fast forward pruning deux

That takes us back to the other video's comments. It's not what you take it's what you leaf.

The basics of tree biology are that a tree uses food energy from the sun. When you staple their stomachs some root dieback could coincide. The tree's defenses are weakened opening the door for parasites.
 
It may not be as lucrative to inform the client that their tree is in fine shape and needs no pruning. But that client will appreciate your honesty and call you back in most cases.

jomoco
 
223tree, I'm just curious what the specs were on the work order. How was it written up?
 
I'll say this first: I have no intent to be an antagonist here...

Was the removal of live wood just at your discretion or did the client present a change order, etc...?
 
Apical Meristem? Not quite.

Oceans, Its all at my discretion I guess. I know what the expectation and the instructions are and I deliver.

All, when your work order says 'Prune and thin', what do you do? What percentage of live foliage is acceptable?

Jomoco, The idea that I would tell a customer that their tree didnt need pruned, contradicting the salesman is ludicrous. You might enjoy such luxuries but I don't.
 
After removing dead wood, what is the reason for further pruning?
We hear 25% of crown can be pruned but the question is why?

I think removing live branches should only be done when making
clearance from obstacles or correcting form.
Lots of times we will also prune for views or "thinning" but that's
not really in the trees best interest, more for someone's idea of
what looks good.

So when it says "prune and thin" on the work order just prune
dead and remove any branches rubbing or in bad spots. After that
it's a make work project.
 
Just to clarify, "prune thin deadwood"...does that mean prune small diameter deadwood, or are those 3 different objectives?

The work order sounds a bit vague, but I'm only going by what you stated in the post.

I'm used to work orders with a great amount of detail including maximum cut diameter, % of canopy to maintain, retain interior growth, selection and training of sprouts, etc...

It seems like there were some lion tails created after some of the live wood was removed from the interior. I learned that thinning (if it's done at all) is usually done out at the branch ends while retaining interior growth.
 
223,
Thank you tons for posting. The lessons learned in a forum like this can affect positive changes in the industry throughout the world.

a) I think you meant the work order said "prune, thin, deadwood" with the commas is this correct? Actually, the word "prune" is a heavy word so maybe more appropriately "prune: thin & deadwood"?

b) There are various reasons for thinning, and even though many of the reasons are suspicious I wont sit here and second guess the salesman without knowing the details.

c) It is suggested that a good first step when thinning is to prune for structure, that is, those structural prunes become your first thinning cuts. It looks like you did at least one of those towards the center of the tree.

d) When thinning it is suggested that you try to focus on the outer crown at least equally, because this will increase vigor (girth) towards the base of the limbs, increasing overall strength.

e) This brings me to the topic of... Reductions (or proper outer thinning) of large spreading shade trees without a bucket. I recently watched one of Daniel's videos of a big tree he reduced with a bucket and I was thinking how it would take me forever to do the same on rope (if i could even get full access). But I don't like thinking there are things I can't do. Any tips?
 
A standard work order says
Name: ...
Address: ......
"1 Sycamore in back: Prune, thin, deadwood."
1 maple in front, prune thin deadwood. Install 1 cable to support cracked V-crotch
...
...

The expectation is to clear suckers from the main trunk and branch unions. Remover crossing or rubbing limbs, prune for structure and shape and remove any obvious deadwood.

Our work orders do not have maximum cuts or anything like that at all.

After the feedback from the last video I purposely pruned this very lightly. It might appear that there is some lions-tailing but I assure you there was not. The resolution of the image was downgraded, sacrificed for the wide angle of composition.

It may be difficult to see but towards the latter half of the video you see that I am much farther from the camera on the back half of the tree. Of the visible profile of the tree, it was almost twice as deep as it appears wide. With only minor thinning across the whole tree it greatly added to the overall transparency of the final images.

I am uploading a new version of the film, without a crop. If you pause it and look closely at the final product you can see many wisps and other interior foliage that was left untouched.

Heres a link to that version which should be online in 10 or 15 minutes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2T8QkJk5VGs&feature=youtu.be

I will probly delete the original cropped version because I wasnt happy with the degradation of the image. Its the same footage just a wider POV.
 
[ QUOTE ]

Jomoco, The idea that I would tell a customer that their tree didnt need pruned, contradicting the salesman is ludicrous. You might enjoy such luxuries but I don't.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's a sad reflection on the state our industry these days when doing what's best for the tree and client can be called either ludicrous or a luxury.

Simply because neither the salesman or the climber has the principled fortitude to put the tree's best interest as the primary goal of their work ethic, not to mention the client's best interest, doesn't make it any more palatable to an arborist that does, even if it means less money, or no money.

It's a matter of principle for the many arborists that put the tree's and client's best interests as their primary work ethic.

Don't get me wrong 223, I'll readily admit that the vast majority of companies I know of pull the same crap, and their salesmen are CA's to boot, chasing quotas and money like there's nothing more important. They don't care what time of year it is, or whether the tree's better off being left alone.

But I also know that there are a few companies, mostly family owned, that take their profession to heart and invariably do what's best for the tree regardless of consequence, and pride themselves on their consistent principled work ethic. I can usually spot their work just driving by and tell it was them by their high quality finished work product.

You invited members here to have at it, and I took you up on your offer. I apologize if has tweaked your beak mate, but it's my honest opinion that the tree in your vid would have been better left alone, and the client would be 450 bucks richer as well.

jomoco
 
Thanks for clarifying, 223tree. I hesitated to even post due to the distance of the video image, and the angle. I noticed the tree seemed quite "deep" in the first video...almost like a second tree.
 
You didnt upset me, and I appreciate the feedback.

What you have to realize is that I work for a corporation not a mom and pop tree service.

If I start telling the customers that the trees dont really need pruned I wont have a job for very long. Its bigger than a little quota. Its a whole company.

For the record my boss, second generation at our company; the salesman, 3rd generation aroborist; and the foreman, 30 years with the company (all 3 ISA CA's) all think I do a fine job pruning trees.

Maybe mounting my helmet cam on a tripod on the ground dosnt provide the best detail, or maybe none of us know squat; but we do over 100k a month in tree work so thats gotta count for something.
 
No offense but to me, it looked like a bit of a lion tail prune.
Not saying you can't or don't know how to properly prune.
Just saying I would have left a bit more. Only my opinion.

A company here, (that is full of CAs) lion tails all over the city.
Big company, I'm sure they do well. But what does that have to do
with the price of tea in china?
 
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