oak borer killing tree?

[adam12]

ok... excellent... a few more responses before "hatchet day" All seen to agree that removal seperated from heartwood is a good idea... either that, or I am the guinea-pig for a grand conspiratorial experiment Either way... I'm sure the tree wont survive without intervention... so...

In reply to others since my last post...

DSMc... the affected bark above the original wound (see pics at my post on 3/13 at 9:44pm) hasnt had a chance to start "curling" inward, since the progression of the fungal/insect affliction is continually spreading. What I will say, is that the areas of bark towards the center of the area of bark seperation and closer to the original wound are very much dried out... so... dead... I will use care and much observation when hacking out the areas that are close to the boundry of bark seperation. (lol...by hacking, I mean I am using a very small, carefully controlled hatchet... not a splitting maul. )

guymayor... yeah, I've learned that the infestation is probably a secondary result of, at least, the original wound (also shown in the above mentioned pics) and either the result of additional stress by either a lightning strike or what you are thinking is some other form of infection. I will say that, if you go back and look at all of the photos I attached, you will see that the major affliction as well as the black, burnt-looking legions do not extend as far as ground level. The data I am using to assess the idea of a lightning strike with is at your fingertips.. the pics posted on 3/13 at 9:38pm.. and I will mention that there a few of those type marks, each of them similar in size (see the holly leaf in lower pic @3/13-9:38), extruding from a small hole in the bark, and within apprx 3-4 feet of the ground level. Does this sound more, or less, like what you are thinking? I will check the link you offered shortly. Either way.. if you are coming out this way in about a month, I'd be very grateful for a eyes-and-hands-on... please keep an eye on this forum as the time gets closer, and maybe we can talk about a visit when that time draws nearer.. You say "up" for a visit, and at about three hours away... coming from N. Carolina, or more out towards Roanoke?

JP (aka treesandsurf)... thanxx for keeping an eye on this forum... appreciate it... the nematodes sound like the possible next step I will take after stripping the dead bark and bagging the questionable anomolies and having them analyzed. The idea of injecting a microscopic parasite into the holes to kill the bugs does sound very cool. I worked at a big tree nurserey for a couple of years (Watkins, in Midlothian, Va), and they used certain wasps as predators for certain other pests that were detrimental to the trees and shrubs... lol... unfortunately, they still could sting people! But yeah... the idea of microscopic predators that only kill the pests is extremely interesting. I just hope they die afterwards... my well is close by, and I've heard funny things about nemotodes and drinking water. Mahalo, Brah!

Ok... bottom line.. removal of dead, or seperated and failing, bark will commence tomorrow afternoon. Last call for anyone who strongly disagrees with this or anything else. After, and during, that, I will take photos of whatever I find... bugs, rot, whatever looks weird... bag specimens for analysis, then, for the moment, apply the tincture that "Dirt Doctor" suggests for open, barkless areas(see link posted on 3/13 - 9:52pm) ... then apply 10-10-10 and apprx 4" of mulch out to the drip-line.

I'm really liking this whole thing... maybe I should work towards being an arborist... or an archeologist... I'm not sure... keep you all informed asap.. And thanxx again to all for your excellent help and advice.

You all have quotes affixed to your signatures... so here's mine... for this situation...

Conquest is easy. Control is not.
~Kirk, "Mirror, Mirror"
stardate unknown

lol...

or maybe this...

Do not follow where the path may lead. Go instead where there is no path and leave a trail.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson


Soon,

~Adam

 

[guymayor]

I would not use a hatchet; claw hammer is my tool of choice. tap, listen for hollow sound, gently pull off dead bark, being VERY careful not to pull off living bark.

lookin fwd to pics after wound is exposed.

 

[adam12]

sorry guys... have to put off the bark peeling for a day. Had to work late and it's getting too dark. Hopefully just a one day delay, it may rain tomorrow afternoon as well.

~A

 

[adam12]

yep... it's raining... one more day to wait.. apologies again. Hope I dont lose any of you guys interest in the meantime. No rain OR late work forecast for tomorrow.

 

[adam12]

Rain's all gone, no late work... so, I got the bark off. The pic is attached and I made this one bigger so that it might be looked at closer.

As I was removing the dead bark, starting at the lower center of the affected area and carefully working upwards and outwards, I began to run into bark which was a mixture of living and dead as I got to the outer edges of the seperation. I'd have to assume that it was dying as well, but I didnt go much further. This did uncover all of the area that was infested and seperated from the heartwood, except for the area just to the lower left of the removal area. As the attached pic mentions, I am making a seperate reply to post a view of this from a side angle, so as to show that condition... which is that the bark on that side seems to be living and healthy, with the exception of a handful of larger, older looking bore holes but the galleries have continued in that direction. I suppose I shouldnt remove that bark... maybe this would be a good place to use the nematodes?

I'm going to submit this now and start resizing the other pics and reply... send that in a few minutes...

 

[adam12]

The pic I am attaching is a composite of a few pics pasted on one image. The first is the sideview of the area I mentioned above, which appears to be healthy (the edges of some of it in the older wound area have healed a bit) but you'll see that the galleries continue beneath it. Judging by the barely hollow sound ( I say barely because the bark is so thick) I'd say that the extension of those galleries cover an additional area of about 14"x14".

The second pic below that shows a typical view of what I saw while I was removing bark. Just below the bark was a layer of reddish to nearly black rotting or "eaten" wood that resembled a fine mulch....very moist. Once past that, particularly the lower areas, had a few layers of dead heartwood with galleries between them. I removed only what was definately dead. Along the way, the majority of what I found in the way of insects, were different maturities of the bug that I showed a picture of about half way back up the forum. These appeared mostly in the rotting area just below the bark.

As I got into dead heartwood, again only stuff that was definately dead, I found ants between gallery walls... the third pic shows them. Some of them got to be quite large with huge jaws. They were all in tight, large groups, and had a few pea-sized holes going deeper, straight into the heartwood. I'm wondering if there are more of them under that area of healthy bark on the left side, as this is where they appeared. Aside from that, I found a few caterpillars digging around as well. I have samples of a few of each thing that I found. They dont like me much, because they are alive, ziplocked, and living in the fridge until I get analysis.

Again, I know the insects are probably a secondary factor of whatever the primary stress on the tree is, but while I'm trying to nurture the health of the tree, these buggers need to go.

So now... in the mean time, what are anyone's thoughts on the exposed area?

The "Dirt Doctor" guy I have mentioned suggests this:
"Mix 1/3 of each in water and paint on trunks: diatomaceous earth, soft rock phosphate, manure compost . Paint onto cuts, borer holes or other injuries on trunks or limbs. Reapply if washed off by rain or irrigation ..."

 

[guymayor]

nice work; looks like you were cautious enough and did not break boundaries. good luck with the bugs; care for the roots.

 

[Cyrus1254]

After reading the posts here please mulch this tree out to the drip line. I hope you have not fertilized the tree with what guy said since 10-10-10 doesnt do a thing for the tree but it is great for the grass and unfortunately it wont do thing for the tree since it has no beneficial organisms. If you are close enough to Richmond call one of the local tree companies in that neck of the woods and they should be able to help you out with that tree and help save it and it should thrive for years to come.

 

[adam12]

thanxx, Cyrus, for the reply. I appreciate anyone who would take the time to read over what is becoming a forum that I would consider to be a bit long... that plus the fact that I can be quite long winded.

What I am hoping for at this point, is anyones input on what I should do, if anything, with the exposed area where I peeled off the dead bark, as well as the area of galleries that extend beneath the thick living bark... please refer to my last post and those pics if you just scanned the posts briefly.

I have an arborist coming to look at it in a couple of weeks, but in the mean time, should I spray the exposed area with an insecticide? I've had chlorpyrifos, lindane, diaznon and permethrin suggested. If that is okay to do, then should I put that mixture of diatomaceous earth, soft rock phosphate and manure compost over the area?

Thanxx again for any responses and I hope everyone has (had) a great weekend.

~A

 

[guymayor]

[ QUOTE ]
what I should do, if anything, with the exposed area where I peeled off the dead bark, as well as the area of galleries that extend beneath the thick living bark.

[/ QUOTE ]ok job on the excavation--nicking the bark a little but not bad. my advice is to finish excavating dead tissue with slender instrument like screwdriver. Get all soft wood outa there and you will get most bugs outa there. Finish with a jet from the garden hose.

Where you see holes, poke into them with an icepick, trying to stab the bug or at least ream the hole clean. then and only then can chemical control be efficiently applied. The great majority of the time you will get all the bugs by excavating the rot.

nice pics but it is the bottom of the wound that is most important to show. Also get the measurement of the wound and the circumference at that point. from the pics so far, rot is outpacing codit so you need to shift your focus away from bugs and out to the whole tree and longterm stability.

If the arborist who is coming out sells removal services, caveat emptor.

 

[mpriley02]

[ QUOTE ]
If the arborist who is coming out sells removal services, caveat emptor.


[/ QUOTE ]
True to a degree. There are plenty of us that do both preservation and removal work. In this case, multiple opinions should be gotten, especially if the first prognosis is negative.

Don't use that seal mixture until you have had qualified people look at your tree firsthand. No point in covering up the evidence before it can be assessed.

Get that mulch down, ensure proper water, maintain fertility (soil test), and keep watching the affected area as well as the crown as it leafs out.

 

[mpriley02]

I checked...you have multiple Certified Arborists and Board Certified Master Arborists in your area (Guy is a BCMA, so there's one great expert opinion for you who's already willing to come out). There are also 3 members of the American Society of Consulting Arborists within 50 miles (although no registered consulting arborists within 50 miles).

Go to the www.isa-arbor.com and www.asca-consultants.org to search for qualified people.

Yes, it may cost some $, but removal of a tree that large will be much, much more.

Don't forget to take your samples to your local extension office:

Contact Information
Office hours:
8:00 a.m.- 4:30 p.m. EST, Monday through Friday.

Phone: (804) 501-5160
Fax: (804) 501-5169

Physical Address:
Henrico Government Complex Human Services Building
8600 Dixon Powers Drive
Richmond, VA 23228

Mailing Address:
Henrico Extension Office
P.O. Box 27032
Richmond, VA 23273-7032

 

[guymayor]

Wow Mike you laid it all out there for adam and he left--information overload? holiday??

 

[mpriley02]

Hopefully he's using the info...

 

[adam12]

POOOFF!!!! I'm back. VERY BIG apology for disappearing for a while, gentlemen (and the occasional lady).

As if things werent already "tight" enough, I have had a terrible set-back here, in that I was laid-off from work about a month ago. Usually, this would not present a problem, because commercial land surveyors are usually in high demand, but, because of the economy, no one has been hiring locally. Fortunately, I did find a great new opportunity and will be re-employed in about a week.... whhewwww...

As for the Oak tree issue, as you might imagine, it fell to the "back burner" during this dilema. Eating and having electricity was a higher priority This is the first that I have been able to take a breath long enough to start thinking about the tree again. ..so... that having been said, I will do an inspection of the wound, the emergenge of the canopy, and take a few pitures at some point this weekend, then post them by Monday. As far as I can see from this window, the canopy looks good. But.. more details upon closer inspection. Tonight, I'm celebrating!!!

I am afraid that my absence may have earned the disinterest of those who had been advising me... and I'm very sorry to have bailed-out for a while.. bigger fish to deal with... but.. I'm back now, and I Hope that this forum can continue and Hopefully aid in the continuation of the much appreciated effort to help save this tree

~Adam

 

[adam12]

Ok.... rained all day Sunday and Monday, but it has started to clear up enough this afternoon to get out and look over the tree and take a photo. Unfortunately the photo isnt great because the sun is mostly behind the shot. Also, I had to reduce the size of the picture quite a bit to be able to meet the site criteria, so I hope it's not too small to be zoomed in on for better viewing. I can zoom in for seperate shots if it will help.

The emergence of leaves seems to be about on par with the rest of the larger oaks in the area, however, I am noticing that some branches are apparently dead. (I outlined the visible ones in red in the pic) The largest branch that isnt producing leaves is about 6" in diameter and is also one of the very lowest branches. Aside from that, the other branches are relatively small and occur sporradically.

Other than the canopy emergence, there really isnt anything new to report. The wound area that I excavated still looks the same. This upcoming weekend, I'm hoping to be able to scrounge up about $50 to go get a trailer full of mulch to spread around to the dripline, as advised.

 

[guymayor]

Good move on the mulch--4" or less, not on the trunk, and wide as you can.

Post a pic of the wound if you see any changes there.