hacks and toppers

Sempervirens said:
Fascinating thing about the redwoods... ALL of the tallest ones appear to have lost their top at some point (e.g. they were naturally topped), most of them multiple times. When a redwood loses its top it responds by sending out multiple reiterated trunks to form a magnificent crown structure. And because these complex crown structures are so common in all of the tallest redwoods, it's entirely possible that it is utterly impossible for a redwood to reach its full height without having been "topped" one or more times during it's lifetime. Of course these are redwoods in nature. Can you imagine a full sized redwood (300+ feet) with hundreds of reiterated trunks in its crown in a neighborhood?
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Hey, Sempervirens! Nice first post! Way to revive a dead thread! Welcome to the TreeBuzz forum! I hope you stay awhile.

It would be really cool if someone had enough land to try to grow a redwood, along with the ability to try to feed and water it better than nature does itself, just to see how fast they could get it to grow big.

A public park might be a cool place for one.

Tim
 
I have seen a Coastal Redwood five feet in dia planted 45 years before. That was right over a tiled over drain ditch that carried water most of the year. Not sure of hight as I got there after the top came down on the house. But I would bet not more than 120 ft. Some growth rings varied as it went around the tree from 1/2 wide to 3/4 inch wide.

Another one was not in such ideal conditions but was known to the family to be 89 or 90 years old. Seven feet dia about 130 feet tall. That was pushing the house next door off its foundation.

Some may not know that a tree like that or logged 2nd growth trees from the forest have vary soft, light wood and can rot in as little as 8 years when put in the ground as a 4x4. Whereas old growth posts put in by old timers can last 60 years or more.
 
Most of my honey bee removals are form big old silvers with huge pockets of decay. Still bright green and full of leaves. Fortunately not a lot of severely topped ones around here. Weak sealers, crazy sprouters, cool trees and great for bees.
 
merle_nelson said:
I have seen a Coastal Redwood five feet in dia planted 45 years before. That was right over a tiled over drain ditch that carried water most of the year. Not sure of hight as I got there after the top came down on the house. But I would bet not more than 120 ft. Some growth rings varied as it went around the tree from 1/2 wide to 3/4 inch wide.

Another one was not in such ideal conditions but was known to the family to be 89 or 90 years old. Seven feet dia about 130 feet tall. That was pushing the house next door off its foundation.

Some may not know that a tree like that or logged 2nd growth trees from the forest have vary soft, light wood and can rot in as little as 8 years when put in the ground as a 4x4. Whereas old growth posts put in by old timers can last 60 years or more.
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Thanks for sharing the cool stories of those Coastal Redwoods, Merle. The first one you mentioned sounds like it was planted in ideal conditions, with the exception of being planted too close to a house. Well drained soil with plentiful water flowing underneath is what I thought I'd read were the conditions that exist in the Redwood forests, and this drainage ditch probably replicated that setup nicely.

Amazing that a tree can actually push a house off of its foundation, as stated in the 2nd example.

With regard to posts made from relatively younger trees, what do you think accounts for the difference in how long they last when compared to the ones made from old growth trees? Could it be the buildup of resins in the tree over time? Also, if you had to hazard a guess as to the age of those old growth trees when they were felled, what would you say? I'm not even sure what the potential lifespan of a redwood is.

Thanks in advance for any answers you choose to give.

Tim
 
I don't know about redwoods specifically, but around here all the oldtimers use woods locust (vs field locust) due to it's rot resistance. I am guessing the tighter grain resists decay better as maybe water has a tougher time finding its way in. Purely speculative...
 
TimBr said:
Hey, Sempervirens! Nice first post! Way to revive a dead thread! Welcome to the TreeBuzz forum! I hope you stay awhile.

It would be really cool if someone had enough land to try to grow a redwood, along with the ability to try to feed and water it better than nature does itself, just to see how fast they could get it to grow big.

A public park might be a cool place for one.

Tim
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Thanks for the welcome. I'll try to contribute where possible... I know a thing or two about redwoods.
 
TimBr said:
Thanks for sharing the cool stories of those Coastal Redwoods, Merle. The first one you mentioned sounds like it was planted in ideal conditions, with the exception of being planted too close to a house. Well drained soil with plentiful water flowing underneath is what I thought I'd read were the conditions that exist in the Redwood forests, and this drainage ditch probably replicated that setup nicely.

Amazing that a tree can actually push a house off of its foundation, as stated in the 2nd example.

With regard to posts made from relatively younger trees, what do you think accounts for the difference in how long they last when compared to the ones made from old growth trees? Could it be the buildup of resins in the tree over time? Also, if you had to hazard a guess as to the age of those old growth trees when they were felled, what would you say? I'm not even sure what the potential lifespan of a redwood is.

Thanks in advance for any answers you choose to give.

Tim
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Coastal redwoods can live 2,000 years or more. Hyperion (the tallest redwood at 379 feet) is estimated to be about 800 years old. Most coastal redwoods in neighborhoods are just "babies" compared to how big they will be in another 50 to 100 years.
 
Tim, I guess I was being dramatic - sorry. Tree pushing part of one wall off foundation.

Not sure the WHY of it with regard to redwood posts lasting longer. Tannins in redwoods are said to be a fire suppressant possibly that helps. Growth rings on old growth trees that grew up together are strikingly tight. If you google it I'm sure you can find end cut images that show that as well as tags going back through history with what was happening in the world at that time. Humbleing.

I know we can't rebuild a city out of redwood lumber (San Francisco after the 1906 earthquake and resulting fires) for at least another thousand years. (We definitely need to keep looking at and change what we are doing as humans - not be hacks and toppers as a species.)

I'm sure Sempervirens has accurate info as do others, I just have seen a few things and picked up a tidbit here or there that I thought might be of interest to some.
 
I love hearing any and all experiences with the Redwoods, as I've never been out west to be able to see them with my own eyes. It is just amazing to me that they've managed to survive this long, especially since it seems like the conditions necessary for their growth are limited to some fairly small geographical areas.

Believe it or not, I live in an area of northern Virginia that actually has quite a few Dawn Redwoods, which are the ones that don't become giants, but which are ancient, as a species. In my neighborhood alone there are about four or five of them, most about 100 feet tall or better, I'd guess. I think they may all have been distributed by the same guy, back in the mid 1960's or so, according to one old-timer neighbor.

I think I read that the Dawn Redwood pre-dates the dinosaurs, as a species.

I would love to see the giants with my own eyes. Maybe someday. For now, I have to be happy just getting to see some of the enormous oaks that I have access to.

Thanks for all of the comments.

Tim
 
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