Conflicting rope sizes/ads

J

Joeybagodonuts

Participating member
Location
Boondocks
I title this as it is, expecting it to get derailed away from my more specific question at hand..

Tachyon... Wtf size is it.. Is it officially 11.1 or 11.5..? Half the ads i see say 11.1... & the other half say 11.5.. Considering the fact ropes are being manufacturered & marketed as very specific sizing for use in certain types of devices, I'd say the difference between the two sizes listed above would be rather important for the manufacturer/vendors to get right in their official literature.

Even if at this point it was years ago.. is this just a case of vendors not getting word of a change & updating ads to reflect that?

or

Seeing as a nominal jump from 11.1 to 11.5 would probably be hard to measure considering the inconsistencies in nominal sizing.. Are we sure they aren't making one of the color selections large/smaller for a perfected kit like a CE Climb? That doesn't make sense from a manufacturing stand point, but it wouldn't surprise me considering the one off stuff Teufelberger uses for their rope tools..

I've always thought of Tachyon as a 11.5 myself.. it wasn't until i sought to buy some that i started wondering wtf is what & why all the inconsistencies in listings.
 
Well.. with Fly.. it's labeled 11mm.. & i have never known it to be marketed as anything different.. whether that's a true diameter, idk.. however, I'd just have to say it's falling within that nominal size that works in the akimbo.. I own neither of them so I couldn't tell you what should or shouldn't work in it.

As far as the Tachyon though, depending on where you shop, it's been marketed as two different diameters for as long as ive been into new school gear.. I just want to know why.
 
I don't know why but I know it's not allowed here in Germany for use in treecare, because we have a minimum diameter requirement of 11.5, and Tachyon somehow doesn't meet that, although it is labeled as such.
 
Huh.. im suprised no one can answer this..

Also.. I'm now seeing it labled as 11.7 as well in Bartlettman's current catalog.. 11.1? 11.5? 11.7?? Wtf is it??
 
There are different blends and different standards of measurement.
In the Uk they require a nylon core for energy absorbing properties.
Some regulations require the rope to be measured under certain loading.
I’ve never came across it as being anything other than 11.7. It also fluffs up a bit under use.
 
Link: https://www.teufelberger.com/en/tachyon.html
Your best bet for info is to get it from the 'horses mouth' - not the resellers!

I would also comment that all devices made by the various manufacturers are fault tolerate to rope diameter variations. Plus/minus 0.5 mm is not going to be immediately fatal!

Consider also that over time, your rope will change (obviously it wont remain in its pristine virginal state for long). Also, depending on your body weight, this will cause the the rope to s-t-r-e-t-c-h... and as it stretches, it will alter its nominal cross-sectional profile.
 
I know it's not allowed here in Germany for use in treecare, because we have a minimum diameter requirement of 11.5
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I've been trying to find the actual legislation/law that clearly states this limitation.
Do you have a link where I can download the legislation please (bitter in Deutsch)?
 
evo said:
There are different blends and different standards of measurement.
Some regulations require the rope to be measured under certain loading.
I’ve never came across it as being anything other than 11.7. It also fluffs up a bit under use.
Click to expand...

Is what your saying, is, that tachyon in the uk could be a different blend than the one being sold here in the Usa or vice versa?

Also, your familiar with the 11.7mm sizing? The Bartlettman Catalog was the first i saw it as 11.7mm, hence my reason for coming back to this thread & posting today.

I will say however, i can see where you'd think it is a larger @ 11.7 because tachyon does indeed fluff up quite a bit.. especially when natural crotched or used like a work rope.

agent_smith said:
Link: https://www.teufelberger.com/en/tachyon.html
Your best bet for info is to get it from the 'horses mouth' - not the resellers!

I would also comment that all devices made by the various manufacturers are fault tolerate to rope diameter variations. Plus/minus 0.5 mm is not going to be immediately fatal!

Consider also that over time, your rope will change (obviously it wont remain in its pristine virginal state for long). Also, depending on your body weight, this will cause the the rope to s-t-r-e-t-c-h... and as it stretches, it will alter its nominal cross-sectional profile.
Click to expand...

Right right.. i understand all those variables.. trust me.. my bagodonuts stretches them out real good..lol.

Shhhhh! Don't tell anyone about that device tolerance!! :frenetico: :tonto: ;)

The issue I'm more so confronting is i swear i had seen it listed as 11.1mm straight from the horses mouth at one point, as well as what it says now, which is 11.5. Which could make sense if different measuring standards & blends were being used like Evo suggested.. but then you'd think you'd see that difference reflected across the board when shopping from vendors in those different countries.. you know what i mean?

I'd also think if it actually went up in size or something changed other than the printed size, you'd see that reflected in strengths.. But i haven't..

Maybe we'll just never know..lol.
 
Many vendors will have conflicting info regarding all gear and especially rope diameters.
Always go with the manufacturers info.
Personally I think tachyon is the same as fly and they are 11.5-11.7 mm. 11.1 maybe if their loaded because they do have considerable stretch.
 
Mowerr said:
Always go with the manufacturers info.
Click to expand...

Yes.. there is many vendors with conflicting info..

I agree with your comment about manufacturer.. my whole thing is, I've seen it listed as two different sizes by the manufacturer... 3 if you count vendors.. However, i think the way they are measured may account for the different sizes I've seen listed... Some internal process may have changed or something..
 
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Joeybagodonuts said:
Yes.. there is many vendors with conflicting info..

I agree with your comment about manufacturer.. my whole thing is, I've seen it listed as two different sizes by the manufacturer... 3 if you count vendors.. However, i think the way they are measured may account for the different sizes I've seen listed... Some internal process may have changed or something..
Click to expand...
Email the manufacturer...some are easier to contact than others but they do oftenly answer.
 
Many years ago New England Ropes introduced Safety Blue. The rope came in various colors and all white too. There was a visual difference in the diameter of the various ropes. Not only when brand new but also after the ropes were used for awhile

This was a mystery since all
Hads the same diameter and breaking strength specs

A mystery to be solved

At the. Ext Expo I spent some time at the NER booth getting the answers

The die used in the ropes changed the breaking strength so more fibers had to be added to maintain the same breaking strength. Mystery solved

Some vendors started publishing two diameter sizes for ropes. One is ‘sold as’ and the other is ‘actual’ diameter. Since diameters were linked to certain colors it makes sense that there are different sizes written.

There are probably other reasons for diameter discrepancies too

The systems we climb in now are very reactive and function differently using different cordage. We’re a longggggg way from natural crotches, three strand rope and tautlines. My guess is that most of the people who read this post have never climbed on natural fiber ropes etc. Millimeters make a difference now, they didn’t years ago
 
Thanks for the update Tom!!! Since you've been around the block & i got you here.. do you recall what I'm referencing with the Tachyon being listed as 11.1 on their site?

This isn't all in my head..i swear..lol.

What you said though makes complete sense & I've seen the rope scenarios before regarding dies/diameters & strength.. I've seen it as well with black clothing & fitment.
 
It must have taken NER awhile to figure out to add more material to the dyed ropes, I can remember the white being stronger than the ones with colors.
 
Am I the only one who thinks ISC should make a RopeWrench XL that is designed to work on larger ropes (1/2") better?

I can get it to work on a couple of 1/2" ropes... 12-strand, solid braid ropes... but it's just got too much friction for anything else I've got. Especially the kernmantle ropes.
 
JeffGu said:
Am I the only one who thinks ISC should make a RopeWrench XL that is designed to work on larger ropes (1/2") better?

I can get it to work on a couple of 1/2" ropes... 12-strand, solid braid ropes... but it's just got too much friction for anything else I've got. Especially the kernmantle ropes.
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I recall guys wanting it bigger for that and for the rig n wrench. They wouldn't have to make it much bigger, just big enough to run 11mm - 13.5 or 14mm?
Not many people climbing thicker than 14 I think? I could see just a little wider sheave and side plates with a bigger slick pin....might only be 40-60 grams heavier. But then again, how many guys are climbing SRS on thick rope? Yea some guys on here want it but there might not be enough demand out there though I could see it happening in the future as SRS gains more popularity.
I guess they already solved the bigger rig n wrench thing with the recent release of isc's improved version... I think it's bigger but if it is, maybe you could take the rope wrench off of that new rig n wrench isc just released? It looked like it could be taken apart but idk, maybe it has to be cut.
 
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