture than just removals.
Here in New England we have very talented female climbers who have had to struggle to get to where they are. I have competed with them in many competitions and can argue that they add a lot of value to the crews they work for. They are huge assets to the crews. Times are changing. I would rather work beside a qualified employee that can accomplish the job not matter their sex, religion, skin color etc. That is what is great about arboriculture. When we all show up everyday we have one thing in common, we all care about trees and enjoy working with them. Why should anyone be excluded from that!
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Is the ITCC policy of having male and female divisions sexist?
 
TreeCo said:
Got some photos of your top big take down female climbers, Tom?

Bet you don't.

Got a 'secret' policy, maybe?

Is the ITCC policy of having male and female divisions sexist?
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You know what else pisses me off about this post. You imply that ALL women cannot accomplish a HUGE takedown... Like ALL men can. I have met many of men who have come to work with and for me and couldn't hang at my pace. I have trained these men to get into trees only to find they are scared.
 
Comparing a climbing comp to the workplace is a farce, but if we must, the best AR I have ever seen was by a female climber (same scenario as the guys btw). What's the difference between men's and women's footlock times? A couple seconds? That'll really kill production! Throw line? Have you ever watched Bear Levangie? But really, the comp events don't mirror production tree work, so the fact that the women generally can't hang with the top men is pretty irrelevant overall.

Until opportunities exist for women in our industry, there will be fewer women in our industry. There would be more kickass girls in the field if they had a shot. Like Royce said, we know a few around here. Hopefully with the right opportunities there will be more someday soon.

Tom
 
I have and do employ women (climber and groundie), minorities and people over 40. The question here is not whether I currently have any female climbers, but whether or not I am open to doing so, therefore providing the opportunity. Do you have anything to say with regard to my previous comment about why there are so few qualified females in our industry? Do you agree or disagree that if we as tree care companies deny women the opportunity, the number of women in arboriculture will stay low?
 
tomthetreeman said:
I have and do employ women (climber and groundie), minorities and people over 40. The question here is not whether I currently have any female climbers, but whether or not I am open to doing so, therefore providing the opportunity. Do you have anything to say with regard to my previous comment about why there are so few qualified females in our industry? Do you agree or disagree that if we as tree care companies deny women the opportunity, the number of women in arboriculture will stay low?
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I question your premise that the number of women is arboriculture is low because they are not provided the opportunity.

Genetic differences between the male and female of our species is the major factor.

Do you see the Pioneer plaque as sexist? Or does it present a reality?

Pioneer plaque.webp
 
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Thanks for answering the question. It sounds like you don't completely disagree, you just question the premise. Fair enough.

As far as genetic difference, there are of course far more men physically qualified or inclined to this type of work, but the number of women in the industry doesn't mirror the number of qualified candidates and women that would like to or have tried to get into the industry and have been denied the opportunity.

Your assertion that implying that women can do tree work somehow makes seeing our physical differences as sexist is a stretch.

Tom
 
tomthetreeman said:
Your assertion that implying that women can do tree work somehow makes seeing our physical differences as sexist is a stretch.

Tom
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Talk about stretching............ I've not asserted that implying that women can do tree work somehow makes seeing out physical difference as sexism.

I don't believe the plaque is sexist as all. It is realistic.

So is Riggs' help wanted ad.

Riggs ad is almost as bad as your righteous indignation over his it. Not quite, but almost.
 
So when you asked if ISA's policy of women's and men's comps separate is sexist (to me), you weren't implying that?

When you asked if I thought the plaque was sexist (to me), you weren't implying that?

Tell me what you meant with those questions, if it was something else.

You confuse righteous indignation with a rational challenge to a basically illegal help wanted ad. Yes, I feel strongly about the subject. Many others do too. We are not righteously indignant, we are trying to affect change in an industry we love. You can be part of the problem or part of the solution. I know where I stand.
 
tomthetreeman said:
So when you asked if ISA's policy of women's and men's comps separate is sexist (to me), you weren't implying that?

When you asked if I thought the plaque was sexist (to me), you weren't implying that?

Tell me what you meant with those questions, if it was something else.
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I was asking you if you though they were sexist. I don't believe they are.

You are displaying righteous indignation by seeing a problem with a mostly male dominated arboriculture work force where there is none.

Nursing is mostly female dominated. Is that because of illegal help wanted ads?

Or is it because males aren't trying to get into the field?

Face it, very few females are trying to get into the day to day grind of doing the manual labor on a tree crew. Sales positions and IPM positions they likely are.......but that is not what the ad under discussion is for.
 
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