How to preserve?

Winch

Winch

Location
Asheville, NC
I have a white oak tree, about 40" dbh, in a client's yard. Dual-stemmed, with a 10' long crack in it that you can see through, and nearly reaches the ground. Crack has been there for years.

They have had several opinions on this tree, ranging from removal (duh) to preservation options.

I will give them 3 options. One of them is serious reduction with cables. Like 1/3 of the top gone, a cable, and a brace. I wondered what anyone on here knows about hybrid systems. Something in the Sherrill catalog about using a cobra along with a static cable - never did that, but might if it's worthwhile.

Any wisdom in that? Is reduction necessary? I'll hear your opinions, whatever they are. Clients KNOW the tree is hazardous, I made no promises. They hardly can imagine life without this monster.

Here are some pictures!

Thanks!
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Re: Top to preserve?

I've done some hybrid systems in codom tops.

1 Like you, reduce the over-reaching limbs to reduce the load on the weak union.
2 Temporarily pull the Y together with come-along/ratchet strap
3 If needed, through bolt the trunks together followind ANSI A300 guidelines
4 If needed, through bolt/brace ABOVE the union
5 Using a cable as a flexible brace ABOVE the union is a good option. If you go too far above the union with a through bolt the tree can still flex enough to possible break the through bolt. think of bending a paper clip. Solid braces cannot flex! This is where the steel cable shines! It provides support but allows some rotating movement.
6 Install your choice of dynamic or static cable system to the remaining canopy.

My pictures of the hybrid installations are locked inside a frozen hard drive..dang :(
 
Re: Top to preserve?

Thank you Tom. I appreciate the insight. I normally get a consultant to back me up on these avant-garde preservation jobs, but they have done enough talking to enough experts, and want me to help them decide.

That's where Tbuzz comes in!
 
Re: Top to preserve?

I don't have any info on hybrid cable systems but would like to jump in on the reduction idea. Is the crack getting worse? "The crack has been there for years" Is there wound wood? I would think that IF the tree is getting a static support placed high enough in the tree and IF there is wound wood forming at the crack that has been there for years than little to no reduction is needed. Certainly not 1/3, if reduction is needed a 10% reduction should be enough to reduce leverage IMO. Keep in mind that I have not seen the tree and may have no idea what I am talking about in that regard. 1/3 reduction just sounds drastic to me when the tree has been standing for years with this defect.
 
Re: Top to preserve?

i concur w TOm. I have seen many trees with long vertical cracks. sometimes you can see they have split and "healed" several times.Bracing and cabling in combination w your reduction work is a solid plan. I would also take a less aggressive reduction approach, but would suggest subsequent pruning/inspection...etc.
 
Re: Top to preserve?

Agree with the above--lay off the saw until support is designed.

funny to hear support called "avant-garde", as it's been done over 100 years. Buy the BMP's and design it yourself--hiring consultants is often a waste. not that i mind people wasting money on me, but still...

hey wait i notice you are in asheville--i will be at the doubletree nov 18-20 and would be glad to sub out cabling/bracing gear and expertise/supervision/assuming the liability of design, all at an offer you and your client could not refuse.
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See last November's TCI mag, http://www.tcia.org/Digital_Magazine/PDFs/lowres/TCI_Mag_Nov10LR.pdf and

http://www.tcia.org/Digital_Magazine/PDFs/lowres/TCI_Mag_Nov10LR.pdf and

Page 26 here: http://www.treecareindustry.org/PDFs/TCI_Mag_Feb08_web1.pdf

publications are so nice for breaking the ice with clients. People see your name on the byline and it goes from price-shopping to Do It Now.
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mags like arbor age and tree svcs mag will work with you; just saying...

why is attaching pdfs and stuff such a pita here? dunloop and champ, let's upgrade soon huh?
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Re: Top to preserve?

Thanks for the offer, Guy, though I already own cabling gear, and have installed numerous cobras and static cables, as well as braces.

I merely called it avant-garde because the tree is already split, and using a hybrid i.e. static and dynamic system in the same tree seems a little new-agey. To me.

Have the BMPs. Looking for others' input on the hybrid system specifically, and also opinions on how much to cut.

I may not cut at all. Just looking for opinions.

Thanks!

btw, what are you going to be in town for, Guy?
 
Re: Top to preserve?

the nc writers network's fall mtg. is there; fun bunch.

but yea post the pics and no doubt you will get free design help here. On a white oak not sure how much top needs to be cabled but anyway--tom put a treesave dynamic in a maple for me that will come down due to rot; darn shame.

re opinions on how much to cut i would start at ZERO and go from there. Would still like to have a beer that weekend if you want to come by so pm if you want--maybe the doubletree has a double-trunked tree that needs our help!
 
Re: Top to preserve?

Okay, after many conversations, thought, and a revisit, I added some pictures and changed the name of this thread.

I will take a much lighter hand with the pruning option, and probably add a brace at the bottom and a cable just above the crack, maybe along with a Cobra near the top. That is, if the customer chooses that option.

They may just want me to remove it. We'll see. Tree is 41.5" dbh - i had guessed 40, confirmed on my revisit with a tape.

Thanks for sharing your opinions with me!
 
Re: Top to preserve?

I have done some cabling and bolting but I 'm no expert with the species and issues you have out east. Take this for what its worth...
The size and spread of the canopy in relation to the size of the two co-doms does not seem excessive in the images. I support those who suggest pruning less.
Also...targets? What could the tree fail on? Looks like it would not hit the house from the images.
Health and vigour of the tree? Is it still actively growing a lot every year? Not sure exactly what issues this raises wrt to cable/bolt design....things like wood flexibility vs brittleness. Strong growth may need regular pruning to keep it in line with the cable/bolt design? Things like that.
 
Re: Top to preserve?

"I would not want the liabilty of cabling that tree. If I remember one side was much smaller then the other...

Yes the biggest trunk seems to be the leaningest trunk. not an ideal situation, but manageable. re liability, disclaimers plus working to standard = effective

"go ahead a slam me for being conservative Guy

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Dude you are the total opposite of a conservative--you are a firebreathing radical anarchist--if you see no reasonable way to conserve that tree. A white oak, with no visible decay? You bid on its removal 2 yrs ago and wonder why they are still shopping????

A wild guess may be...They do NOT want to remove it! It's good they found Royce. The monkey wrench in this whole deal is the habit of free estimates. Clients should know the value of a paid assessment, someone to get up that thing and design a support system and specify pruning needs. On the clock.

If it's the tallest thing around I would not leave out the lightning system either.
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If you were to sub this assessment to a consultant, would they do an aerial inspection?
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